Philokalia Ministries

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part IV

It is impossible to capture in words the joy that sweeps over the heart when one comes to understand what St. John Climacus is revealing to us about the nature of humility. In this step, he strips away all of our limited, false, or distorted perceptions of humility and reveals it for what it is: a gift of God‘s own self. 
After reading Step 25 our understanding of humility is forever changed. We are shown that God reveals the nature of humility by revealing himself to us in his Son. “Humility is Christ’s spiritual doctrine,” St. John tells us.  “It is introduced into the inner chamber of the soul by those who are counted worthy of it. It cannot be defined by perceptible words.”  Rather, by the grace of God, the heart is purified of the passions and all impediments are removed to our receiving God’s gifts. One of the greatest of those gifts is humility. 
This virtue is a participation in the life of God. Whatever we might lose of honor or dignity in the world is nothing in comparison to the joy that Christ offers us through this virtue.  “He who humbles himself will be exalted”.  We may feel that we are falling into an abyss and losing our identity as we let go of our attachment to the things of this world. However, what we are falling into is actually the abyss of God‘s love. We are letting go of the false self in order that we might be immersed in He who is meaning, He who is truth, He who is reality! 
What joy should be ours, St. John tells us: “By this shall all men know that we are God’s disciples, not because the devils are subject to us, but because our names are written in the Heaven of Humility.”
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Text of chat during the group:
00:08:00 FrDavid Abernethy: page 185 number 32
 
00:12:50 Anthony Rago: Fr Christopher Zugger 2 Vol History of Byzantine Catholic Church published by Byzantine Seminary Press
 
00:34:18 Anthony Rago: This is where nietzche's emphasis of will is important for us
 
00:35:31 Louise: I resonate with this definition of humility - we owe everything to God. I resonate see less to humility as defined in the Evergetinos as a self-deprecation. The former focuses about God, while the latter focuses on self.
 
00:40:39 Daniel Allen: How does this conversation about self a basement and not hatred factor in with John talking about the prison
earlier?
 
00:50:50 Anthony Rago: Oh, so to grasp at humility - to be avaricious for it - is masochism?  For all good things are actually gifts,  not seized upon like a miser?
 
00:53:37 Jacqulyn: Amen!
 
00:57:22 Suzanne: According to this understanding, humility, like contemplation, requires that we wait for God. “Expect the Lord, do manfully, let thy heart take courage, and wait thou for the Lord.”
 
01:00:09 Sean: Are views, the like button and thumbs up the modern methods of mass vainglory?
 
01:03:27 mflory: I think the story about Symeon is from the Alphabetical Sayings of the Desert Fathers. In the translation that I have, he is called Simon.
 
01:03:44 Suzanne: Replying to "Are views, the like ..."
 
Yes!
 
01:03:58 Cindy Moran: I studied 3 yrs with Fr Van Kaam &  Dr susan Muto
 
01:05:40 Nypaver Clan: Is it open to the public now?
 
01:06:51 Cindy Moran: This is so exciting!!
 
01:07:04 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I think the story ab..." with 👍
 
01:13:18 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:30 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Father
 
01:13:31 Lorraine Green: God bless you, thank you Father
 
01:13:31 Louise: Thanks, Fr.!
 
01:13:38 Suzanne: Thank you
 
01:13:54 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father!
 
01:14:03 Victor Haburchak: Thanks
 
01:14:07 Cindy Moran: Great session!! Thank you Father!
 
01:14:11 Leilani Nemeroff: Thanks!
 
01:14:13 mflory: Thank you, Father
 
01:14:15 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis I, Part III and Hypothesis II, Part I

Once again, reading the fathers on humility is humbling. Gradually our eyes are opened to the nature and reality of virtue; not as human reason or understanding grasp, but as it has been revealed to us in Christ and through the gift of His Spirit. 
This stands forth most of all in thinking about humility among the virtues. It is not self hatred. It is not self contempt. It is living in He who is Truth. For this reason, both the Evergetinos and St. John Climacus describe humility as the “door to the kingdom” and to participation in the very glory of God. It is also for this reason that we discover that just as the proud feel satisfaction with honors so those who are humble of mind are especially thankful for the attacks and scorn which befall them in this world. 
Such things free us from illusion; not only the illusions we have about ourselves but also the illusions that others often form about us. To be thought of as virtuous and holy, when in reality one understands that all is Grace, can be the bitterest of things to swallow. To know oneself as loved with an everlasting love and having been shown the mercy of God makes the thought of evaluating oneself in any measure seem absurd.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:32 FrDavid Abernethy: page 13 Letter G - Volume 2
 
00:18:21 Nypaver Clan: What page?
 
00:42:31 Louise: The Catholic protagonist of the movie entitled ''A Hidden Life'' (2019), a true story, is a beautiful example of humility. In 1943, he did NOT justify why he preferred to be tortured and killed by the SS, his compatriots, than signing an oath to Hitler. His heart belonged to Jesus Christ. His wife, also devoted to Christ, supported his decision despite the difficult hardship this brought to her and her three children. Two contemporary unknown saints!
 
00:43:07 Adam Paige: Reacted to "The Catholic protago…" with ❤️
 
00:43:41 Michael Hinckley: Blessed Franz Jagerstatter
 
00:44:08 Michael Hinckley: yes that'shim
 
00:44:26 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Blessed Franz Jagers…" with 👌
 
00:58:19 Michael Hinckley: how much these storis show you must be prepared to be dressed down
 
00:58:20 Louise: Isn't the greatest test to stay facing praises?
 
01:01:26 Michael Hinckley: I can only imagine in the monastic life with having nothing of the world (clothes, possessions, etc.. ) that things like praise risks becoming currency.
 
01:08:06 Anthony Rago: Having lived in s Calvinist environment, alarm bells are going off in my head about this kind of humility.
 
01:08:42 Anthony Rago: We have to keep humility In  Tension with dignity.
 
01:08:54 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Having lived in s Ca…" with 😄
 
01:10:09 Sean: how often is one despised for humility vs. for being beyond  the pale of socially accepted behavior, crime, depravity etc. Equating the two seems difficult.
 
01:10:21 Michael Hinckley: Replying to "Having lived in s Ca..."
 
Great point!
 
01:10:22 Rebecca Thérèse: It's not easy to know the difference between heartfelt praise and flattery that's intended to manipulate so it's often better not to trust it
 
01:11:53 Michael Hinckley: One of the greatest deceptions is meekness equates weakness as apposed the fortitude.
 
01:12:51 Suzanne: I just read something today that said that the purer the heart, the more the soul sees God, and, the more it sees God, the more it understands its own wretchedness. This wretchedness is not a comparison with other men, but with the absolute purity of God.
 
01:15:25 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "It's not easy to kno..." with 👍
 
01:16:21 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "I just read somethin..." with
👍
 
01:17:17 Leilani Nemeroff: Dolores Hart 
https://vocal.media/viva/the-hollywood-actress-who-became-a-nun
 
01:17:37 Michael Hinckley: what was the book you mentioned again please
 
01:18:13 Suzanne: Great Stories tonight! Thank you!
 
01:18:35 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.
 
01:18:41 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:18:46 Louise: hanks!!!
 
01:18:56 Leilani Nemeroff: Thanks!
 
01:19:00 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:04 Michael Hinckley: good night all
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part III

The language that St. John Climacus uses to describe humility and its qualities is striking. In fact, in some ways it becomes unsettling. Unsettling - - because we often approach humility in an abstract fashion; as thinking little of ourselves, acknowledging our poverty and our sin. 
What we discover in John’s writing is that humility is of the very essence of God and how God has revealed himself to us. To grow in this virtue is to find ourselves entering into the abyss of God‘s love. As we fall in our own estimation, we are in reality falling into the love and mercy of God. St. John describes humility as the “door to the kingdom”. It is the same way that Christ describes himself. “I am the door.“ Christ is humility and to be conformed to him, to enter into a union of love with him, is to pass into the very pasture of paradise. 
Thus, to enter into the monastic life or the Christian life through any other door is to make ourselves thieves and robbers of our own life. In other words, it is to seek to seize for ourselves what only comes to us as a gift from God. While we were still enemies of God, he took our flesh and its burden upon himself, he humbled himself and became obedient in order that we might share in the fullness of his life. As those so redeemed, what other path could we dare travel?
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:42 FrDavid Abernethy: page 182
 
00:11:55 Suzanne: Amore, Amore!!!
 
00:28:12 Anthony Rago: Didn't St Paul say he didn't even judge himself?
 
00:35:38 Suzanne: But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true adorers shall adore the Father in spirit and in truth. For the Father also seeketh such to adore him.
 
00:36:17 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: The idea of humility of heart will be on the lips, reminds me that it seems to me when I say she or he or you "made me" angry, etc., it's not so much about the other but God shining the light on where He wants to work with me on humility or other aspects of theosis. No one made me but merely revealed where I need God's touch of humility or healing.
 
00:37:38 Jeff O.: Reacted to "The idea of humility..." with 👍
 
00:38:05 Suzanne: Reacted to "The idea of humility..." with ❤️
 
00:44:53 Suzanne: My take home from what I’ve studied with you so far, is that humility is a great grace, and a participation of God, and not something we can attain solely by our own effort. We do best to work to dispose ourselves to receive it.
 
00:47:03 Cindy Moran: How would St John Climacus advise us to ask for a raise?...Or just don't do it.
 
00:47:23 Rebecca Thérèse: The chasm between the holiness of God and fallen humanity is so great, it's impossible not to be humble once someone has perceived it
 
00:49:20 Suzanne: Reacted to "How would St John Cl..." with 😂
 
00:49:53 Cindy Moran: Yes I'm serious
 
00:49:55 Suzanne: Reacted to "The chasm between th..." with 👍
 
00:58:16 Anthony Rago: I believe a post Communion prayer by St Basil the Great, in the Teal Ruthenian Book, asks God that the Holy Body and Blood be for the healing of our feelings or emotions.
 
01:03:31 Sean: from St.Basil's post communion Prayer: O Lord who love us all, you died and rose for our sake; and you have given us these awesome and life-creating mysteries for the benefit and sanctification of our souls and bodies. Grant that they may bring about the healing of my soul and body; the defeat of every enemy; the enlightenment of the eyes of my heart; the calming of my thoughts and emotions; a faith that cannot be confounded; a love that does not pretend; a wisdom that overflows; the full observance of your commandments; the increase of your divine grace; and citizenship in your kingdom. Being preserved in your holiness by them, I will remember your love at all times.
 
01:05:09 Anthony Rago: Reacted to from St.Basil's post... with "❤️"
 
01:05:20 Sean: yes
 
01:05:33 Daniel Allen: I get seeing the good in others and not seeking to lift oneself up in comparison to others, but if we examine ourselves constantly or even too often, how do we avoid become neurotic? How do we examine ourselves constantly and remain gentle tand patient to ourselves?
 
01:06:03 Suzanne: I wonder if a sign of growing humility is the subsiding of hair trigger emotional reactions to things people say.
 
01:13:12 Ambrose Little, OP: From Unseen Warfare: ‘If a man does not rely on himself but puts his trust in God, when he falls he is not greatly surprised and is not overcome with excessive grief, for he knows that it is the result of his own impotence, and, above all, of the weakness of his trust in God. So his downfall increases his distrust of himself and makes him try all the harder to increase and deepen his humble trust in God.’
 
Seems like part of not getting down on ourselves and anxious/neurotic is accepting that we are weak and allowing God to fill our weakness with His power.
 
01:14:34 Suzanne: Reacted to "From Unseen Warfare:..." with ❤️
 
01:15:37 Cindy Moran: My apologies if my question seemed flippant about asking for a raise. I suppose that everyone knows now that I've never been able to do it in 60 years of my profession.
 
01:15:58 Jeff O.: Nicodemus of the Holy Mountain too
 
01:16:38 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father
 
01:18:09 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:18:16 Suzanne: Thank you, Father, for your help!
 
01:18:56 Cindy Moran: Good night to all.
 
01:18:59 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:00 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:19:06 mflory: Beautiful! Thank you!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis I, Part II

In hypothesis 1 of book 2 of The Evergetinos, we continue to hear one story after another of the humility of the fathers. Again and again, what we find emphasized is the willingness to set aside the self and the ego. We cling so fiercely to a sense of self-esteem and religious identity that gives us a sense of value or elevates us in the view of others. However, as with so many of the virtues, we find the monks, loving humility; pursuing it precisely because of what it produces within the soul and the freedom that it brings. 
What it produces is not the perfection of virtue as we understand it. By letting go of the self, Christ lifts us up to share in his life and glory. Thus, we find repeated stories of monks trying to hide themselves and any recognition of their holiness by fleeing the company of men. Yet, so often they find themselves discovered because the very glory of God shines forth from their countenance. 
The opposite of vice is not virtue, but rather Christ living within us. We put on Christ. We are conformed to him by Grace. If the world is attracted to anything, it is to that reality. The monks understood this. The only thing they feared was being drawn away from the path of humble obedience.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:09:58 Suzanne: I found the exact volume we're starting on kindle for $9.99
 
00:10:10 Steve Yu: Reacted to "I found the exact vo…" with 👍
 
00:10:22 Steve Yu: Excellent. Thank you!
 
00:10:53 Suzanne: I tried my mic. It doesn't work. Yes, Amazon kindle.
 
00:12:14 Suzanne: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZJGFSPL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_d_asin_title_o00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
00:12:45 Steve Yu: Reacted to "https://www.amazon.c…" with ❤️
 
00:31:44 Adam Paige: The Kindle version of the Evergetinos is a different translation. I believe this is the one Father is reading from: https://a.co/d/fcClhxD
 
00:32:38 Suzanne: Replying to "The Kindle version o..."
 
Yes, I enjoy it.
 
00:33:02 Suzanne: Reacted to "The Kindle version o..." with 👍
 
00:34:11 Rod Castillo: Litany of Humility
 
00:35:03 Suzanne: Card. Merry del Val
 
00:38:03 Rebecca Thérèse: When St John of the Cross was in the final weeks of his life he had to go from is hermitage to a monastery for them to take care of him. He chose to go to Ubeda rather than Baeza because he was known in Baeza and he didn't want the attention his holiness would attract there.
 
00:45:52 Suzanne: Roman Discipline, Order, and Common Sense. The Church understands both the power of the official worship of the Church and the feebleness of human nature.
 
01:08:44 Suzanne: Thank you, Father!
 
01:08:44 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:08:46 Lorraine Green: Thank you FAther
 
01:09:33 Louise: Thanks, Fr.
 
01:09:34 Adam Paige: Thanks you so much, Father !
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part II

It is a curious thing to be humbled by hearing a saint speak about humility. Yet, this is what happens. In and of itself, it reveals to us how far the human heart can be from grasping not only the nature of the virtue but what God has revealed to us in his only begotten Son. 
The Incarnation manifests to us this virtue in its full glory. The word of God, through whom all things have been created, becomes an infant, (infans), that is, “wordless one”. God draws back the veil in order that we might see and comprehend for ourselves the depth of His love and also the life and virtue that we are to embrace as those made in his image and likeness. To embrace Holy Humility, the very life of God, means to let go of our attachment to the things of this world or good deeds accomplished by our own hands. We begin to comprehend with greater clarity and firmness that all is Grace. 
To acknowledge this is to die to self and sin; it is, as John describes it, “reposing securely in the casket of modesty”. The humble heart becomes impervious and unmovable to the demons. As a quality of the Divine, it is not something that we can gauge in its perfection. John, however, works to help us understand its distinguishing characteristics.  One is struck by the fact that the humility of beginners is as different and distinct from the humility of the perfect as yeast and flour are from bread.  Purified by the fire of God‘s love it is freed from all of pride. This is something only God can reveal to us. 
God reveals himself to us in and through the gift of faith. We cannot approach him or the truth that he reveals with a consumerists mentality or seek to dissect these realities as we do with so many things in this world.  It is His light that reveals the depths of the human heart and it is His Spirit of Truth that draws us in the very depths of God.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:33 FrDavid Abernethy: page 181 number 4
 
00:09:25 David Swiderski: Have you heard about the Holy Resurrection Monestary in Wisconsin. They offer retreats but I just was wondering if they are worthwhile?
 
00:10:17 Jake: I was there for 3 days, it was a great retreat
 
00:14:07 Cindy Moran: Antiochian village?
 
00:36:57 Sharon Fisher: How does one try to take this step if a spouse or close friend doesn’t welcome the transformation we intend to make? You can’t just cut them off; you can be sincere in faith and not burden them with it until they see the (positive) change?
 
00:37:40 Carol: this discussion reminds me of Isadora from Evergetinos
 
00:38:32 Carol: and the indignities she embraced
 
00:38:58 Daniel Allen: It’s startling that the beginning is acceptance of indignity, I tend to see that as the end - or the perfected state. Yet, John says it is the first property. And that’s something.
 
00:39:52 Suzanne: Why is it that as long as we are alone with God at home, we maintain peace of soul and continuous prayer, but as soon as we get into conversations with others, our restraint goes out the window? For example, I got sucked into a discussion about politics earlier today, and I was unable to detect and prevent anger from arising inside me - ultimately my words took on an angry tone, and I said words I now regret. It’s like all I accomplished this morning with God was stolen from me. Basically, when tested, I fail.
 
00:40:38 Jeff O.: Reacted to "It’s startling that ..." with 👍
 
00:43:14 Suzanne: Replying to "It’s startling that ..."
 
Interesting.
 
00:43:29 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: It seems that within humility there is recognizing that God loves me, in a breathless way. When I'm around someone who genuinely loves me, I tend to love myself more when I'm with them. Feeling loved and loving myself without condemnation. it seems, helps me accept my weakness and need for God. Humility, then, becomes a natural honesty that helps me put down my defenses of my ego and let God do whatever is necessary to make me like Him and united to Him. Then, denying myself and carrying the cross I recognize to be therapeutic and seems to be the most reasonable and honest thing to do.
 
00:44:54 Sharon Fisher: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..."
 
Same here. Just recently, too. And frequently, too . . .
 
00:45:23 Anthony Rago: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..." 
 
 Suzanne, my studies ...
 
00:45:28 Daniel Allen: I haven’t read her diary but the diary of Elizabeth Liseur may be a good concrete example of what it looks like for one to be trying to live the faith while another one isn’t at all, and how to do that faithfully.
 
00:46:14 Suzanne: Reacted to "Same here. Just rece..." with ❤️
 
00:46:36 Suzanne: Reacted to "Suzanne, my studies ..." with ❤️
 
00:46:51 Anthony Rago: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..." 
 
 Suzanne I wouldn't t...
 
00:48:02 Suzanne: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..."
 
Fall, and get back up. Never stop.
 
00:52:04 Sharon Fisher: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..."
 
Proverbs 24:16!
 
00:55:28 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "Suzanne, my studies ..." with ❤️
 
00:55:37 Kevin Burke: Reacted to "Suzanne, my studies …" with ❤️
 
00:57:57 Suzanne: Reacted to "Proverbs 24:16!" with ❤️
 
00:59:18 Sharon Fisher: Replying to "How does one try to ..."
 
Followup to the discussion: “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and one’s foes will be members of one’s own household” (Matthew 10:34-36).
 
01:06:45 Sean: Stephen Hawking: "If we find the answer to that, it would be the ultimate triumph of human reason—for then we would know the mind of God." That always struck me as hubris.
 
01:07:15 Anthony Rago: Also in regard to not prying into mysteries, does this apply to the errors of heretics? And does it apply to the orthodox whose censures might have caused more harm than good (ex. The way we used anathema which had the effect of alienating whole peoples)?
 
01:09:51 Patrick Caruso: In step 25:7, he says the highest degree includes 'a constant desire to learn'. However in Step 24:29 he says 'If knowledge puffs up most people, simplicity and a lack of learning can perhaps in the same measure humble them.' Is he saying that the path of knowledge is to first learn to be simple through perhaps a lack of learning to bring about true knowledge via humility and only then will we be capable of a purified desire to learn?
 
01:12:53 Suzanne: I’ve been putting into practice lately, taking all my thoughts to God. It’s really powerful, and it’s leading me to actually speak with Him quietly and intimately about past sins. I sense that there is a deep pride that causes us to withdraw from His gaze, and refuse to reflect upon our sins in His holy sight. Yet He has shown me that He is ardently ready and willing to discuss my sin with me, and make me understand His Providence. This, I think, is going to lead to humility in my soul.
 
01:15:33 Anthony Rago: Reacted to I’ve been putting in... with "❤️"
 
01:15:50 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Reacted to "I’ve been putting in..." with ❤️
 
01:17:06 Suzanne: I so appreciate your help!
 
01:17:59 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father excellent session
 
01:18:03 Sean: prayers and gratitude Father
 
01:18:04 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father, good night
 
01:18:05 mflory: Thank you!
 
01:18:06 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:18:14 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:18:28 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:18:29 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father!
 
01:18:31 David Swiderski: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis I, Part I

We began this evening with page one of the second volume of The Evergetinos. In many ways, we pick up where we left off in the first volume with humility. However, we are given very explicit examples of those who are a model of the virtue. Perhaps it would be better said that they present us with an other-worldly manifestation of the virtue - the Holy Fool. 
Such individuals, so driven by the love for Christ, have set aside so completely self-esteem and reputation that their presence reveals the poverty,  inadequacy or complete lack of this holy virtue in others; especially those who deem themselves to be religious. 
To hear the stories of their lives almost knocks the wind out of the reader. The very presence of their sanctity brings down upon them the scorn and the abuse of others. They embody Christ’s teaching, “You will be hated by all because of my name.” They are hated because they embodied the humility of Christ, who counted reputation as nothing, emptied himself and became a servant, obedient unto death. 
It is hard to be in the presence of such individuals. Their hidden sanctity will still speak to the souls of those in their midst and provoke a reaction. The demons who guide and direct our thoughts will seek to make us mock and ridicule them and blind us to their true goodness. Thus, they provide us with a cautionary tale – that in our lesser moments we are capable of mocking the Lord in others, when we hold them in contempt. We are not so far from committing such unholy violence in our hearts, when we lose sight of the dignity of those around us.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:04:02 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you! 
I am driving right now.
 
00:11:45 Suzanne: Can hear a pin drop!
 
00:12:55 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Can hear a pin drop!" with 📌
 
00:13:16 Suzanne: Reacted to "Can hear a pin drop!" with ☺️
 
00:35:06 Rebecca Thérèse: The thing that people don't understand is that even if she had been a simpleton and their judgement of her was correct, they still shouldn't have treated her like that. "For inasmuch as you did it to the least of these..."
 
00:36:47 sharonfisher: It’s odd to me that the most holy among us behave this way.
 
00:36:57 Louise: Was she a victim soul?
 
00:39:02 maureencunningham: They did not see her
 
00:40:53 Suzanne: She reflected Christ's attribute of taking upon Himself the sins of mankind.
 
00:42:49 Lee Graham: No doubt, she forgave all those who abused her, lest they would have to live separated from God throughout eternity
 
00:43:16 sharonfisher: How is it that she feigned foolishness, 1st para. Was she testing them?
 
00:43:29 maureencunningham: Did the early church  run to be Marty
 
00:45:33 Anthony Rago: If she were foolish perhaps she was like Brother Juniper, companion of St Francis, very plain kind and simple. Perhaps even a little "touched" but that weakness became a strength by grace.
 
00:46:44 Suzanne: The Age of the Desert corresponds to the Age of Heresy, post persecution. It's a communal reparation.
 
00:49:10 sharonfisher: Reacted to "If she were foolish …" with ❤️
 
00:58:57 Sean: it would be hard to find someone who "longs to be loathed"...quite the opposite...
 
01:00:33 Rebecca Thérèse: The problem with being loathed is that people don't just loathe you and leave you alone, they're constantly bothering you with their loathing!
 
01:01:04 Suzanne: Reacted to "The problem with bei..." with ❤️
 
01:05:31 sharonfisher: I so agree, the West sometimes pays less attention to the saints than I would like. But in an effort to provide services that people (families) can actually attend, they have to cut somewhere.
 
01:07:37 Adam Paige: I think the West has emphasized the temporal cycle over the sanctoral cycle in recent years, but if the Office of Readings and the Martyrology could become more prevalent in the life of the church, that would go some way to helping
 
01:09:29 Anthony Rago: I was thinking this sounded like the charcoal saint!  Didn't Alexander also see Our Lady of Blachernae promising to protect the city from besieging barbarians?
 
01:11:54 Michael Hinckley: The West tends to get very Thomistic I believe.
 
01:13:16 Suzanne: Father, is it too late to ask a question about one of your FB posts?
 
01:13:37 Suzanne: You put up a quote from St. Symeon: “For unless a person has been trained in strict vigilance, so that when attacked by a flood of useless thoughts he tests and sifts them all … he is readily seduced in many unseen ways by the devil.” Presuming there is no human being available to train and guide you in learning to discipline your thoughts, how do you acquire this skill? Is there a book you can recommend that gives practical instruction on how to purify the thoughts?
 
01:14:17 sharonfisher: Reacted to "You put up a quote f…" with ❤️
 
01:14:18 Suzanne: LOL!
 
01:14:38 Jacqulyn: Reacted to "LOL!" with 👍
 
01:16:46 sharonfisher: Thank you for not rushing us through this and allowing
questions and discussion. So valuable!
 
01:17:01 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru..." with ☦️
 
01:17:16 Suzanne: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru..." with ❤️
 
01:17:30 Sean: the coal carrier reminds me the movie the island
 
01:17:48 maureencunningham: Thank You Blessing
 
01:17:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:53 Adam Paige: Reacted to "the coal carrier rem..." with 👍
 
01:17:54 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:17:58 Suzanne: Great meeting, and God bless you all!
 
01:18:00 Anthony Rago: Reacted to the coal carrier rem... with "👍"
 
01:18:03 Lorraine Green: Thank you, Father
 
01:18:17 sharonfisher: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru…" with ❤️
 
01:18:22 sharonfisher: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru…" with ☦️
 
01:18:40 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you.
 
01:19:06 sharonfisher: And to your spirit!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part IV and XXV: On Humility, Part I

Elder Porphyrios wrote “whoever wants to be a Christian must first become a poet”.  I mention this because the truth of it plays out in St. John’s writing tonight on humility. One indeed must become a poet - one who has the capacity to capture the deepest of mysteries with a few words. 
However, what we see in St. John’s writings is that even this capacity fails us when we begin to speak about “Holy Humility” - our call to participate in the very life and virtue of God;  “Learn from me, for I am meek and humble of heart.”We must become docile; that is, teachable in the most radical fashion. There must be a willingness on our part to let go of all conceit, prudence, and cunning. What is being spoken of is not simply a natural virtue, but a participation in the divine. It is that which can only be understood through experience. 
Such a path will always be challenging because it means letting go of our perception of reality, even religious reality. As God draws us into greater intimacy with himself, we are called to walk along the dark and obscure path of faith. This faith is a kind of knowing, but it is dark and obscure because it is beyond the limitations of intellect, reason, and imagination. To experience God “as he is in himself” means to let go of the boundaries, the foot holds, and the crutches that we have used to move forward in our understanding. It can be a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God: Fearful, precisely, because it means letting go of reality as we have known it. 
We can feel as though we are being brought to the edge of insanity and so St. John warns us that we must let go of prudence and its delusion. Prudence often masks a lack of courage. It is a human wisdom that tells us, warns us, not to go to extremes. In this sense, it is good. Yet, it can also be deadly to true faith. It can cripple us with fear and make us choose the path of safety, rather than entrusting ourselves wholly to God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:25 FrDavid Abernethy: Step 24 number 27 page 179
 
00:15:25 Suzanne: Moment of silence for that pie! Yum!!
 
00:15:32 Sean: home made cranberry is killer
 
00:15:44 Suzanne: Replying to "home made cranberry ..."
 
Just made mine!
 
00:31:20 Anthony Rago: The submission of Christians and Muslims who lost children recently in the Holy Land is a concrete example of carrying a cross.
 
00:32:13 Anthony Rago: They take it so graciously
 
00:40:34 Sharon Fisher: Could it be like being wishy-washy,  choosing no path?
 
00:41:02 Cindy Moran: My version reads "cleverness" instead of prudence
 
00:43:35 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: The reading on our calendar for today was to leave 99 to find one. That doesn't seem prudent
 
00:44:33 Carol: the widow with the 2 mites is imprudent too
 
00:57:50 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Over the years, I have at times imitated humility, but never acquired it. I depend on God to grant me humility as His gift and I hope asceticism and prayer helps me recognize and receive it.
 
01:00:48 Suzanne: Reacted to "Over the years, I ha..." with ❤️
 
01:01:10 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Sounds like you're saying becoming humble is becoming like Christ. Part of theosis.
 
01:01:13 Santiago Bua: Before humillity is a decision is a prayer for. Greetings from Argentina
 
01:01:16 Louise: Humility baffles me. Maybe humility is something like ''I do not know.
Only God knows.'' In contrast, pride would be ''I know better than God.''
 
01:02:48 Sam: This also reminds me of the need for humility acceptance of spiritual direction as many have fallen along the path to asceticism where pride cones and destroys the child like humility needed through spiritual direction and discernment  of guidance or advice
 
01:04:57 Sean: I practise humility e.g. stepping aside on a narrow walkng path, allowing the other to pass easily or waiting patiently in line saying the Jesus praayer and avoiding the thoughts of 'I'm in a hurry, come on'. I don't know if that makes me humble or making just faking it til i make it.
 
01:05:03 Alexandra K: You recognize your own pride when you are not looking for humility and it comes to you right in your face.
 
01:06:59 Christian Corulli: Are there some points in the spiritual life where we need a spiritual director to grow in humility further?
 
01:08:09 Louise: I am concerned about the diabolic trap of euthanasia offered to people in Canada. Individuals choosing ''medical assistance in dying'' or MAIDS, as part of the ''human dignity to chose,'' are basically saying to God, ''I decide when I die, not You! I chose not to suffer.'' I am afraid that they can only end up in hell. What would the Desert Fathers say?
 
01:13:49 Anthony Rago: I enjoy a particular craft. To really know it, I have to stop reading, stop being distracted by other crafts, and just work, interacting with the metal and tools. In experiencing this vocation it's an analogy to discovering God. You just have to quit the inaction, focus, and do it....and you grow without fixation on laws, on control, on growing.  You just do, and the beauty (& truth & goodness) comes.
 
01:16:53 Suzanne: Thank you, Father, and Happy Thanksgiving to all!
 
01:17:00 Sr Mary of our Divine Savior solt: Reacted to "Thank you, Father, a..." with 🙏🏼
 
01:17:08 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:17:21 sue and mark: Thank you.  Happy Thanksgiving.
 
01:17:41 mflory: Thank you!
 
01:17:42 Art: Happy Thanksgiving to all!
 
01:17:46 Sharon Fisher: And to your spirit! Thank you!!
 
01:17:55 Cindy Moran: Happy Thanksgiving Father! Thank you for great session
 

The Evergetinos - Conclusion of Volume One

Tonight we read the final hypotheses of the First Volume of the Evergetinos. From beginning to end the volume and its teachings are as challenging as they are beautiful. 
The focus this evening was on our attachment to the things of this world; whether those things be the praise of men or material objects and clothing. As always the fathers present us with the gospel in an unvarnished fashion. Their ability to touch upon the most subtle aspects of the passions and temptations is extraordinary. Even when we let go of material attachments we can cling to a kind of spiritual raiment. It takes a great deal of time and grace to break loose of the fetters that hold us; our desire for the pleasures of this world, both great and small. 
Even the monk can hold on to certain implements or clothing when there is no need for them other than the satisfaction that they offer in the possessing of them. Frugality and modesty in dress should be virtues that we love and cultivate. In a culture where there is an abundance of everything on demand. Our sharing in this has become habitual and it can be overwhelmingly difficult to overcome. What we see in the fathers is the constant reminder to adorn the soul. We are to store up treasure for ourselves in heaven.  It is  the poor that we have received that become our greatest advocates before the throne of God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:19:50 FrDavid Abernethy: page 414
 
00:36:13 Anthony Rago: The Island had a scene regarding the abbot having a coat of which he was too fond. He was eventually glad to be freed of that attachment by the "crazy" monk.
 
00:37:07 Suzanne: Over the course of my life, I have pretty much ruined every single thing I’ve ever put my hand to, because I simply cannot act except in order to draw praise from my performance. I’m aware of it, ashamed of it, but cannot put this passion to death. I don’t think I’ve ever employed a talent or ability with a pure intention.
 
00:37:52 Michael Hinckley: reminds me of the story of Alexander Magnus, once offered a cup of water in a time of dryness poured it out saying too much for one, not enough for many.
 
00:47:16 Anthony Rago: Replying to "Over the course of m..." 
 
 Perhaps "ruined" is ...
 
00:49:32 Suzanne: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
True, thank you.
 
00:50:09 Maureen Cunningham: Maybe they were not attached to anything in this world. And had no need for natural things . Only for the heavenly
 
00:50:51 Anthony Rago: Reacted to True, thank you. with "❤️"
 
00:51:37 Michael Hinckley: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
@Suzanne when we give thanks to others it is also an act of charity. Fr is right magnanimity is a gift we are given to excel, in an orderly fashion
 
00:51:40 Suzanne: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
Father has a good nous. He actually hit the nail on the head. 😇
 
00:52:22 Suzanne: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
Thank you, Michael.
 
01:00:36 Maureen Cunningham: I have a. Question when I went to Rome I
 
01:01:15 Michael Hinckley: are not robes (clothes) tools as well. serve purposes, again ordered fashion. That which we labor in is not the wedding garment
 
01:01:28 Anthony Rago: About not making things you see that you like ....I can see not doing this out of envy. But making something out of love for doing something good and beautiful, or because it is an inherent vocation is a good thing.  I started my hobby because I saw a beautiful repousse picture and I just
knew I had to make something like that.
 
01:01:29 Maureen Cunningham: Questions when I went to Rome Saint Peter allot beauty not what the desert Fathers had why so different
 
01:03:04 Suzanne: Replying to "are not robes (cloth..."
 
In this culture, dressing well is a good work.
 
01:04:08 Suzanne: Replying to "are not robes (cloth..."
 
Dress like a lady, etc.
 
01:11:39 Anthony Rago: We live in a society without these reminders and we are pagans
 
01:12:43 Anthony Rago: I mean, no icons, no images in public....and without these reminders we are pagans
 
01:13:12 Michael Hinckley: need to drop santa note all
 
01:13:38 Suzanne: Replying to "About not making thi..."
 
It's true freedom to make something beautiful with a pure heart.
 
01:15:05 Anthony Rago: Reacted to It's true freedom to... with "❤️"
 
01:19:59 Louise: My mother used to tell me, ''Louise, if you do something , do it well, as if you are doing it for God.'' I try, I try.
 
01:20:09 Suzanne: This is a multi-faceted issue. Communism deliberately destroys beauty, and Christendom has beautified every human art form. I believe that beauty is absolutely necessary for public order.
 
01:20:21 Suzanne: Reacted to "My mother used to te..." with ❤️
 
01:21:17 Suzanne: And there's nothing more beautiful than a priest or monk in habit/cassock.
 
01:21:28 Anthony Rago: Reacted to This is a multi-face... with "👍"
 
01:23:36 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "And there's nothing ..." with ❤️
 
01:26:35 Sean: I need it and I'm unworthy, that's an interesting take on things. Humility.
 
01:27:41 Paul: Wow Great Instruction !  Whats next?
 
01:28:33 Suzanne: Reacted to "Wow Great Instructio..." with 👍
 
01:29:45 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:30:20 Suzanne: Thank you so much!
 
01:30:20 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:30:30 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit! Thank you!
 
01:30:56 Louise: Yvette and Steve in my prayers.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part III

Guile.  It is rarely a word that is used in our day; nor one which we use to examine our own minds and hearts. Yet, as St. John describes it, guile has an impact upon our vision of life, God, ourselves, and others. Our vision becomes wholly distorted and perverted. While guile is a kind of intelligence - it is sly and cunning. Understanding, then, is used to manipulate others and circumstances for one’s own benefit. This in turn creates an aversion to humility and repentance. The pretense of religion and religiosity begins to prevail in a person’s life. Reverence and piety becomes a sham.  One becomes diabolical, and they use what is good in order to commit evil. It creates within the human heart a love of sin and so makes an individual the companion of the devil. 
We are to live upright lives; that is, we are stand upright with our eyes fixed forward toward the life that God has made possible for us. How often we choose the path of beasts; our eyes directed downwards towards the things of this world and the satisfaction of our own appetites. The mind and the heart become sick and incapable of seeing the truth - so deeply have they sunk into the abyss of this unholy cunning.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:17:26 Celine Fournier: Hello I am new to the zoom.
 
00:18:12 FrDavid Abernethy: page 178 para 20
 
00:18:44 Walter Viola: First time attending. Been following via YouTube for a year.
 
00:29:39 David Swiderski: Wouldnt this be what we call today sociopaths? Often highly intelligent but are only able to see this benefits me now and this does not. There is no empathy or concept of a right and wrong. Working with excecutives in several pulbic companies I am convinced this is abnormally high in that group.
 
00:30:46 Louise: Guile seems to be the modus vivendi of psychopaths, or people I call satanic souls.
 
00:30:59 Kevin Burke: What is meant by “hindrance to resurrection?”
 
00:31:19 sue and mark: how would gaslighters come into play with this?
 
00:31:20 Anthony Rago: Yesterdays Gospel mentioned guile. Christ addresses Nathaniel as an Israelite in whom is no guile, is that to show he was outstanding in a crowd of people with guile? Or is it that he is an excellent specimen of a crowd of honest people? And what does that have to do with sitting under the fig tree?
 
00:32:38 Louise: If you meet one, go away, leave the scene ASAP.
 
00:36:02 Louise: Could we say that the ones are the bad seeds, the weeds?
 
00:36:49 Louise: ''he guile ones''
 
00:38:17 Carol: do you think guile can exist more subtly in the hearts of all of us
 
00:39:38 Maureen Cunningham: Guile is when you plan to hurt another soul.
 
00:44:01 Daniel Allen: Not to change texts but this makes me think of the wisdom of St Isaac, “above all things love silence”. I tend to regret my words more than biting my tongue
 
00:44:37 Anthony Rago: This is why Jansenism was so serious. Pure as angels; Proud as devils
 
00:46:47 Maureen Cunningham: I did see that movie
 
00:47:06 Cindy Moran: Love that movie
 
00:48:32 Louise: What is the name again?
 
00:48:38 Cindy Moran: Jennifer Jones
 
00:48:40 Rod Castillo: Jennifer Jones
 
00:48:52 Rod Castillo: Song of Bernadette
 
01:00:30 Louise: Father, we lost you.
 
01:00:36 Cindy Moran: Frozen
 
01:03:09 David Swiderski: A priest in Spain explained this well to me. All churches are filled with stainglass windows of the saints who let the light of God enter into our lives. By struggling we slowly clean our own windows and dark stains to let the light of God to enter into this world and our communities.
 
01:17:26 Maureen Cunningham: If we are always looking at what is bad in us ? In the same way can gaze at how far we have come closer to Him
 
01:20:59 Cindy Moran: Fun fact: Jennifer Jones was married to movie mogul studio film executive David O. Selznick [Gone With the Wind] who was born here in Pittsburgh
 
01:21:08 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:28 Lorraine Green: Thank you very much, Father
 
01:21:37 sue and mark: Thank you
 
01:21:40 Celine Fournier: Thank you
 
01:21:49 Louise: Thanks, Fr.
 
01:22:23 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:22:24 mflory: Thanks you very much, Father!
 
01:22:31 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:22:41 David Swiderski: May God bless you father! Thank you.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLVI, Part I

We are drawing close to the end of the first volume of the Evergetinos. We’ve come to the end of a long journey; but in reality it’s just the beginning for us. The fathers began by having us meditate long upon repentance. This is the starting point. The turning from the self toward God for healing. 
Now at the conclusion of the volume our eyes gaze  upon the vision of humility. Again, it is not the humility of this world, but the humility of God. It is the humility of a love that empties itself in order to lift others out of their poverty and darkness. It is the love that thinks nothing of the self but seeks only the fulfillment the will of the beloved. 
We were shown this evening and number of aspect of this humility. The first is self-reproach. He who seeks the honor of God and finds his identity rooted in God is going to seek nothing of the honor and privileges of this world. We are reminded that “all flesh is as grass and all the glory of man as the flower of grass”. Everything within this world passes away. Why do we cling to it so tenaciously, and yet hold so little desire for the love that searches us out constantly. “Heart speaks to heart.” We let go of everything, including our own ego, in order that nothing might impede our capacity to hear God’s Word of Love.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:45:16 Sharon Fisher: Does that mean that if we were wholly aware of our faults and someone else called them out to us; we’d have already recognized and come to peace with them, and the accusation has no effect or sting?
 
00:48:43 Sharon Fisher: Turn the other cheek? Just allow them their feelings?
 
00:49:57 Steve Yu: Questions. Would praying for the spirit of repentance trigger humility? I ask because a constant state of humility seems like a difficult goal for me.
 
01:03:09 Suzanne: Just having to work in the world is a great opportunity to practice humility. How many times do we draw down upon ourselves the dislike and resentment of co-workers for no discernible reason?
 
01:14:35 Rory: Yes, 
heart speaking to heart
 
01:16:48 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:17:10 Sandy Nelson: Thank you
 
01:17:17 Suzanne: Thank you!
 
01:17:28 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:29 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!!
 
01:17:30 Lorraine Green: Thank you!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part II

To be simple, guileless, and meek are described by St. John as a habit of soul. Habits form deeply over the course of time and those that we form through negligence in our relationship with God are often very difficult to change. In fact, it would be better to say that they are changed only by the grace of God. 
What would our life look like if our speech was unpremeditated? What would our relationships look like if we were free from ulterior motives? To look upon others only with love and to live in the truth through humility is to reshape our experience and vision of reality. Suddenly we begin to see things (and more importantly others) as God sees them. We can look upon the other and be blind to their natural faults or defects as well as their sins. We return to a kind of holy innocence and purity of heart were we never lose sight of the beauty of God’s creation and most especially the beauty of the human person. To give oneself to God is to find within the capacity to give oneself to others, to love without measure, to serve without calculation. May God make it so!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:11:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 177 para 10
 
00:19:16 Victor Haburchak: Jesus was often angry with the Pharisees & scribes.
 
00:36:58 Kate : I find that my attempts at simplicity of life can become rather complex in trying to let go of things in my life.  I am flooded with distractions that “seem” necessary at the time but later I realize it was a temptation away from simplicity.  I find it hard to navigate towards simplicity.  The complexity of simplicity!
 
00:41:10 Lee Graham: Reacted to "I find that my attem…" with ❤️
 
00:43:48 Daniel Allen: That’s me I always want another book and read say 7 at a time. Then I read from St Isaac today that not every good book is beneficial for stillness (or simplicity). Even the good things, in this case a quest for knowledge and understanding, can actually be a distraction.
 
00:45:55 Kate : Thank you, Father!  You cut through the complexity for me.  Union with God.
 
00:46:07 Anthony Rago: Some of it you learn by experience
 
00:46:17 Jeff O.: Reacted to "That’s me I always w..." with 👍
 
00:46:34 Rory: Reacted to That’s me I always w... with "👍"
 
00:46:46 Rory: Reacted to Some of it you learn... with "👍"
 
00:47:34 Victor Haburchak: Reacted to "That’s me I always w…" with 👍
 
00:59:04 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: I've often been struck by this saying: It was said of Abba Macarius the Great that he became, according
to the writings, a god on earth, because in the way God protects the world, so Abba Macarius would hide the faults he saw as though he had not seen them, and the faults he heard about as though he had not heard of them.
Sayings of the Desert Fathers, Macari us the Egyptian 3 2 (PG 6 5 ,
273)
 
01:01:55 Daniel Allen: That’s strikingly beautiful
 
01:03:50 Victor Haburchak: Replying to "I've often been stru…"
Like the Seal of Confession
 
01:05:05 Victor Haburchak: My pastor often speaks about respecting boundaries
 
01:06:22 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I've often been stru..." with 💙
 
01:08:55 Victor Haburchak: Reacted to "I've often been stru…" with 💙
 
01:11:31 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:11:38 Victor Haburchak: Thanks!
 
01:11:44 Art: Thank you.
 
01:11:50 sue and mark: Thank you.
 
01:12:07 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father!
 
01:12:19 Maureen Cunningham: Blessings Praying  for all
 
01:12:24 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernathy!
 
01:12:28 Jeff O.: thank you!!
 
01:12:28 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:12:39 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part VIII

What a privilege it is to read the fathers! As we are being drawn by them into a deeper understanding of the virtue of humility, their vision of its beauty opens up before us. It is not something that only reveals the poverty of our sin and need for healing. Humility also reveals that we are made in the image and likeness of God. 
We should not see humility then from a negative perspective. It reveals also the highest truth about who we are as human beings. We are destined to share in the fullness of the life of God. Humility does begin by acknowledging the truth about ourselves and our need for healing. Over the course of time it is perfected by the struggles that we undergo and the great losses that we experience. Eventually, however, by the action of God’s grace it is brought to perfection and there exist within us no desire for sin and no lingering element of pride. We begin to see in that moment that humility is one of the qualities of our God. Suddenly our vision of the spiritual life changes. Everything is meant to draw us into the fullness of his life, virtue and love. Thanks be to God!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:33 Suzanne: Ave Maria!!
 
00:02:52 FrDavid Abernethy: Full of Grace
 
00:03:07 Suzanne: 😇
 
00:03:37 Suzanne: Father, did you get my email about St. Theophan series?
 
00:04:07 FrDavid Abernethy: Gee.  I don’t know.  I’ll have to go back and look.  So sorry
 
00:04:20 Suzanne: Ok!
 
00:04:34 FrDavid Abernethy: page 403 letter B
 
00:06:34 Suzanne: Father, have you seen the Russian movie, The Island?
 
00:06:57 Suzanne: I can't stop watching it!
 
00:08:03 Suzanne: I love the scene where he cures the attachments of the Abbot.
 
00:10:16 Suzanne: Mr. Yu, how is your wife?
 
00:32:33 Eric Ewanco: What does he mean by "discernment"? How might we wound the conscience of our neighbor?
 
00:34:05 Eric Ewanco: ok
 
00:36:52 Sean: what do you mean by to know the mind of God?
 
00:41:29 Louise: Does humility imply that I am ongoingly aware that I am necessarily defective and fallible, even if I try to be virtuous?
 
00:56:57 Suzanne: Lately I’ve been thinking more and more that we are infected with pride as children, by parents who show too much pride in our accomplishments or abilities. That’s where it begins, and the culture is more than happy to cement it into narcissism. It’s like an evil bond develops between affection and praise – so that affection is sought, not in accordance with nature and grace, but to satisfy pride. One’s heart contracts, no longer able to give itself in charity, because of the demands it places on others to give “excellence” it’s due.
 
00:58:33 Anthony Rago: This is soft. It's gentle.  It's like Dante's Paradise in which love is a force of motion.  I like this better than the way Roman Catholics of our time and country - not like the medievals like St Bernard - pass on the Faith.
 
01:00:11 sharonfisher: Re: earlier tonight - Opening the day with prayer and giving God first fruits is something I can relate to. To this point, I haven’t felt a purpose for early morning prayer (as opposed to prayer any other hour) — this resonates with me. I’m such a novice. Thank you!
 
01:00:35 Eric Ewanco: I agree with Suzanne. My mother was very proud of me, which fed my ego so much that my arrogance was off the charts. This alienated me from my peers and I never overcame it until high school. I literally didn't learn what the word "humble" meant until I was a teen. I loved her dearly but it was clearly deleterious. God saw fit that she passed away when I was 13, no doubt to spare me from the worst of it (that's terrible to say but as her son I can say it).
 
01:04:34 Lee Graham: When God reveals our defects of character, there  is no shame.
 
01:05:50 Suzanne: Father said, "Pride isolates." ABSOLUTELY!!
 
01:13:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂. Sorry I was so late, Zoom decided to update!
 
01:13:52 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:13:55 Lorraine Green: Thank you, Father
 
01:13:59 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:59 Suzanne: Thank you so much for these groups!
 

Searching the Depths of the Unconscious: The Desert Fathers and Psychoanalysis

A lecture presented at Duquesne University, in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, on Tuesday, October 24, 2023. Sponsored by the Department of Catholic Studies. 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part V and Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part I

“We are reading to fast!”  This is typically something that we would never say about our study groups. However, as we sit at the feet of St. John Climacus, we come to the realization that we could sit with a single saying for months on end and not fail to be nourished. 
We concluded our discussion of Step 23 and the difficulty with blasphemous thoughts. The evil one in his envy will seek to distract us with blasphemous thoughts that come like a flash of lightning before the mind. Our one response should be to lay this great burden upon the Lord, to entrust it to him, knowing that it comes not from our hearts but from the malice of the evil one. 
In Step 24 Saint John begins to discuss meekness, simplicity, and guilelessness. As Saint John begins to define it for us, we suddenly experience ourselves as moving too briskly. Meekness is an “unchangeable state of mind, a rock overlooking the sea of anger”. These thoughts alone are enough to alter our view of this great virtue. In the face of the chaos of living in a fallen world or the experience of the hatred and anger of others, meekness becomes a buttress that is unshakable and keeps us from being swept away by touchiness of mind or irritability of heart. Meekness creates the desire for simplicity; to create a place where the Lord will find rest within us. It allows us to maintain dominion over our heart by the simple act of mortifying the intellect and private judgment. In the weeks to come, may we linger along with these thoughts and come to desire this great virtue.
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:01:31 Suzanne: Hello! Happy Feast of All Saints!!
 
00:01:39 FrDavid Abernethy: to you as well!
 
00:01:54 FrDavid Abernethy: page 175 para 47
 
00:03:02 Suzanne: Look! The West gets it! From Vespers for All Saints:
 
00:03:09 Suzanne: Choréa casta vírginum,
Et quos erémus íncolas
Transmísit astris, cǽlitum
Locáte nos in sédibus.
 
00:03:52 Suzanne: And the Antiphon from the Magnifcat:
 
00:03:58 Suzanne: Ángeli, * Archángeli, Throni et Dominatiónes, Principátus et Potestátes, Virtútes cælórum, Chérubim atque Séraphim, Patriárchæ et Prophétæ, sancti legis Doctóres, Apóstoli, omnes Christi Mártyres, sancti Confessóres, Vírgines Dómini, Anachorítæ, Sanctíque omnes, intercédite pro nobis.
 
00:04:23 Sean: I tried to find it, it's out of 'print', no luck
 
00:06:44 Rachel: ty
 
00:09:26 FrDavid Abernethy: page 175 para 47
 
00:14:59 Art: Hello TY and same to you!
 
00:25:05 Louise: In my culture of origin, in Quebec, Canada, the French-Canadians swear with the names of God and the Eucharist, even psychologists in supervision with me. I ask them to not do so, but they relapse after a while. I thus decided to offer, inwardly, my apologies to Christ when they swear. Can I do something else?
 
00:25:55 Louise: I would have to exclude them all.
 
00:28:38 David Swiderski: When I lived in Spain the same issue most swears blasphemous. I was a teacher so just joked wow you need a thesaurs and have a limited and very poor vocabulary. It seemed to work and get a laugh.
 
00:31:47 Suzanne: equanimity
 
00:33:05 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Learn of Me, for I am meek and
humble in heart. It seems, then, that depending on Christ and becoming like Christ transforms us into being humble. So, it seems like it's part of the process of theosis. Is this so?
 
00:33:37 sharonfisher: How can insecurity be transformed to meekness? I guess I’m asking how to display the strength I feel in Jesus Christ, but the body belies.
 
00:34:30 Anthony Rago: Something that helps me deal with anger -and bad thoughts - is that any bad thought against a man really reflects on the Lord,  the ne Adanm. And any bad thought against a woman really reflects on our Lady, the ideal of a woman. I don't like that so it helps keep the interior life in check, to dash the infants of evil thoughts against the rocks.
 
00:38:02 sharonfisher: Replying to "How can insecurity b..."
 
Thank you - I think my question was more self-centered (ie, not appropriate!)
 
00:38:38 David Swiderski: On my door to my room I have a quote which I see when I leave and when I go to bed- (In loving one another, God in us made flesh). I often find I fall short at night but seem more careful the next day.
 
00:40:08 sharonfisher: Reacted to "On my door to my roo..." with ❤️
 
00:40:58 Daniel Allen: This conversation about meekness makes me think of “the kingdom of heaven suffers violence and the violent carry it away” which is very much not being a doormat. So it’s a matter of that violence being directed towards biting our own tongue (or what have you) and not against another.
 
00:45:09 Suzanne: Fr. Ripperger talks about demons putting negative perspectives on things that are pure illusions, and that get us angry.
 
00:46:38 Ashley Kaschl: To Suzanne’s point, it’s the cogitative power of the brain that Fr. R talks about, which makes associations, and is why asking
the Lord to protect our faculties is so important 😁
 
00:47:06 Suzanne: Amen Ashley!
 
00:49:31 sharonfisher: There, that is what I was trying to convey — I feel peace, but the passions and fears overtake. So how to slow or reduce the effect of the physical body that reacts. Apologies if I’m not clear.
 
00:51:28 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Meekness as an unmoveable rock, is strength, and much different than the connotation of meekness as self-effacement and highly flexible that I'm used to in our society. that's helpful
 
00:53:07 Louise: To help myself not engage in frustrations, angry reactions, etc. I am at times gently reminded by God (I believe) to say, ''May Thy will be done.'' If it comes from God, it is then OK by me.
 
00:53:52 sharonfisher: Reacted to "To help myself not e..." with ❤️
 
00:54:10 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: This strength makes more sense that Moses, the leader and prophet of Israel, could be called the meekest of men.
 
00:55:48 Suzanne: The actor who played Nectarios wonderfully portrayed the strain and violence - yet tempered with real interior peace and steadfastness - experienced in the practice of the virtue of meekness. Also the deep sadness that oppresses the soul in the face of sad injustice.
 
01:02:46 Anthony Rago: Italian temper here. I've literally seen red.
 
01:02:59 Suzanne: Reacted to "Italian temper here...." with 😂
 
01:03:29 Suzanne: Eh Rago!! Romano here!!
 
01:03:47 Anthony Rago: Reacted to Eh Rago!! Romano her... with "❤️"
 
01:10:11 Ashley Kaschl: I think I could contemplate these last handful of paragraphs for months if not years! But could we say that God’s meekness is also a facet of His mercy, too? To me, there seems to be not so much a reaching out from God in meekness but a “staying of His hand”, a resoluteness to endure our infidelity. If ever there was Someone worthy of being angry at being wronged, offended, or betrayed it is God and yet He waits and endures our wretchedness while not destroying us but offering us a way back to Him.
 
01:11:08 Suzanne: Reacted to "I think I could cont..." with ❤️
 
01:11:54 Lee Graham: Reacted to "I think I could cont…" with ❤️
 
01:14:49 Louise: Have a good ''All Saints Day''! Thanks Father!
 
01:15:13 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:20 Victor Haburchak: Thanks
 
01:15:20 Suzanne: Thank you so much for all the work you do!
 
01:15:24 David Swiderski: Thank you father! Have a blessed week!
 
01:15:35 sue and mark: thank you.
 
01:15:57 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:02 S Fisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:16:04 Jeff O.: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part VII

Coming towards the end of the first volume of the Evergetinos, it is clear that we are being nourished upon solid food. During these many weeks, the fathers have been leading us into a deeper understanding of the virtue of humility. It is one thing to understand the definition of humility; even something as clear as “truthful living”. However, it is only in the illustrative stories that the fathers give us that we move from the realm of imagination, personal judgment and reason to see this virtue with the eyes of faith. What we are called to is the perfect humility of Christ; he who sought only to do the will of his heavenly father. Christ sacrifices himself for the sake of love. What we see in the stories is the subtlety with which we focus upon the ego even as we pursue things that are religious. We are presented in particular with a powerful story about Saint Anthony the Great. He is told that a cobbler in the city has reached a level of greater sanctity than he has despite his ascetic rigors. This cobbler saw himself as the least of all the people in the entire city and the most worthy of condemnation and judgment by God. He would tell himself this in the morning and at night. What is significant about this is that he does not compare himself with any other person in acknowledging this truth. Looking at God he can only see his need for mercy and for complete gratitude. Yet Anthony as great as he was and having sacrificed so much still had a question within his heart. Is there anyone out there who has attained a level of greater sanctity? At that moment, Anthony turns his gaze away from God in order to compare himself with others. He loses sight, if only for a moment, of God. To gaze only upon God and his love drives out every element of ego. There is only Christ!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:08:36 FrDavid Abernethy: page 400 para 76
 
00:09:41 Suzanne: LOL!!!
 
00:41:23 sharonfisher: I hope everyone knows about the Orthodox Christian Prison Ministry. Poor or wayward folks that end up imprisoned could benefit so much from the work these folks do. I feel like the prison cell could be substitute for a monk’s cell or the isolation of the desert fathers. (Not sure where this fits in the discussion, but seems relevant.)
 
00:42:11 sharonfisher: AGREE!
 
00:43:54 Michael Hinckley: St Thomas Moore choose to see his cell in the tower as such I believe.
 
00:46:24 Suzanne: I think that I've actually made myself sick from self-reproach because of my past. Thirty years of extreme desolation has warped my perception of God's love for my soul. Self-reproach can be a form of self-torture. The desert fathers is the first time anything I've come across has given me courage.
 
00:48:00 Lee Graham: Hear, read, mark, learn, and inwardly digest.
 
01:12:13 Sean: Anthony's ego? gosh...he's called Great.
 
01:16:29 Sean: compare and despair
 
01:16:55 Steve Yu: Reacted to "compare and despair" with 👍
 
01:17:29 Maureen Cunningham: How do you not get into a self hate toward you life. did not the church father warn against self pity
 
01:18:46 Suzanne: Did you see the Russian movie, The Island, about the monk who was tortured by guilt, yet worked miracles?
 
01:19:17 Maureen Cunningham: Yes I saw movie wonderful
 
01:19:40 Suzanne: Incredible movie!
 
01:20:04 Nypaver Clan: Father, at the start of this discussion, you mentioned that the slightest turning toward God fills the heart with great Grace.  Likewise, the slightest turning away from God fills the heart with pride.
 
01:22:01 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you  Blessing prayers for you Father
 
01:22:09 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:22:12 Suzanne: Thank you so much!
 
01:22:13 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part IV

Pride destroys the one thing that the spiritual person should desire - the  unfailing light in the eye of the heart. The ascetic life seeks to remove every impediment to our loving God and being faithful to his will. The moment that we are filled with conceit or self-esteem, our souls, despite having the illusion of wealth, come to know the greatest poverty and darkness. What appears beautiful on the outside is often foul and rotting within. Saint John tells us that a “proud monk has no need of a devil, he has become a devil and enemy to himself.” And so for all of us: Pride undermines every virtue and makes us vulnerable to the most cruel of foes. One is exposed to blasphemous thoughts, even at the time of worship. If we are not constantly reproaching ourselves for our sin and acknowledging our poverty before God, then the enemy draws close and begins to play with the mind and the heart by placing suggestions before us. The presence of these thoughts can lead a person into great despair and make them want to give off of prayer and the participation in the holy mysteries. Therefore, John exhorts us to continue praying to the end and not give up the fight even when we feel overcome. Our prayer must become ever more constant until such thoughts cease.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:06 Suzanne: Ave Maria!!!
 
00:11:02 FrDavid Abernethy: 172 para 26
 
00:11:37 Suzanne: Is there a link for the readings?
 
00:24:33 Anthony Rago: This is funny. I grow pomegranates and am not great at knowing when they are ripe. The color can be deceitful to a "newbie."
 
00:26:59 Maureen Cunningham: Sounds like a sport who could be the strongest  but only spiritual
 
00:32:40 Michael Hinckley: happens to me all the time.
 
00:36:02 Maureen Cunningham: I love that movie so true
 
00:41:32 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: 77777777777777777777
 
00:41:37 sharonfisher: I think of Jimmy Carter (not an a political sense) and his acceptance of God to take him when it’s his time. He seems to feel very comfortable with his end.
 
00:42:57 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: This translation says:  The man ensnared by pride will need God's help, since man is of no use to him.
 
00:45:39 Maureen Cunningham: It the opposite of the Holy Family
 
01:04:07 Suzanne: Would kneeling be the Western counterpart to prostrations?
 
01:09:22 David Swiderski: The prostrations are common in Jewish prayer as well. Early Spanish traditions sometimes one lays face first in the form of a cross similar to priest when ordained
 
01:10:13 Suzanne: In the Eastern Catholic Church, do the faithful stand during the Liturgy?
 
01:10:30 Michael Hinckley: you see it at or in TLM parishes at confession
 
01:11:33 Maureen Cunningham: In the Orthodox Church in Hawaii you stand and they touch the floor many times
 
01:11:45 sue and mark: Depending on the Adoration Chapel, you can frequently  see people prostrating themselves
 
01:11:54 Suzanne: Very interesting, thank you!
 
01:12:20 Anonymous Sinner: The touching of the floor is a symbolic reminder that we are dust, and to dust we shall return, and that it is only by the grace of God that do so while praying Alleluia
 
01:12:53 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "The touching of the ..." with 👍
 
01:13:02 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:06 Louise: Thanks, Fr.!
 
01:13:07 David Swiderski: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:10 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!  Thank you!
 
01:13:21 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part VI

Is it possible for us to let go of our private judgment - to let ourselves be led by the Spirit of God into the Truth? As we read the teachings and the stories of the fathers on humility and how this virtue is embodied, the difficulty of letting go of our own perspective on virtue, and what it is must be abandoned. The virtue that we are called to is the virtue of Christ. Once again, we are not called simply to the perfection of natural virtue or what we can attain by human effort. It is by the grace of God alone that we can let go of self-esteem and ego. We will cling to these with fierceness despite having the truth set before our eyes; what we see on the Cross and receive in the Eucharist. We are unwilling to yield the things of this world for that which is eternal - for the pearl of great price.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:17:26 Anonymous Sinner: What page are we on?
 
00:18:20 Nypaver Clan: 397
 
00:18:54 Anonymous Sinner: Thank you!
 
00:19:24 Louise: It reminds me of the Orthodox priest whose life is depicted in the film entitled A Man of God in 2021.
 
00:19:35 Eric Ewanco: Today I was tempted to respond angrily to someone. I needed to hear this today.
 
00:21:21 Susanna Joy: Reacted to "397" with 👍
 
00:23:32 Susanna Joy: Replying to "Today I was tempted ..." 
 
 Lol...me too
 
00:25:36 Louise: Psychologically, forgiveness is seen as letting go of anger. Would you say that it is more than this?
 
00:29:18 Susanna Joy: I came home and a person who has been harrassing and unapologetic was sitting in my kitchen having a happy chat with my dearest friend here in the community. 
I could even get my tea water to boil...trying to let it go...
 
00:29:45 Susanna Joy: *could not even
 
00:30:18 Susanna Joy: Came straight to class
 
00:33:03 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.
 
00:35:58 Anonymous Sinner: Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with sighs too deep for words. And he who searches the hearts of men knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God.
 
00:36:05 Anonymous Sinner: Romans 8:26-27
 
00:42:20 sharonfisher: Do you have a good book reference for understanding spiritual warfare? Whether by the Holy Fathers or more current? I have a hard
time really getting the concept.
 
00:43:17 Louise: ''Dominion'' by Fr. Chad Ripperger explains spiritual warfare.
 
00:43:34 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "''Dominion'' by Fr. ..." with 👍🏼
 
00:44:19 sharonfisher: Replying to "''Dominion'' by Fr. ..."
 
🙂
 
00:44:38 Ashley Kaschl: “Discernment of Spirits” by Fr. Gallagher is good (it’s a purple book) 
 
And 
 
“Spiritual Warfare and The Discernment of Spirits” by Dan Burke
 
Those are good books to start with 🙏
 
00:45:33 Nypaver Clan: Was I the only one who thought the demon would enter the Elder since he said HE was the “goats”?
 
00:46:19 sharonfisher: Reacted to "“Discernment of Spir..." with 😃
 
00:47:18 Anonymous Sinner: I haven't read it, but my friend Paul Thigpen wrote the book "Manual For Spiritual Warfare", which I have heard is good
 
00:48:18 sharonfisher: Reacted to "I haven't read it, b..." with 🙂
 
00:48:52 Suzanne Romano: 😅
 
00:49:10 sharonfisher: Reacted to "😅" with 😂
 
00:57:08 Eric Ewanco: Are we sure he *didn't* commit the sin of fornication, in perhaps the sense of in his heart?
 
01:04:02 Louise: Was this man, by prostrating toward the offender, signifying his surrender to God's will?
 
01:04:38 sharonfisher: One of the reasons I haven’t been doing prostrations in prayer is that the area rug is knobby and hard on my knees. I need to rethink that reasoning . . .
 
01:05:13 linda murton: prostration becomes like the groaning when no words sufficed?
 
01:07:52 linda murton: groaning refered to Abba Siscoes earlier,
 
01:14:57 Susanna Joy: Thank yoiu, Father.🙏🏻
 
01:15:01 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:15:07 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:08 Suzanne Romano: Thank you!
 
01:15:35 Susanna Joy: Spirit will guide you
 
01:15:40 sharonfisher: Tell us about it next time!
 
01:15:41 Susanna Joy: Will be praying
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part III

As we pour through the sayings of Saint John Climacus about pride and overcoming pride, what we see in the Evergetinos and its teaching on humility we see now in the Ladder’s teaching on pride. We are circling around something greater than just an idea. We circle around pride and look at its many facets in order to see how subtle the temptations often are to embrace the illusion that this vice puts before us. The devil will use every means to pull us away from the truth and truthful living. Therefore, Saint John wants us to see every manifestation of the pride in order that we also might apply the remedies that the fathers put before us. What becomes clear is the need for constant vigilance. We must not allow ourselves to lose sight of God and his mercy and grace or our poverty and sin. Everything good comes to us from the hand of God, and there is nothing that we can attribute to ourselves that is enduring. Christ is truth and so we must strive throughout the course of our entire life to avoid all falsehood. We must not succumb to the father of lies and so find ourselves in his grip or being his plaything. May God be our strength and source of invincible peace.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:26:07 sharonfisher: Maybe a dumb question, but I think of deification as something we acquire (gifted) at the end times. Are we to strive for deification in this worldly life?
 
00:28:06 Victor: Some theologians speak of realized & future eschatology (now & future).
 
00:31:20 sharonfisher: Thank you!
 
00:42:18 Ashley Kaschl: Comment for paragraph #19: I think this can be really true if we aren’t discerning. For example, I’ll throw myself under the bus 😂 
 
A priest and I were talking recently about how, before bed, I’ll sometimes get “carried away” by higher, theological thoughts and inspirations. And I’ll be drawn out of rest and end up awake for hours longer than I planned, which obviously makes me tired for the responsibilities the next day. This priest said, “it sounds like a distraction or a temptation.” And I hadn’t thought about that because I didn’t think about these beautiful things or contemplation of deeper truths I didn’t have time for during the day as devils in disguise to keep me from sleep. 
 
So when I tested this, sure enough, they went away when I prayed for deliverance if these seemingly good things were actually temptations/distractions from the great good of getting enough sleep.
 
00:44:40 Art: The sacrifice of the mass is greater than the sacrifice of a martyr.
 
01:06:15 Daniel Allen: It’s kind of like Lot. He had to be dragged out of Sodom by God, and even then when told to flee to the hills he asked to flee instead to a smaller city.
 
01:07:20 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you. Have a good retreat again!🙂
 
01:07:56 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!! 🙏
 
01:07:56 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Blessing Father keep you in prayer I love the quotes on face book and instagram Thanks
 
01:08:07 sharonfisher: And with your spirit! I so appreciate your ability to bring clarity to the readings!
 
01:08:48 David Swiderski: Thank you father God bless you on the retreat!
 
01:09:03 David Swiderski: Thank you father God bless you on the retreat!
 
01:09:10 David Swiderski: Thank you father God bless you on the retreat!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part V

We were turn once again to the most important of virtues - humility. Despite the repeated sayings about humility and the many illustrative stories, one does not have a sense of the “same thing” being said over and over again. Rather, humility is like a precious gem. Through the writings and the sayings of the Fathers we revolve around it, allowing the light of Christ to illuminate every facet of this virtue. The Fathers want us to understand that even our virtue must be perfected by the grace of God. It is precisely this reality that we see manifest in the struggles of the Fathers to obtain it. It is so precious that one should be willing, as it were, to sell all to possess it. In this sense, humility is a willingness to let go of the self, the ego, in order that we might keep our minds and our hearts fixed upon Christ. It is by His grace alone that we are saved and it is by imitating His humility that the demons are overcome.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:39:05 Louise: Could you talk about the fear of God versus being in love with God?
 
00:49:39 Louise: Could we say that someone under a spell can be blinded by the spell of the demon so to have pride regarding how one is great in serving the demon without realizing it?
 
01:03:13 Louise: St. John says, "Do not love the world or anything in the world"? St. James seems to take it a step further when he writes, "Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God." St. John also says, "We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one."
 
01:13:59 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:35 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Thank you🙂" with 👍
 
01:14:51 sharonfisher: And with your spirit! Thank you!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part II

“An arrogant man yearns for authority; he cannot, or rather, does not wish to perish utterly.“ In many ways, this one saying sums up our reflection this evening. When pride takes hold of an individual soul, one begins to move further and further away from God. Rather than “perish utterly” - that is, die to self and sin - one drives God from the mind and heart. The capacity to love diminishes, the desire to humiliate others increases, and, finally, our perception of reality is distorted beyond measure. It is for this reason that Saint John entitles this step “On Mad Pride“.  The more that we turn away from He who is the Way, the Truth and the Life, the more that we turn away from He who is Meaning, the more we lose touch with reality. We become like the one who fell from heaven, the father of lies. We are drawn into the same darkness and inability to see not only the truth about our souls but also to see the depths of God’s love and compassion.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:44 FrDavid Abernethy: page 170 para number 2
 
00:15:21 TFredman: Have you heard from Ren? How is she doing?
 
00:16:21 Lee Graham: You will be greatly missed next week, you will be in my prayers.
 
00:43:33 David Swiderski: John mentions Gluttony is the prince of passions but also places Pride as a key passion are they both keys of all the passions? Is one more principal.
 
01:05:04 Louise: Therefore, how to understand one's desire to become competent, as competent as can be, to do things right?
 
01:14:05 Louise: So to become competent for Christ, to serve Christ in this world.
 
01:16:27 Victor: Thanks!
 
01:18:02 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...will be praying...
 
01:18:13 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:18:13 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:18:18 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂Have a good retreat
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part IV

How beautiful is the path that the Lord sets before us to draw us to Himself. Its beauty is rooted in the fact that it is the path that He took toward us. God reveals himself, He draws back to the veil, and shows us the depth of his humility, love and compassion. What we find in the desert fathers and in their sayings is a portrait of the gospels; more specifically a portrait of Christ himself - the humble crucified One.
We should never fear humility but rather gravitate towards it. It is something that we should love and cultivate precisely, because we know that it is part of the nature of God and His love, and that it unites us to Him. Whatever truth we acknowledge about ourselves, no matter how dark, it unites us to He who is Truth. This is the pearl of great price! It is the virtue that we should desire above all things and guard and protect as most precious.
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:11:11 sue and mark: car caravan
 
00:12:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 391 para 31
 
00:28:48 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: 34 reminded me of a statement that often strikes me:
 
00:28:59 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: It was said of Abba Macarius the Great that he became, according
to the writings, a god on earth, because in the way God protects
the world, so Abba Macarius would hide the faults he saw as
though he had not seen them, and the faults he heard about as
though he had not heard of them.
Sayings of the Desert Fathers
 
00:36:59 Maureen Cunningham: Tree in Garden , once they ate they knew and then hid from God.
 
01:06:08 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Listening to this talk of humility, I wonder. I can at times act humbly on the outside, but I don't know what humility feels like. I'm not sure how one acquires humility on the inside, or lives consistently this way. Is becoming humble becoming like God? The only thought that comes to me is to be still and stare at God until He Himself ignites or consumes me. I don't think I know how to be humble
 
01:12:19 sue and mark: thank you Fr. abernethy.
 
01:12:20 Rachel: Thank you!
 
01:12:30 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXII: On Vainglory, Part IV, and On Pride, Part I

Rarely do we acknowledge the extraordinary gift that God gave to his Church in the Desert fathers. It is precisely through their “living martyrdom” - their dying to self, to sin, and to the world, that they are able to guide us through the trials and tribulations of spiritual warfare. Their perception of our vulnerabilities as human beings was very acute. Humbled over and over again and acknowledging their sin and poverty before God, they came to see the many ways that the vices manifest themselves as well as the remedies to bring healing. The spirituality that arises out of desert monasticism is not one among many. It is “the spirituality” of the church. It is a manifestation of the deepest exercise of faith. In this the desert fathers became living icons of the gospel. For this reason, it is often acknowledged that “wherever we see renewal within the life of the church, there are the desert fathers.”  Saint John Climacus draws us into where the fiercest warfare takes place – the human ego. We often seek to place the self at the center of existence and so open ourselves up to the spirit of vainglory and pride. When these take hold of us they close the door to repentance and healing. Furthermore, St. John tells us, they lead to a kind of “madness”. They distort our perception of reality. We can no longer see God or the truth about ourselves. And we see others not as the object of our love and compassion. Rather we become pitiless inquisitors and inhuman judges. Thus, it has often been said that a prideful monk has no need to be attacked by the demons because he has become a demon himself. This is true for all of us.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:05:03 FrDavid Abernethy: page 169 paragraph 40
 
00:25:10 Louise: Could we say that pride usually prevents people to acknowledge that they are under a spell or diabolically influenced, while it is obvious to others given the incongruence of their behaviors?
 
00:37:06 Anthony: It sounds then that the bad things attributed to Vatican 2 is an example of poor formation.
 
00:44:53 Louise: Affirmation ''therapy'' is not psychotherapy, but an obligation from the
psychological boards. Otherwise, a psychologist looses his or her license.
 
00:45:37 Louise: This affirmation therapy applies to transgenderism.
 
00:46:36 sue and mark: louise, interesting.  I had not heard that.  thank you
 
00:48:31 David Swiderski: The book Orthodox Psychotherapy the science of the Fathers is very interesting on thsi subject.
 
01:04:12 David Swiderski: I loved that about Mother Teresa . A penicl in the hand of God. Not the hand not the author of what flowed through her.
 
01:10:07 Michael Hinckley: I always saw San Filippo as a precursor to Padre Pio
 
01:11:09 Anthony: When we crave entertainment like novels or movies - orvevrn news and talk radio - we open the door to the thoughts of others, to tell a story, and often the storytelling and acting makes vices into virtues. Even if it's not overt, the presentation undermines right thinking and behavior and causes future problems.
 
01:11:52 sue and mark: Reacted to "When we crave entert..." with 👍
 
01:12:22 Lee Graham: Reacted to "When we crave entert…" with 👍
 
01:13:07 Lee Graham: Reacted to "I loved that about M…" with ❤️
 
01:22:17 Rachel: That is so true!!
 
01:22:36 Rachel: Haha
 
01:23:39 Rachel: Thank you!
 
01:23:41 David Swiderski: Thank you Father
 
01:23:48 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:23:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:23:52 sue and mark: good night.  thank you
 
01:23:53 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:23:55 Michael Hinckley: Santa Notte
 
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part III

Synopsis of Tonight’s Group on The Evergetinos:
We often hear the question: “How would you describe the taste of honey to another who has never had it or the taste of a pear or its texture?” We might ask the very same questions about the virtues and in particular that of humility. How do we describe something that another has never tasted or that we have barely tasted ourselves? More importantly, how do we describe something that expresses not natural virtue, but the virtue of Christ himself - that describes the Divine life. 
What is so striking about the desert fathers’ writing is that it brings the gospel alive. It becomes impossible for us to make the words that we hear as flat as the page upon which they are written. Suddenly they become embodied in a rich and powerful way through the lives of the Saints. They beckon us, like Christ, to take hold of what endures, to thirst for the love and virtue that leads us to intimacy with God, and to experience the true joy of the kingdom.
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00:06:43 Paul: Hello
 
00:26:06 Louise: I do not know how to address with humility the fact that a friend has a picture of Moloch on the wall behind her when we talk on Zoom. She has always been fascinated by horror movies. I am worried that she worships the demonic, unconsciously. She says that she does not believe in God and does not know what happens after death, but she believes in the paranormal. She knows my devotion to Jesus Christ. Do you have an idea, Fr. David?
 
01:09:57 Lorraine Green: Thank you!
 
01:10:03 Sheila Applegate: Thanks Father!
 
01:10:05 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:10:29 Alexandra K: Thank you Father!
 
01:10:54 Noha’s iPad: Thanks 🙏
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXII: On Vainglory, Part III

One of the prophets writes: “the human heart is a treacherous thing, who can endure it!“ We begin to see the truth of this statement or more accurately the truth that is behind it. The spiritual battle that we engage in with our passions and our thoughts is often dogged by a kind of diabolical intrigue. The devil is relentless and unresting. He can manipulate us in such a way that he makes us desire to put ourselves forward, to put ourselves into the light; convincing us that to do so will draw people to greater faith. 
 
The evil one acts with a kind of patience; he will begin to work on us slowly. He begins by making us enamored with our own natural gifts and abilities. In this way he makes us unfaithful in small things; we attribute natural gifts to ourselves rather than simply being grateful for the things of God has given to us. Such infidelity grows over the course of time as well as the complexity of the evil one’s manipulation. He can begin to work on us from multiple angles, if you will. He can place scripture in our mind to do battle with the temptation of one demon, but then make us feel proud of our ability to do so. 
 
Therefore, St. John tells us that we must begin the road to freedom from vainglory by remaining silent about ourselves and our accomplishments. We must learn to love to be dishonored. To be a Christian in this world is to be mocked and held in contempt. We must set aside our tendency to wear a mask that makes us more acceptable in the eyes of the world. We may put on the appearance of virtue yet always within the limits of what our world finds acceptable.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:24:24 susan: seeing yourself as a debtor is truth
 
00:24:35 Rachel: John 4"34
 
00:30:18 Art: I recently heard in a homily: The Gospel teaches us not to be like the Pharisee who says, ‘thank you God that I’m not like the Publican’. 
But we must be careful that in our heart of hearts we’re not also saying, “Thank you God, I’m not like that Pharisee.”
Vainglory can strike from any side.
 
00:31:02 Rachel: Reacted to "I recently heard i..." with ❤️
 
00:31:42 Eric Ewanco: One method of evangelization is to share from our own experience instead of preaching what one should and should not do, since no one can argue with our experience and it's a more non-threatening way to share
 
00:31:59 Eric Ewanco: How would we evangelize with what you said in mind?
 
00:44:58 Ambrose Little, OP: The text here (#34) specifically speaks of displaying virtues. It’s akin to Christ’s exhortation to not be showy when fasting, or not be showy when giving—do not let the right hand know what the left is doing. I don’t see it speaking against witnessing what God has done for us.
 
00:47:39 Lawrence Martone: Regarding self-revelation, there’s the point that the focus should be on God and not ourselves, when it is expressed.
 
00:50:00 sharonfisher: Purity in motivations.
 
00:51:46 Anthony: There might be another vainglory....to magnify to yourself evil mental motions and temptations and fixate on What have I done? This is also pharisaical.
 
00:53:51 Lawrence Martone: “Our real business is to allow God to shed His light through us, and since the light belongs to Him, He will know where to focus it and to what extent.  Our endeavor should be to make ourselves transparent so as not to eclipse His brilliance.”
                                                                           Erasmo Leiva-Merikais on Matthew 5:14 ff.
 
 
It seems to me that humility, as was mentioned earlier in Step 22, is essential to this endeavor of making ourselves transparent.
 
01:05:17 Cindy Moran: How does what John tells us apply to being a fool for Christ...
 
01:07:09 Cindy Moran: You just answered me.
 
01:07:11 David Swiderski: The Island is a movie from 2006 that demonstrates a fool for christ
 
01:07:25 Rachel: I wonder if this movement towards simplifying is somewhere where we have to be led by our Lord. Since it is an abyss we cant know how to navigate our way through. We can ' think" we know what kinds of dishonor we can profit by but it seems we have to wait to be led by only seeking God's will and what He reveals to us
 
01:10:33 Maureen Cunningham: ThankYou
 
01:10:35 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father!
 
01:10:48 Eric Ewanco: One year anniversary of your appointment!
 
01:11:21 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:11:22 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:11:24 Louise: Thank you!
 
01:11:25 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:11:29 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 
01:11:32 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:11:33 Bonnie Lewis: Thanks be to God!  Thank you Father.
 
01:11:39 sue and mark: Thank you Fr. Abernethy!  God bless
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part II

Humility is above all the other virtues.” Living in the truth allows for the most important thing to emerge in a person’s life – repentance. When we see and acknowledge the nature of our actions and our thoughts and we bring them before God, it is then that He can heal us and make us whole. 
The struggle to do this, however, can be great. There’s always part of us that wants to hold on to the illusion of creating our own dignity and identity. Humility compels us to acknowledge that all things begin and end with God. We certainly have our role to play in the Divine drama; however, one can have all the virtues and appear to be saintly, yet if they are lacking the virtue of humility, none of these virtues will bear fruit. If an individual is like the publican coming to the temple beating his breast and realizing that there is no virtue in him at all immediately he is justified in the eyes of God. He’s let go of the lie of the Evil One. 
We cannot take for ourselves what belongs to God alone. He is life and love and truth, and it is his mercy that allows us to participate in this reality. To be humble, to see ourselves as nothing of note, cost very little but promises everything in return.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:08:27 FrDavid Abernethy: page 387
 
00:08:31 FrDavid Abernethy: no. 7
 
00:12:07 Jason: Good evening Fr and everyone
 
00:34:42 sharonfisher: But doesn’t opening with “How’s your prayer life?” seem like a pre-judgment that they aren’t attentive enough? “How are you doing?” can be sincere, but also allow individuals to share at their own comfort level. (Not trying to be contrary, but I maintain my own faith and am wary of coming across as holier-than-thou. Sorry, late comment to last segment.)
 
00:36:14 sharonfisher: I see - thank you!
 
01:03:43 alexandramucerino: We cannot forgive we do not first accept the injustice
 
01:05:26 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Sometimes I'm quick to jump into problem-solving or project management in my life or ministry or others' lives. I'm wondering if the practice of humility would recommend that I stop and ask first, is this where God is working? It seems that I've been noticing God at work in subtle ways in my or others' lives, but not necessarily in what I think is more important or expedient. I'm wondering about humility here.
 
01:15:41 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:15:46 sharonfisher: And to your spirit! Thank you !
 
01:15:50 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: thank you
 
01:15:52 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:56 sue and mark: thank you God bless.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLIV, Part III and Hypothesis XLV, Part I

Humility often eludes us not only in practice but in our ability to understand it. As always, we have to look to Christ as the standard. What we see revealed in him through the incarnation and in the Paschal mystery opens the door for us to begin to walk this same path. 
Understanding comes through experience. We must be shown what humility is and be made humble through experience. So often the self seeks to place itself at the center of existence; and in our spiritual life we begin to lose sight of God. Even in the pursuit of sanctity, we can fail to see the ways that we are lacking purity of heart. We often do not desire God above all things, or make him the beginning and end of all that we do. We may toil but to no end. 
Having said this, the stories from the fathers begin to reveal to us the distinctive marks of humility in a man. These stories show us why it is not only the most important virtue but also the most powerful. It overcomes all that is demonic. The more we trust solely in the grace of God, the more we abandon ourselves to his mercy and acknowledge the poverty due to our sin, the more his grace transforms us and acts through us and touches the lives of others. Humility and its perfection goes beyond truthful living or acknowledging the truth about ourselves. It is having eyes only for God. It is living in him and for him in every measure.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:23 FrDavid Abernethy: page 385 paragraph 6
 
00:06:31 FrDavid Abernethy: page 384 para 6
 
00:25:02 Anthony: Emphasis on kindness....sounds like something St Gabriel of Georgia said.
 
00:38:56 Anthony: Yes
 
00:38:56 Jacqulyn: Yes
 
00:46:31 Louise: Would the Desert Fathers agree or disagree with the following. Hating sins makes us ''relate'' to sins and instills hatred inside of us. I prefer to practice detachment from sins, as much as possible, and feel sorrow at having turned my back to God.
 
00:54:48 Lee Graham: As I forgive someone who hurts me, I see my sin disappear.
 
01:13:17 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXII: On Vainglory, Part II

With stunning clarity, St. John Climacus begins to show us the subtlety of vainglory; how easily it draws us to focus upon the self in one fashion or another. It suggests thoughts that elevate us in our own eyes and diminishes others in our judgment. 
Through vainglory we begin the movement of placing ourselves in the position of God; placing the self at the center of the spiritual life. The battle becomes ever so fierce and dangerous because at this point the focus of the demons’ attention is on our virtues. The demons make them the object of our attention. In doing so they turn us away from God who is the beginning and end of all things. 
And with the self firmly planted at the center, we are easily driven to rage and wrath towards anyone who gets in our way.  In the end, St John will show us how this gives birth to pride and how it draws us into the very darkness of hell itself.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:31:16 Lawrence Martone: Fr. Abernethy,
 
Perhaps the opposite of this vice of vainglory and seeking prestige is the beautiful story about St. John Vianney who added his own signature to a letter of protest to the bishop from leading clerics and parishioners against his (Fr. Vianney’s) way of being a pastor.
 
00:38:42 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: St. John Chrysostom and St. Gregory the Theologian, also, fled the priesthood, but eventually offered the Church an extraordinary legacy. Vainglory, would you say, attacks or tries to undermine our authentic vocations?
 
00:52:05 Anthony: Living the spiritual life is not the same as conversations in a "salon" or on a college campus.
 
00:52:06 Ren Witter: 🤣🤣🤣 My favorite Philip story
 
00:55:35 Louise: Could we say that vainglory corresponds to the ongoing self-validation or self-degradation of the ego, the ego focusing on the ego? If I were to let myself, I could become quite exasperated at this pervasive phenomenon inside my psyche. Any thoughts, Fr.?
 
00:59:35 Louise: So, we ought to not fight with our vainglory, but gently turn back to loving Jesus Christ.
 
01:02:14 Louise: Thank you, Fr.
 
01:08:30 Rachel: I think vainglory can be ever so subtle. I know someone who was told by a priest they were being scrupulous in a certain matter when they tried to confess. This brought much confusion because the person knew that the sins they attempted to confess were not " serious matter" and did not need to be confessed but in their desire to fight pride and vainglory, which was the cause of their sins. The person then had to fight vainglory in another way and thatg was not to tell the priest they knew that they were not serious sins. It was more painful to be seen as scrupulous and weak minded for the person.
 
01:09:55 Louise: I feel compassionate with people with a narcissistic disorder of the self, an arrested psychological development, who are so often stuck in vainglory and pride. What a prison!
 
01:14:15 Kevin Burke: The deeper we go into John’s Vainglory examples the more it seems the same as pride to me.  Can we recap the distinction between Vainglory and pride?
 
01:18:13 David Swiderski: Aren't a lot of the theologians presenting vainglory by arguing about angels on a pin, filoque, how one makes the sign of the cross etc. etc.  Only I can see the truth ..... all others that don't agree with me are wrong.
 
01:20:22 Anthony: That's Dante 's penultimate circle of hell if memory is correct - persons who appear alive on earth but they have confirmed themselves in hell.
 
01:23:50 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you ,  Blessing in my prayers
 
01:24:30 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:24:32 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 
01:24:39 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:24:43 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLIV, Part II

Every generation, every person, must be made humble!  Whatever way that takes place - whatever means we are shown this, it must happen if we are to follow Christ, and if we are to live in Him. He is Humility because he is Truth. In fact, the simplest definition of humility for us is truthful living. We must live in the Truth that has been revealed to us - we must live in Christ. 
That sounds a lot easier than what it is. Our egos often snap back into the center. The self, even within the context of the spiritual life, wants to be recognized as having value and strength. We want to have the perception of lifting ourselves up out of the mire. 
It is a humbling thing in and of itself to be saved. To acknowledge a savior means that we acknowledge the truth of our own poverty and sin. It means that we must acknowledge that we are not the source of life and love. God gives it to us so freely and with such gentleness and yet we can resent Him for it. Christ endures all things for us. He makes himself so small so as to be non-threatening; that is, he gives himself to us as our very food and drink. He nourishes us upon himself and his love. Yet pride can blind us to it all. God wants no “thing” from us. He wants us. Sadly, to say “yes” to that love can be one of the hardest things of life.
 
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:41:04 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: After years of working professionally in the US, I'm formed to believe that results indicate that I'm doing the right thing. It's hard for me to wrap my mind around the idea that God could see my failure as beneficial. Or that feeling like a failure could have some value.
 
00:57:20 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: It seems that consolation outside of relationship with Christ could even be an impediment in the spiritual life.
 
01:11:35 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Is it that the people you quoted are telling us that we need to realize that humility is actually an attribute of God he shares with us.
 
01:15:32 Lorraine Green: Thank you!
 
01:15:40 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXII: On Vainglory

Self-esteem . . . how the meaning of that has changed over the generations. And when it becomes abstracted from our relationship with God, when our self-identity, purpose, and meaning becomes unmoored from He who created us, self-esteem can become the most grotesque of the vices. It will not only diminish our virtues, but destroy them completely. 
When the sweat and the toil of the spiritual life is turned back on the self or when ascetical practices become ends in themselves, they lose all value. Christ himself warns us about this in the Gospel. “If you fast in order that others see that you are fasting, then you have your reward.“ In other words, we have our payment in full. We see ourselves, and others see us as self-disciplined, but that is as far as the labor takes us. In this sense we become the most pitiable of all men, because we are acting as if there is no resurrection. If the things we do in this world, including religious things, are done for ourselves and to build up our own egos then they will eventually turn to dust. The love that has been revealed to us is self-emptying. 
In our day to hold fast to such an understanding can only seem absurd for in no way does it fit with the wisdom of the world. Only by keeping our eyes fixed upon God and fixed upon Jesus Christ and him crucified do we let go of the illusion not only of being the self-made man, but the self-made Christian. Religious people are not in capable of having their own delusions. In fact, the delusion of being religious can be the greatest among them and the most difficult to overcome. It is only when the cross is firmly rooted in the mind and the heart and when we have allowed ourselves to be humbled by it do we then become free; free, not for ourselves or to serve ourselves, but free to love others and God. 
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:12 FrDavid Abernethy: page 165 beginning Step 22 on Vainglory
 
00:29:13 Anthony: Should we be looking at our works this way? I had thoughtbit was a heresy to believe that any thing we do, even every good thing, is infected with sin.
 
00:39:14 David Swiderski: Are the references to Fulton Sheen from Treasure in Clay?
 
00:39:44 Louise: Can we say that vain glory is present as soon as we identify with something, anything?
 
00:40:55 Louise: What inner attitude could counter vain glory? Maybe vulnerability, fortitude, and yet a complete dependency on God.
 
00:43:49 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: I suffer the vainglory of fantasizing about meeting with someone or doing something in the future that will bring someone
 
00:44:07 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: someone's conversion and blessing.
 
00:55:09 Anthony: That was a very uncomfortable movie.
 
00:59:44 Ashley Kaschl: Father, you posted something this week by Evely that has really stuck with me, “…whereas you were trying to use even your first move of confidence towards God in order not to entrust yourself truly to Him, but to try to make him enter into your plans, like a pawn, like a pawn on your chess board. It is only when you accepted to be a pawn in his hand and in his plan, that you liberated your hope and his action." 
 
I think this relates to paragraphs 6 and 11 because, in the same way, the believing idolater or the flatterer uses God, and manipulates every good, as a means to their own end, for their own glory. I’m reminded of St. John Paul II saying, to a friend who asked him why God would let him suffer an assassination attempt and being shot that, “there is nothing better than to be a tool in the hand of God.” I think the vainglorious seeks control and betrays God for human honor or a perception of strength, and would rather put on airs than be changed internally, than to be docile to the will of God.
 
01:05:17 Maureen Cunningham: What the difference between Praise and Flattery
 
01:14:32 Kate: When one looks back and sees how much one has done not for God but for self, it can be very painful realization.  Yet what is so amazing is that God in His Providence was still very much at work during those times even when we were not seeking first His Kingdom.
 
01:14:37 David Swiderski: There is a tradition in my family with my grandfather, father and I try. When someone thanks them they say - don't thank me, thank God I am able.
 
01:14:53 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "When one looks back …" with ❤️
 
01:15:10 sue and mark: Reacted to "When one looks back ..." with ❤️
 
01:15:14 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "There is a tradition…" with ❤️
 
01:15:32 sue and mark: Reacted to "There is a tradition..." with ❤️
 
01:16:17 David Swiderski: It seems to help to realize nothing is inherent in you but flows from God.
 
01:19:24 Maureen Cunningham: Blessing thank you
 
01:19:30 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:19:31 sharonfisher: And with your spirit. Thanks!
 
01:19:32 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 
01:19:34 Ambrose Little, OP: Gracias!
 
01:19:37 sue and mark: Thank you FR. Abernethy
 
01:19:39 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:43 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:19:45 Ambrose Little, OP: 🙂 Thanks!

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLIII, Part II and Hypothesis XLIV, Part I

I can say this without any caveat - reading the Evergetinos is one of the most important things that we could do for ourselves in the spiritual life. I know that might sound extreme; especially given all of the writings of the Fathers that we have read over the course of the years, including the writings of the Philokalia. 
Yet, there’s something exceptional about the Evergetinos. We are not only given specific teachings but we are shown the lived experience of the fathers; how they came to understand things in the way that they did about the human person, the struggle with sin, and the action of God’s grace. This became especially apparent in this evening’s group. Our focus, in particular, was on the virtue of humility. After pondering the sayings of the Fathers - that the truly wise individual is the one who has control over his volition, who seeks in every way to make his will subject to God and understands that the will of God is advantageous to him in a manner surpassing all human understanding. 
In and of itself this is beautiful and speaks to the heart. However, we segued into a story from the life of Saint Pachomius describing the birth and development of humility in the soul of one of his monks Simvanos. Suddenly all the truths we read about came to life. We move from the notional to the real very quickly. The human mind and our tendency towards rationalization easily draws us back to a worldly way of perceiving reality. Whereas the lives of the Saints reveal to us the heart of man and God; what it is to be created in the image and likeness of God, what it is to neglect that truth, and the beauty of the soul that emerges when the grace of God brings healing where once there was only sin.
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:05:30 FrDavid Abernethy: page 377 Letter B
 
00:05:57 Jason: I do not have the text, but am looking to purchase soon
 
00:06:29 FrDavid Abernethy: Jason that’s fine.  We read the text as we go along
 
00:06:48 Jason: Reacted to "Jason that’s fine.  …" with ❤️
 
00:08:24 Jason: I am a catechumen in my local Orthodox Church, I do hope that I am still able to attend these
 
00:08:49 Ren Witter: Replying to "I am a catechumen in..."
 
Absolutely!
 
00:09:12 Ren Witter: Replying to "I am a catechumen in..."
 
You are not our only Orthodox/nearly Orthodox by any means 😊
 
00:09:14 Jason: Reacted to "Absolutely!" with ❤️
 
00:09:21 Jason: Reacted to "You are not our only…" with ❤️
 
00:10:00 Susanna Joy: Oh, wow...Congratulations, Father! Sounds wonderful.🎉🙏🏾😊
 
00:34:22 Anthony: Som people like me have a strong g attachment to duty. And to be incompetent to fulfill perceived duty is very difficult.
 
00:56:56 David Fraley: Reacted to "Som people like me h…" with 👍
 
01:03:32 Louise: Would you say that he developed humility because he was humiliated and accepted it due to the love embedded into the humiliation.
 
01:09:45 Anthony: I guess this answers a duty driven person. If you just can't find a way to complete duty, you can either become vicious to attain the goal or accept the humility borne from inability to complete the duty.
 
01:17:18 Maureen Cunningham: Poor in spirit
 
01:18:35 Maureen Cunningham: Life is potter's wheel
 
01:18:50 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.🙏🏾
 
01:18:52 Rachel: Thank you a thousand times.
 
01:19:11 Melissa Kummerow: Reacted to "Thank you a thousand…" with 💕
 
01:19:25 sue and mark: Thank you Father A.  Good night.
 
01:19:33 Susanna Joy: Reacted to "Thank you a thousand..." with 💕
 
01:19:41 Louise: God bless you, Fr.
 
01:19:42 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:19:43 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you
 
01:19:43 Melissa Kummerow: You too!
 
01:19:44 David Fraley: Thank you, Father.
 
01:19:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXI: On Unmanly and Puerile Cowardice, Part I

Anxiety, it has been said, is ubiquitous. We all experience it and in its many manifestations. On a purely psychological level, one can never get to the heart or source of this feeling and its accompanying isolation. Often we find ourselves desperate to free ourselves from its grip. Therefore, we either immerse ourselves in the things of this world and maintain the illusion of security or we become paralyzed by it completely. 
The desert fathers including St. John Climacus, however, remind us that through the incarnation everything about what it is to be a human being has been assumed and embraced by our Lord, including this experience that often plagues our existence. Christ is the source of all healing and in and through our immersion in His life through the sacraments and prayer we begin to enter into the peace of the kingdom. We are commanded in the Scriptures not to have any anxiety at all. However, this is not simply a command but a promise of grace and strength. If we hold on to our faith in the Lord, if we truly hope in his promises, then all anxiety and fear will flee.  To call upon the name of Jesus is to flog our enemies; meaning not only the temptations that come to us from the demons, but the fears that they would insert into our minds and hearts. 
To mourn over one’s sin, to acknowledge the brevity of our life, is the set aside all illusion and false security. It leads us to cling to Christ who is life and love. So often we too like the disciples are foolish and slow of heart to believe. Yet in Christ even the most improbable of things becomes possible - that in the soul dedicated to God fear and cowardice disappears.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:08:02 FrDavid Abernethy: page 163 Step 21
 
00:19:55 LauraLeigh: In #2, is he saying that this "old soul" should know better than to give in to cowardice?
 
00:23:10 Eric Ewanco: Fear is a lack of trust in God
 
00:23:13 Louise: Fear arises when we read a situation as a threat, while boldness arises when we read a situation as a challenge. With Christ, maybe we should see  all situations as challenges which we can face with Him.
 
00:24:09 Cindy Moran: Pray for me I lost my wallet today Yes I am anxious.
 
00:25:22 Rebecca Thérèse: I'll pray for you Cindy
 
00:25:26 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "I'll pray for you Ci..." with 🙏
 
00:25:36 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "Pray for me I lost m..." with 🙏
 
00:28:37 Louise: Why are even Catholics so afraid of dying? I do not understand.
 
00:29:42 Cindy Moran: Reacted to "I'll pray for you Ci..." with 🙏
 
00:31:31 David Swiderski: It is interesting I lived and traveled in very insecure areas with lots of kidnappings, random shootings/killings, widespread stealing where your car often is going in Mexico, Colombia, Brazil and I found people of amazing faith. Here were there is comfort and more lonleiness anxiety seems widespread.
 
00:35:45 wayne: Replying to "Pray for me I lost m..."
 
pray to St Anthony always helps, has worked for me
 
00:43:55 TFredman: Reacted to "I'll pray for you Ci..." with 🙏
 
00:45:36 maureencunningham: How did Moses come to Christ
 
00:49:28 Michael Abele: I am not afraid for my own safety, but sometimes I fear for the
people I care for and protect
 
00:51:23 LauraLeigh: I love that. "Flog your enemies with the Name of Jesus." I'm going to remember that.
 
00:53:08 Lori Hatala: I think God gave me enough sense not to purposely put myself in a harmful situation. ot avoiding all but knowing what to stay away from.
 
00:54:40 Eric Ewanco: ChatGPT summarizes his conversion thusly: Saint Moses the Black, once a violent bandit, sought refuge among desert monks in Egypt. Impressed by their peace and patience, he converted to Christianity, became a monk, and later an abbot, renowned for his deep spirituality and wisdom. He was martyred defending his monastery.
 
00:55:12 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "ChatGPT summarizes h..." with ❤️
 
00:55:37 LauraLeigh: Replying to "ChatGPT summarizes h..."
 
I believe I read that he had about 70 monks under his care by the time he died.
 
00:55:43 Eric Ewanco: Replying to "ChatGPT summarizes h..."
 
yes
 
00:57:14 Lawrence Martone: Perhaps Ignatian “agere contra” can help us deal with fear, always trusting in Christ.
 
01:04:37 Michael Abele: Meant to phrase my earlier comment as a question: can the same be said about fearing for the sake of others? I suppose that can also get out of hand if we do not trust God
 
01:08:24 Jeff O.: Are barrenness of soul and spiritual desolation as Ignatius tends to identify it somewhat the same here? Or is he getting at something else?
 
01:10:28 David Swiderski: Jacobs Ladder the movie. All I saw were demons torturing and tearing at me but then I looked again and they were angels freeing me from the attachments of life.
 
01:11:17 Ashley Kaschl: Paragraph 9 is reminding me of the recent Gospel reading of Jesus calling Peter to walk on the water. Water generally represents chaos in scripture, something unformed or in turmoil. And I think also, if we believe wholeheartedly that we are made in the image of God, and the longer we spend in His presence, the more we are revealed as ourselves in that identity, it is almost as though overcoming temporal and animalistic fear is like passing through raging waters, to be “meeked” by the grace of God so that even our fears are rightly ordered.
 
01:12:53 Ashley Kaschl: Part 2: (sorry it’s long) if then, we are filled with this grace to have such a disposition as to be unmoving and freed from other fears, then we are always being filled. St. Bernard of Clairvaux says, “The man who is wise, therefore, will see his life as more like a reservoir than a canal. The canal simultaneously pours out what it receives; the reservoir retains the water till it is filled, then discharges the overflow without loss to itself. Today there are many in the Church who act like canals, the reservoirs are far too rare ... You too must learn to await this fullness before pouring out your gifts, do not try to be more generous than God.”
 
01:15:17 Ambrose Little, OP: (No need to read this aloud, Father): Would appreciate your prayers for my surgery tomorrow morning. It's supposed to be minor/outpatient. The post-op recovery/adaptation period is long, though. I'm optimistic for a good result. Thanks in advance! 
🙏🏻🙏🏻
 
01:15:46 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "(No need to read thi…" with 🙏
 
01:15:52 Art: Reacted to "(No need to read thi…" with 🙏
 
01:15:54 Cindy Moran: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:15:54 TFredman: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:15:55 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:16:02 Brian L: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:16:03 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:16:10 Jeff O.: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:17:29 LauraLeigh: Replying to "Part 2: (sorry it’s ..."
 
Love this. Very meaningful and helpful to me right now. ❤️
 
01:19:50 sue and mark: Reacted to "(No need to read thi..." with 🙏
 
01:21:26 LauraLeigh: Father, just a reminder to check out Protecting Veil on YT. He's run Fr. Freeman, too.
 
01:21:44 Ambrose Little, OP: The intro to the hours of prayer is always good when feeling afraid: God, come to my assistance. Lord, make haste to help me!
 
01:22:11 Jeff O.: Reacted to "The intro to the hou..." with 👍
 
01:22:32 LauraLeigh: The only thing I stumble on is that cowardice seems to mean fear or anxiety, but I tend to think of it a little differently. Need to sit with this for a while.
 
01:22:47 Michael Abele: Don't angels usually open with "be not afraid" when they make an appearance? I always thought they'd be a little scary to encounter, in an awe inspiring way.
 
01:23:00 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Don't angels usually…" with 💯
 
01:23:08 Barbara: Do the Eastern Fathers call upon the blood of Jesus as protection or
as dissolution of fears?
 
01:23:43 Susan M: I THINK IT IS PS 70.1
 
01:23:50 Ambrose Little, OP: Replying to "Don't angels usually..."
 
Definitely as described by Ezekiel. 🙂
 
01:24:07 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "The intro to the hou…" with 👍
 
01:24:32 Ambrose Little, OP: Reacted to "I THINK IT IS PS 70...." with 👍🏻
 
01:24:32 Cindy Moran: Reacted to "Don't angels usually..." with 💯
 
01:24:40 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "I THINK IT IS PS 70.…" with 👍🏻
 
01:25:03 Audrey C. Block: Had great fears this morning; went to Sacrifice of the Mass and still great fears( poor healthx6mos plus many other challenges)sat by Jesus in the Tabernacle and begged His healp over and over, finally by 30 min fears ALL gone!
 
01:25:36 Rachel: Ou rparish is in a rough neighborhood. Two contrasting experiences...one, a while back during a parish event that ran late I entered the chapel forgetting the roughness of the neighborhood. Upon leaving I rralized that no other person, except Our Lord present in the Blessed Sacrament was with me.
 
01:26:14 Ambrose Little, OP: Ps 46:1-3 is good meditation for this, too.
 
01:26:18 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Had great fears this…" with ❤️
 
01:26:25 Cindy Moran: Reacted to "Had great fears this..." with ❤️
 
01:26:38 Rachel: Yet, recently the same situation, I entered the chapel alone, and even with this reading in mind, but, it took all of my strength not to look over my shoulder at every small sound in the dark!
 
01:26:55 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Ps 46:1-3 is good me…" with 🔥
 
01:27:45 Rachel: Reacted to "Had great fears th..." with ❤️
 
01:28:56 Rachel: There was no one in the chapel
 
01:29:04 Rachel: It was at night at dark
 
01:29:07 Lawrence Martone: Leiva-Merikakis has a remarkable reflection on the calming of the sea. (Mt. 8:23-27). Just one sentence: “The Savior is redeeming his disciples by making his profound serenity as God inhabit the same space as their frantic despair.”
 
01:29:16 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Leiva-Merikakis has …" with 😍
 
01:29:27 Ambrose Little, OP: Replying to "Ps 46:1-3 is good me..."
 
God is for us a refuge and strength,
a helper close at hand, in time of distress: so we shall not fear though the earth should rock, though the mountains fall into the depths of the sea, even though its waters rage and foam, even though the mountains be shaken by its waves. (Abbey Psalter)
 
01:29:29 Ashley Kaschl: Replying to "Leiva-Merikakis has …"
LOVE him 🔥
 
01:29:45 Rachel: Reacted to "Leiva-Merikakis ha..." with ❤️
 
01:29:48 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Leiva-Merikakis has …" with 🔥
 
01:30:04 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "Leiva-Merikakis has ..." with ❤️
 
01:30:10 sue and mark: Reacted to "Leiva-Merikakis has ..." with ❤️
 
01:30:58 Cindy Moran: I am so distraught that I almost didn't log on tonight...thank you
Father & Everyone for prayers. I don't feel so overwhelmed now. Thanks be to God. Bless you all.
 
01:31:30 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "I am so distraught t..." with ❤️
 
01:31:54 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "I am so distraught t…" with ❤️
 
01:32:22 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:32:34 iPhone: Thank you.  Very helpful.
 
01:33:03 John: Thank you, Father!
 
01:33:06 sue and mark: Thank you Fr. Abernethy and God bless you.  good night.
 
01:33:07 maureencunningham: Thanks
 
01:33:08 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:33:09 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:33:11 Rachel: Thank you all. Thank you
 
01:33:16 David Swiderski: Thank you father
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLII, Part IV and Hypothesis XLIII, Part I

One of the most difficult things about the faith is not simply desiring God with all of our heart, but allowing God and His desire for us to transform us and shape us. It means allowing Him to draw us into His own life and virtue. We are to become in the world what He is to us. 
Therefore, we are immediately confronted with the fact that we have to let go of the limited powers of our own reason and judgment. We must place our faith and hope in the providence of God to guide us along the path that leads to salvation. Like Saint Peter there often comes a time in our life when another binds us and leads us where we do not want to go. There will likely be many occasions when we are called to die to self and sin and to live for God alone  - come what may.! 
The afflictions that we bear and our desire NOT to force our will upon others can only emerge from this reality. We must put on the mind of Christ. We must become what we receive in the holy Eucharist. All that we suffer must be seen as united to Christ’s redemptive work on the cross. Christianity is about as far from being a philosophical system or ideology as something could be. It is Divine Life and Love.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:01:48 FrDavid Abernethy: page 374
 
00:02:05 FrDavid Abernethy: Welcome Susanna
 
00:02:15 FrDavid Abernethy: Facebook friend :-0
 
00:02:33 Susanna Joy: Reacted to "Facebook friend :-0" with ☺️
 
00:02:49 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.
 
00:02:57 FrDavid Abernethy: You’re very welcome
 
00:41:30 John: Would making asceticism an end in itself a type of obeying the letter of
the law, rather than the spirit?
 
00:42:31 Susanna Joy: This is very helpful advice for me right niw, as I have been staying at my friend's spiritual community, and being so distressed at members'  contentiousness...wondering what to do and stay cenetered/bring a spirit if peace
 
00:42:50 Susanna Joy: *spirit of peace
 
00:46:15 Susanna Joy: Yes...exactly. .. Love must return to its Source in order to flow ever onward...
Remembering to turn to Christ in these moments
 
00:49:02 TFredman: (My name is Tracey) The hardest Lent I ever had was when my spiritual director suggested a different type of fast - a fast from just what we are talking about. Taking his counsel to heart, I decided that a contentious coworker would not disturb my peace and I would love her - oh yes, she was my Lenten project. It was incredibly difficult. She did her best to destroy me and to talk about me to others and to in effect destroy our "team" during the most difficult season of our work. I suffered through that Lent and beyond more than I can express. But through it all, I was at peace and grace followed.
 
00:51:52 John: At a retreat in June, I was given a Holy Card with a prayer of St. Charles de Foucauld: An Act of Abandonment: "Father, I abandon myself into Your hands. Do with me what you will. Whatever You may do, I thank you. I am ready for all, I accept all. Let only your will be done in me, and in all Your creatures - I wish no more than this, O Lord. Into Your hands I commend my soul; I offer it to Thee with all the love of my heart, for I love you, Lord, and so need to give myself, to surrender myself into Your hands, without reserve, and with boundless confidence. For You are my Father. Amen.
 
00:52:43 carol nypaver: 🙏🏼
 
00:53:22 Alexandra K: Amen..
 
00:55:59 Anthony: I agree with the feeling of loss. There's an interesting verse in Sirach or Wisdom,  I think, "Let not th eunuch say 'I am not fruitful.'" It's a verse pointing to Abraham 's hope in an impossibile situation.
 
00:57:09 Louise: A woman I know ask the Beloved to teach her unconditional love. After few months, her 30-year husband announced her that he was leaving for a younger woman. What an opportunity to react with unconditional love!
 
00:59:00 Louise: ''asked''
 
01:05:36 carol nypaver: Is it important to discern whether it is atonement for sin or a test?
 
01:10:01 John: These experiences of painful, crushing long-suffering remind me of what Cardinal Merry del Val prayed for in his Litany of Humility: http://catholictradition.org/Litanies/litany55.htm
 
01:10:36 Anthony: The Gospel insinuates some Jews called St Mary a very bad name.  That must have been hard to bear.
 
01:12:16 Alexandra K: And during this past year of contentiousness i have been praying The cardinal s litany of humility.     Watch out you ask for!
 
01:14:08 Sheila Applegate: Do we really want "thy will to be done" because does that not mean he wants us humbled..and like Him. We don't, mostly.
 
01:18:13 Sheila Applegate: Ouch.
 
01:18:25 maureencunningham: Thank You
 
01:19:01 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.🙏🏾
 
01:19:03 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:19:03 John: Thank you, Father!
 
01:19:09 sue and mark: good night thank you
 
01:19:14 Alexandra K: Ty
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XX: On Bodily Vigil, Part II

All that was to be redeemed had also then to be assumed in the Incarnation. All that is human and all that is part of the human experience must be embraced by Christ in order that it might be healed by his grace. 
We are shown this in a very simple way in regards to one of our basic appetites as human beings - sleep. Like any other appetite, it must be ordered rightly; otherwise, it can end up stealing half of our life. Rather than being drawn into the rest of contemplation, we are often pulled into something much less helpful. Instead of engaging He who is Reality, Life and Love, we often seek to escape these things and enter into sleep or the myriad of ways that we can escape reality. 
Therefore, when it comes to prayer, we are often embattled. Sleep can come upon us quickly or we can be drawn to direct or attention to the work of our hands. The Evil One can stimulate the mind at just the right time to pull us away from the comfort and consolation of God into conversation, food, sleep, etc. We must understand that we are engaged in a spiritual battle. When the devil sees us engaging in spiritual warfare, when he sees us developing the discipline of prayer, he will immediately seek to afflicted us with temptations and fantasies the moment the prayer is finished. He will try to snatch away from us the first fruits of the soul. 
We can understand, then, why John tells us that bodily vigil leads to spiritual vigil or alertness. We need to be alert not to protect ourselves from the things of this world, but from the darkness that would enter into our hearts if we do not guard them.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:08:28 FrDavid Abernethy: page 162 para 10
 
00:09:06 angelo: Reacted to "page 162 para 10" with 👍
 
00:25:49 Maureen Cunningham: did they recite the Psalms as prayer
 
00:35:46 Louise: Television induces a trance in most people.
 
00:43:26 Louise: Another feature of watching television is that we become what we contemplate.
 
00:45:25 carol nypaver: Amen!🤣
 
00:46:11 Anthony: Recreation,  re-creation, takes work, and I find it's easy just to watch, but it is agitating and like Lucy, Charlie Brown and the football, it's a recurrent trap around 10pm.
 
00:47:25 Eric Ewanco: This is a general question that's been percolating for a while in my mind as I've been listening to the sessions: Sometimes the desert fathers come across like salvation is so difficult to achieve that it would tempt me to despair, if I were to give it credence. Can you comment on their perspective, and also what they believed the chances of a layperson to be saved was?
 
00:47:33 Cindy Moran: I've worked in broadcast TV for 43 years. It's the last thing I pick for relaxation.
 
00:48:10 Ren Witter: Who was it who said: “I have learned a great deal from television, because, every time it is put on, I leave the room and read a book” ? 🤣 I don’t remember, but I thought it was great at the time.
 
00:49:39 Cindy Moran: Replying to "Who was it who said:..." 
 
 Groucho Marx said this.
 
00:52:15 Bonnie's iPad (2): In fact it can be quite shocking as to how quickly this can occur.
 
00:53:01 Art: Reacted to "Who was it who said:..." with 👍
 
00:53:13 John: I seem to be especially vulnerable to attacks right after Confession - including getting stuck behind a slow driver (the most annoying thing for a New Yorker... 🙂 so I've tried to become very vigilant at that time.
 
00:55:29 Ambrose Little, OP: Reacted to "I seem to be especia..." with 😅
 
00:56:27 sue and mark: I remember hearing a priest say that "a saint is not someone who never fell, they just did not make friends with the dirt"  It is not the falling but the getting back up over and over again, according to this priest.
 
00:57:12 Bonnie's iPad (2): Reacted to "I seem to be especia…" with 👌
 
01:03:37 Ambrose Little, OP: Replying to "Who was it who said:..."
 
Say it in your head with his style of speaking—classic. 🙂
 
01:04:03 Lawrence Martone: It is hard to find a priest/confessor who really understands spiritual warfare and dealing with attacks from demons.  The demons zero in on your weakest points, especially in retaliation after times of holiness and grace.  It can result in deep despondency, or anger, with a total absence of peace.
 
01:04:27 Lee Graham: Saints fall down and get up
 
01:05:05 John: Reacted to "It is hard to find a..." with 👍
 
01:05:38 Eric Ewanco: There is an agraphon (word of Jesus not in the Gospels) recorded
in the Byzantine Anointing of the Sick service that goes "As any times as you fall, arise, and you shall be saved".
 
01:06:14 sue and mark: Reacted to "There is an agraphon..." with 👍
 
01:07:33 Anthony: Sometimes I've used Frederick Neitsche in a way to help me. Exert the will not to stay in despondency. Despite emotional feeling, maintain a deep determination to hope.
 
01:09:38 Cindy Moran: I read that EWTN has a new series on The Desert Father's starting Aug 20
 
01:09:52 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "I read that EWTN has..." with ❤️
 
01:12:51 Cindy Moran: 😄
 
01:13:13 Anthony: That's a mistake I believe the Puritans made.
 
01:14:58 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:41 John: Thank you Father!!
 
01:15:43 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:15:44 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...great session!
 
01:15:49 Krissy: Thank you Fathet
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLII, Part III

Being thrown off balance! The experience of vertigo! This is what comes to mind when considering the writings from the Evergetinos this evening. Once again, the gospel is put before us in an unvarnished fashion. It is as if through the unclouded vision of the fathers suddenly the truth of the gospel appears before us and all of its starkness. We are to love and to become love. It is this reality that must shape and form our interaction with every person we encounter. It suggests a kind of vulnerability where we seemingly leave ourselves exposed to the world around us and its malice. So easily does the Evil One whisper in our ears, “If you give yourself in such a way, you will undoubtedly find yourself impoverished.” “Would God really ask such a thing from you?”  Such thinking makes us very calculating about our lives. We are comfortable with boundaries and sometimes the religious boundaries, the walls that we put up around ourselves in the name of God are the highest and thickest of them all. 
Yet, we always have before us Christ crucified - arms outstretched and hanging naked upon the cross. He is mocked in the same way that our own hearts mock the truth when we shrink away from its demands in horror. To “think” about unconditional love always allows us to remain one step removed. If we keep the faith notional, we do not have to live it. The fathers, however, allow us no such luxury. Nor did they have confidence in their own virtue or rectitude. Humility understands one thing – all is Grace. This will forever compel us to look upon others with the generosity of God and ourselves as the recipients of incalculable and unmerited mercy.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:10 FrDavid Abernethy: dabernethy@gmail.com
 
00:24:14 LauraLeigh: Not sure how to do this in real life. Last week, I pitched a battle at work, and won. And it was no petty matter. I think it takes a lot of wisdom, a lot of discernment, to do this well. Me, I was lucky.
 
00:26:37 LauraLeigh: Thankfully, it wasn't about the Faith.
 
00:28:13 Louise: We lost you Fr.
 
00:28:14 carol nypaver: Yes
 
00:30:02 Eric Ewanco: “Here the parallel holds good—it is as absurd to argue men, as to torture them, into believing.”
 
Newman, John Henry, Sermon III, The Usurpations Of Reason, Preached December 11, 1831. MATT. 11:19, Sermons, Chiefly On the Theory of Religious Belief, Preached Before the University of Oxford (London: Francis & John Rivington, 1844), p. 48
 
00:52:02 Anthony: I do have a concern.  I don't want to be a sucker and I resent having been taken for a sucker. That helps drive my engaging religious  and cultural discussions and it's why I'm careful in what charitable works I agree to do.
 
01:00:33 Maureen Cunningham: What about the  Book  The Way of the Pilgrim  Hw would say the Jesus Prayer in silence
 
01:03:12 Paul Fifer: I see people walk in for help with food, gas, or money quite regularly.  Many I know for a fact are gaming the system and it really gets to me at times.   I have this quote written down from Mother Theresa to reflect on for those times. “If you judge people, you have no time to love them.”
 
01:20:19 LauraLeigh: I love this message, but in the moment, I forget them.
 
01:23:41 John: Thank you Father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XX: On Bodily Vigil, Part I

The healing of the soul! So often we lose sight of the meaning of the spiritual life and the disciplines that we embrace. We often look at them as being punitive or requiring us to give up something that we enjoy or take pleasure in. We can lose sight very quickly of the presence of God even in the practice of prayer. 
This came forward when we discussed this evening something such as vigils. Rarely is the practice of vigil (breaking one’s sleep to rise and pray at night) ever discussed as a valuable exercise for those not only living in a monastery. To order our appetite for sleep and to break the night for prayer is seen as nonsensical or something that could jeopardize one’s health and well-being or one’s capacity to work. 
What we find in the spiritual tradition, however, is a far different vision. Bodily vigil leads to spiritual vigil; that is, spiritual vigilance or alertness. Arising during the quiet of the night, humbled in mind and body, one is able to enter into the deep silence of prayer and receive more freely what God desires to give us. Not experiencing the impediment of worldly distractions or the distractions of a multitude of thoughts we are able to open the mind and the heart to God fully. And in doing so we can also experience the deepest healing. 
We begin to lose the desire to escape from reality in the things of this world or in sleep. The opening of the mind and the heart to God through deep prayer can bring about the repairing even of the deepest trauma caused by our own sin or the sins of others. God can pass freely into the deepest recesses of the human heart that learns how to become vulnerable to Him over time through the experience of His love and compassion. Trust emerges and with it hope.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:12:48 Nathan: (Thx Father, I'm using the Paulist Press CWS edition so that's helpful)
 
00:22:34 sharonfisher: I thought it was my dog whining! Lol
 
00:31:01 Maureen Cunningham: Page please, Thank You
 
00:31:29 Kevin Burke: 161
 
00:31:51 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you
 
00:35:59 John: Would practicing vigils have a positive effect on being subject to deceptive dreams? I've gone down numerous dead ends in the past trying to interpret dreams, or thinking that they were pre-cognitive, but most of them turned out to be mirages.
 
00:56:56 John: Sounds like vigils are a gateway to "the meat ye know not of."
 
00:58:43 Louise: Maybe the Beloved has given people insomnia (waking up in the middle of the night) so we can turn to ward Him during this quiet time.
 
01:00:56 Maureen Cunningham: sleep does not become your master,
 
01:02:20 Anthony: On vigils, prayers, rosaries,  looking at God as the other
imposing an obligation on me makes these annoying. But maybe looking at God as the Other Who gave me His image as an integral part of myself would make vigils, etc desirable.
 
01:03:19 Kate: Father, would you have any advice on how to begin the practice of vigils for someone who does not have a spiritual director who could help incorporate this practice in the interior life?
 
01:06:09 Anthony: The cell becomes hell
 
01:13:13 Anthony: The 3 Apostles slept in the Garden out of sorrow.  I'll have disordered sleep out of sorrow.
 
01:15:29 Lee Graham: Prayer changes us
 
01:18:12 Ren Witter: Yea. The “type and number” narrative about confession really makes the sacrament so transactional, and more like a bad experience with your doctor than an encounter with God.
 
01:18:15 Bonnie Lewis: Father, I had a priest say that to me in the confessional.  It did hurt and surprise me.  I've never forgotten it, obviously.
 
01:18:58 sue and mark: Reacted to "Yea. The “type and n..." with 👍
 
01:21:46 Greg C: Good comments, Ren.  We aren't a vehicle to be serviced.
 
01:21:47 Maureen Cunningham: You can not easily see a Doctor they zoom
 
01:25:56 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You ,
 
01:26:12 John: Thank you, Father!
 
01:26:15 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLII, Part II

If I were to give a title to this evening’s session, it would be “What is the place of the Christian in a post-Christian culture? Even better, “What is the place of the Christian in an age of nihilism? When we begin to consider our conduct in relationship to others, how we are to conform ourselves not simply to a law or teaching but to Christ himself, we are confronted with something quite radical. We are to meet insults, hatred, misunderstandings and aggression with humility.  Love is always meant to trump the other things that we hold on to with a firm grip; our own judgment, our own will, our own opinion and the satisfaction of our own desires above the needs of others. 
What we are presented with in the teachings of the fathers is rooted in the capacity of the soul for true discernment. The one who is pure of heart is able to see things as God sees them and so see their true value. Therefore, the fathers tell us that in this world we should take the place of a “stranger”; that is, not seeking to have the first word or seeking to have any desire at all except the desire for God and that which draws us toward Him. We are to bend like a reed in the wind when it comes to our relationships with other people. What value does our personal opinion have or the acceptance of some truth that we speak that is greater than love? To stand up against the winds is to court danger; it is to give rise to quarrels and cause trouble.
If we want to live with others, we are not to desire to give them orders, but like Christ we are to become an example of obedience. Even as we read the fathers, we must keep Christ before eyes for he is the standard. In the end, it was His actions that revealed a perfect obedience; an obedience rooted in love and willing to empty itself and take on the form of a servant. We are to strive for this alone – that our love would be cruciform.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:09:32 FrDavid Abernethy: page 370 no. 6
 
00:26:54 Louise: Could we say that, when meeting someone, shaking hands indicates a willingness to welcome the other, to allow a certain form of intimacy and to trust that the other is clean (especially 100 years and more ago when hygiene was questionable)?
 
00:49:03 Maureen Cunningham: Why is  Letting Go soooooo Hard
 
00:54:55 Ren Witter: I love this story sooo much
 
00:55:10 Ambrose Little, OP: They just needed Twitter.
 
00:55:37 Patrick: 😄
 
01:06:38 Louise: We have to be ready for ridicule, persecution and even martyrdom.
 
01:12:35 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You,
 
01:13:23 Ambrose Little, OP: Powerful stuff!
 
01:13:29 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:31 Alexandra K: Thank you Fr
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XIX: On Sleep, Prayer, and Psalmody with the Brotherhood

When we think of appetites or bodily desires, we rarely consider something such as sleep. Yet this evening St. John shows us that sleep is something that can disrupt that which is most important for the spiritual life; our prayer. Sleep is certainly an essential need that we have as human beings. However, there are many reasons that we can be drawn into it excessively. One of these is human nature of course. However, sleep can come upon us from an excess of food, from the temptation of demons, and also from extreme or prolonged fasting. Thus, sleeping is important for us to consider closely.  Excessive sleeping can become a long-standing habit that is difficult to cure. 
It may be difficult for us to think of demons having an impact upon us in this fashion. Yet, when the bell rings for prayer or when the alarm goes off in the morning we can hear a voice within our minds say “Wait, give yourself a little more rest.” In modern days the snooze alarm allows us to extend this indefinitely and we begin our days, perhaps lacking prayer altogether. We can also experience the sensation of severe and unusual pains in the stomach or fits of yawning or even waves of laughter over some amusing incident that comes to mind or takes place within the church. 
The same sluggishness in getting out of bed can follow us into the practice of prayer itself. We can hurry through our prayers; saying them inattentively and allowing the mind to wander. We can enter into church without the proper demeanor or making signs of devotion. When these patterns of behavior take over then the demons will certainly make sport of us. To combat this St. John encourages common prayer where we unite ourselves with others in this most essential practice of calling out to God. In this, we can call to mind Jesus’ own words, “Where two or three are gathered, there I am in their midst.“ 
Often in our day with the breakdown of Christian culture and community, those living in the world, sadly, find themselves left to pray on their own. However, we are not left to ourselves. Through the Hours or the Divine Office we were able to pray with one mind and heart with the Church throughout the world. A deep mystical Communion exist when we engage in the prayer of the Church. 
All this is meant to be a simple reminder to us about the subtle things that can distract us at the time of prayer. Therefore, St. John tells us that the practice of prayer itself purifies our hearts and increases our zeal and love for God. The more that we engage in the discipline of prayer, the greater our capacity to rout the demons!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:11:06 FrDavid Abernethy: page 160 starting Step 19
 
00:38:58 sharonfisher: Yes, agree, but we’re not taught properly. (Re:genuflecting) Our western church has cradle Orthodox attendees from time to time. The grace of this one woman’s entrance and adoration was truly beautiful. I asked how she ‘learned’, but sh said she’d just grown up  with the reverence displayed.
 
00:42:15 sharonfisher: We need a manual to get us started! lol
 
00:43:15 Anthony: The older generation was taught a kind of theology that emphasizes human community.  So I think they were misled, thinking they are doing right by having socialization in church.
 
00:48:09 Lawrence Martone: Re: solitary prayer”for the very few’”  Some Third Order members are required to pray the office daily and spend at least 30 minutes in mental prayer daily - along with other requirements (but not under the pain of sin if missed).  Only at monthly meetings can we pray lauds or vespers in community.  Basically, we have no choice but to pray in solitude for the most part.
Isn’t that true of most lay people also?
 
00:51:51 Louise: Basically, demons are trying to make us turn our attention away from the Beloved. Yet, our present culture is ferociously made up of distractions, engineered with distractions.
 
00:52:26 TFredman: Replying to "Re: solitary prayer”..."
 
We used to pray Vespers following the 5:15 p.m. Mass Mon-Sat. This was a great blessing to us lay folk. I miss it.
 
00:52:58 Barbara: Would that we would become attentive to one another!
 
00:54:07 Lori Hatala: I find it frustrating when the windows are being closed before the priest even leaves the alter.
 
00:54:10 sharonfisher: Replying to "Re: solitary prayer”..."
 
Does attending live streamed services count? (Hoping yes)
 
00:54:57 Lawrence Martone: Replying to "Re: solitary prayer”..."
 
To TFredman,
 
00:55:08 Anthony: We can thank (intentional?) city planning and the heresy of Americanism for harming ethnic Catholic identity.
 
00:55:18 Lawrence Martone: Replying to "Re: solitary prayer”..."
 
Yes, I would feel the same way.
 
00:55:29 Ambrose Little, OP: Replying to "Re: solitary prayer”..."
 
Certainly it is better to pray alone than not at all. As one such 3rd order member, I have found the Office to be a tremendous anchor to my spiritual life—even though in most cases I am alone.
 
00:55:47 Lori Hatala: I tend to go to silent prayer when someone leading  or loudly praying is rushing through it.
 
00:58:09 Ambrose Little, OP: Replying to "Re: solitary prayer”..."
 
There’s a benefit to individual prayer in that there is time to pause and meditate on things that strike you. Can’t really do that in community.
 
00:58:52 Bonnie Lewis: Reacted to "Certainly it is bett..." with ❤️
 
00:59:05 Bonnie Lewis: Reacted to "There’s a benefit to..." with ❤️
 
00:59:12 sue and mark: Reacted to "Certainly it is bett..." with ❤️
 
01:02:15 Susan M: I personally am very grateful for ZOOM
 
01:02:35 Kevin Burke: Reacted to "I personally am very…" with 👌
 
01:03:21 Rebecca Thérèse: I'm very grateful for Zoom and livestreamed prayer.
 
01:07:39 Lawrence Martone: Replying to "We can thank (intent..."
 
E. Michael Jones - “The Slaughter of Cities.”
 
01:08:09 sharonfisher: Reacted to "There’s a benefit to..." with ❤️
 
01:10:14 Susan M: Henri Nouwen was my teacher for 3 courses 1971-74. Very blessed time.
 
01:10:55 Paul Grazal: Reacted to "I find it frustratin…" with 😇
 
01:11:35 TFredman: Reacted to "I personally am very..." with 👌
 
01:11:39 carol: Reacted to "Henri Nouwen was my ..." with ❤️
 
01:11:45 TFredman: Reacted to "Henri Nouwen was my ..." with ❤️
 
01:13:52 Ambrose Little, OP: Reacted to "Henri Nouwen was my ..." with ❤️
 
01:14:22 Paul Grazal: Reacted to "I personally am very…" with ❤️
 
01:15:04 Cindy Moran: Great session, thank you Father
 
01:15:12 Rebecca Thérèse: thank you🙂
 
01:15:21 Rory: Thanks, father
 
01:15:21 Deiren Masterson: God bless Father
 
01:15:30 Courtney Wiley: Thank you Father.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLII, Part I

“In the deserts of the heart Let the healing fountain start.”
W.H. Auden (1907-1973) 
“The road of cleansing goes through that desert. It shall be named the way of holiness.”
Isaiah 35.8 (LXX)
It has been said that all true renewal within the life of the church comes through the desert fathers, or rather through the embrace of their wisdom. For it is not a worldly wisdom but the wisdom of the gospel, the wisdom of the kingdom that they set before us; not in an abstract fashion but through lived experience. 
The desert fathers looked deep within; precisely where Christ directs us to search for the kingdom. It’s not an easy thing to do; to look deep within oneself. Often what begins to emerge can seem ugly and repulsive to us. Sin has not left us untouched. We know its darkness, its suffering, and how it shapes the way we view ourselves, the world, and others. 
However, this inward gaze and the ascetic life aids us in seeing with a greater clarity not only our sin but the image of something beautiful beyond imagination; the soul made in the image and likeness of God, transformed and transfigured by his grace. Even in the midst of the struggle, the beauty of God‘s mercy and grace begins to manifest itself, and to reshape the human heart. We begin to understand that the perfection to which we are called is not moral perfection; nor is it the perfection of our natural virtues. It is to share in the very life of God. Christ strength is to become our strength. His virtue is to become our virtue. 
It has been said the Christ is the most beautiful of all human beings. In him, we see what we shall be through the grace of God. All that is dark in us, all that becomes an impediment to our ability to love gradually begins to fade away. We no longer cling to the demands of our own will or the pettiness of our ego. We begin to see that in Christ we have all and lack nothing. It is in this realization that we become truly free and capable of love. How beautiful!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:20 FrDavid Abernethy: Starting Hypothesis 42 page 367
 
00:13:23 FrDavid Abernethy: Starting Hypothesis 42 page 367
 
00:20:45 John: Kind of reminds me of the Jews who went out to see John the Baptist to ask who he was - though I don't think they were being critical.
 
00:20:59 Ren Witter: For Father David’s favorite comic about Stylites: https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=6720341144666823&set=pb.100000730124605.-2207520000.&type=3
 
00:21:39 John: Reacted to "For Father David’s f..." with 😂
 
00:51:35 iPhone (61): What page or book are we on Blessings
 
00:56:07 Rachel: 🤪
 
00:56:35 Rachel: I love that story.
 
00:56:37 Ren Witter: Can I say that to the next person who yells at me? “Imitate the Statue” :-D
 
00:58:46 Rachel: Fun. :/
 
00:59:06 Rachel: Reacted to "Can I say that to ..." with 👍
 
00:59:10 iPhone (61): I think we are suppose become like the statue.
 
01:02:39 Ashley Kaschl: This might be a leap in relation to this analogy with the stone statue but I have been having conversations about Filial Confidence in God. Isaiah 50:7 says, “The Lord God is my help, therefore I am not disgraced; Therefore I have set my face like flint, knowing that I shall not be put to shame.” If the monks in this passage agree to both enter into this life combatting their lower faculties which suggests doing battle against disordered sensibilities, then it also relates to the grace of an inflexible resolve that, no matter what happens to them, all is passing away compared to eternal glory in Christ; they have set their faces like flint against all struggles that may come. I think the goal, then, is to enter into ourselves and do battle so as to become docile and not react in the extremes, to repose ourselves like children in the arms of our Heavenly Father.
 
01:02:49 Rachel: You cant project it on to Christ. The all innocent and Perfect One.
 
01:05:16 Rachel: Reacted to "This might be a le..." with ❤️
 
01:05:33 Ashley Kaschl: Yes! That is what I meant by docile as well. Not a
passivity but one who can be directed or taught as you said 😁🙏
 
01:07:44 Alexandra K: Reacted to "This might be a leap..." with 👍
 
01:08:56 John: A bit ironic that flint produces a spark when struck by steel or something similar. However, docility implies that this spark is not anger, but charity.
 
01:09:08 iPhone (61): Guilty of all these that you mentioned.  I am grateful
 
01:09:15 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "A bit ironic that fl…" with 🔥
 
01:11:16 Alexandra K: Reacted to "A bit ironic that fl..." with 👍
 
01:12:22 Sheila Applegate: Reacted to "A bit ironic that fl..." with 🔥
 
01:12:28 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Guilty of all these …" with 💯
 
01:17:06 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father. 🙏💖
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XVIII: On Insensibility

Darkness, whatever its source, cannot be driven out or overcome by mere force of will or through reason. The fathers reveal to us a darkness that exists within the human heart like no other - insensibility. It is a deadening of the soul and the death of the mind before the death of the body. We all have our vulnerabilities and have experienced wounds on both spiritual and emotional levels. To address this darkness requires an even greater trust in the grace of God to guide us through it and to provide us with what is necessary for healing. Each person is unique and with certain predispositions, including the predisposition to a more melancholic or morose state of mind. Furthermore, the human mind and heart are ever so changeable. 
It is also how the evil one can use these things to distort our vision of reality. We can be engaged in the religious and spiritual life and speaking about it and yet this can mask not only a sham piety but something even darker. We can live in the dark so long that it becomes the place of comfort. To move toward the light can be painful, especially if one has experienced trauma. 
More than any of the passions the remedy for this darkness consists of relying upon the grace of God and being drawn into the tenderness of Christ’s love. When our trust has been destroyed, we must allow Him to rebuild it. Where desire has been lost, we must wait for the Beloved to come to us to stir it into flame. Where wounds are so deep that they seem irreparable, it is only He who is the Lord of Life who can re-create us.
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:13:51 Susan M: Thank you for introducing me to the Optina Monastery and Elders! Am buying the recommended book.
 
00:26:47 John: Are all these internal contradictions the same as hypocrisy, or is that a different malady?
 
00:39:22 sharonfisher: That’s so interesting. I find myself unwilling to be around these really negative people. I love them, but I have my own issues battling depression. It’s hard to do both at once.
 
00:50:23 Ren Witter: I wonder - would these people really appear very negative on the exterior? So much of the description involves teaching or speaking, and most often those who take up that role are very dynamic and charismatic personalities. It seems like the melancholy aspect might kind of hidden.
 
01:01:36 Kate: Fr. David, Is this also known as sloth?  Or is that a different vice?
 
01:01:41 Ren Witter: I’ve been told that this, or something very similar to it, can be caused by a traumatic event - particularly one involving the Church in some way. Are fasting and vigils still the only way to begin fighting it in that case?
 
01:06:20 Ren Witter: “He and I” is also a very good one.
 
01:06:43 carol nypaver: Can you please repeat the name of the French priest and his book?
 
01:07:21 Louise: Gaston Courtois is the name of the French priest.
 
01:07:31 carol nypaver: Thank you!
 
01:09:32 David Swiderski: My experience is this often is connected to resentment and lack of detachment. Anyone digging up wounds from the past or worrying about the future cannot help themselves from falling into despair.
 
01:13:25 Louise: In my clinical experience, it was my willingness as a psychotherapist to be there with the, to remain with them despite the intensity of their pain, which was healing - I did not abandon them as they were experiencing abandonment depression from early childhood.
 
01:17:10 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:17:10 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:17:15 David Swiderski: Thanks father!
 
01:17:17 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLI, Part III

The conclusion of hypothesis 41 was as beautiful as it was convicting. The fathers speak of a stability of mind and heart that deepens through the ascetic life and allows us to see the most subtle movements either toward or away from God. This subtlety of perception is unmatched in the spiritual tradition. The ascetic life revealed to the fathers not only sin and its manifestations, but the power of God’s grace to transform our lives in such a way that every impediment is removed that prevents us from loving unconditionally. The ascetical life is not an end in itself. It allows us to “ascend the cross”, the fathers tell us. The purity of heart that is achieved through it, the freedom from the passions, allows us to love in a self-emptying fashion, and to truly abandon ourselves to the will of God. Every illusion is set aside and one gradually comes to see with greater and greater clarity that “all is grace”. It is then that the desire for God compels us in our every word, thought, and action!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:25:38 Anthony: Perhaps something should be allowed for different characters or temperaments. Maybe this is a reason Westerners have different orders.
 
00:30:05 Louise: Was the Ethiopian a demon or a hallucination?
 
00:43:12 maureencunningham: Longest road is from the head to heart
 
00:50:34 Ernest: So doesn’t it help to have a spiritual director to regularly guide your path.
 
00:54:06 John: There's a book called "Talking Back" by Evagrius which has a variation of mocking evil thoughts: he supplies verses of Scripture against a whole variety of evil thoughts.
 
01:07:53 Ernest: But doesn’t one experience these higher gifts, greater than earthly bread, when one receives Holy Communion…the real presence of Jesus?
 
01:10:52 Louise: In the Sufi mystical tradition, the disciple-to-be had to wash the latrine for 5 years, and only that. Afterward, he could attend the meetings with the Sufi master, where he was mostly bashed, laughed at, lied to, publicly humiliated, etc. while love was produced in his heart. What a way to chose the heart!
 
01:12:44 Paul Grazal: +1
 
01:17:30 Paul Grazal: Amen.  Thank you Father
 
01:18:56 maureencunningham: Beautifully said Thank You.
 
01:19:25 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 
01:19:28 Lorraine Green: Thank you very much Father
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XVI: On Avarice, Part II and Chapter XVII, On Non-Possessiveness, Part I

Freedom! We often associate this word with our own rights in this world or our capacity to do as we will and go where we want. A kind of promise is put out to us - life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness. 
Yet the image of freedom that is put before us by the saints and by Saint John in particular is attached to our willingness to be “detached” from the things of the world. God created all things good but in our sin our tendency is to idolize them. We seek our identity and happiness in the things of this world and we work ourselves to the point of exhaustion to protect these things as well as ourselves from others. We do not want to lose what we have or what we have earned. 
Yet we very quickly learn that this is no real happiness. In fact, it is the root of all evils. The deeper that root becomes, the greater our desire for the things of this world grows. It begins to produce the fruit of hatred, thefts, envy, separations, enmities, storms, remembrance of wrong, hardheartedness, and murderers. Therefore, what we hold up as having so much value for ourselves, and what seems to promise us freedom and safety eventually becomes our prison or the shackles that bind us. It is only in having tasted the things above that one begins to find joy, freedom from care, and the loss of anxiety. If we obtain this virtue, John tells us, we run the race with the swiftness of athletes of old - that is, stripped and unimpeded. 
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Text of chat during the group:
00:11:00 Rebecca Thérèse: Yes happy birthday!
 
00:11:34 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Yes happy birthday!" with 🎂
 
00:15:23 Lawrence Martone: Fr. Abernethy,
 
00:15:50 Lawrence Martone: What is your opinion of The Noon Day Devil book?
 
00:22:32 Connor: Re: point 1 - Prayer of the Last Optina Elders:
 
O Lord, grant me to greet the coming day in peace, help me in all things to rely upon your holy will. 
In every hour of the day reveal your will to me.
Bless my dealings with all who surround me. 
Teach me to treat all that comes to throughout the day with peace of soul and with firm conviction that your will governs all. 
In all my deeds and words, guide my thoughts and feelings. 
In unforeseen events, let me not forget that all are sent by you. 
Teach me to act firmly and wisely, without embittering and embarrassing others. 
Give me strength to bear the fatigue of the coming day with all that it shall bring. 
Direct my will, teach me to pray. 
And you, yourself, pray in me. 
Amen.
 
00:26:01 Susan M: Father, who are the last Optina Elders?
 
00:28:04 Connor: Guess I’m the quote guy today:
 
“All our peace in this sad life lieth in humble suffering rather than in not feeling adversities. He who best knoweth how to suffer shall possess the most peace; that man is conqueror of himself and lord of the world, the friend of Christ, and the inheritor of heaven.” — a Kempis (Imitation of Christ)
 
00:31:14 Eric Ewanco: Do we know the Greek for "non-possessive" (my translation uses "poor"/"poverty" but I like your translation better)?
 
00:31:52 Connor: Replying to "Father, who are the …"
“Over the course of one century—from Elder Leonid's arrival in 1829 until the Monastery's forced closure by the Communists in 1923—Optina, with its Skete of St. John the Forerunner, was at the center of a tremendous spiritual revival in Russia.”
 
https://orthochristian.com/65171.html
 
00:31:59 John: Replying to "Do we know the Greek..."
 
So does mine (archive.org).
 
00:32:39 Connor: I was responding to a question Father, no need to read it lol.
 
00:35:18 Susan M: Thank you.
 
00:37:14 Connor: Replying to "Do we know the Greek…"
ἀκτημοσύνης in response to Greek for non-possessiveness. Literally “landless.”
 
00:45:31 Anthony: To forget the Beatific Vision is to merely fight the devil mostly conscious of your own efforts.  Been there.  Done that / Doing that. Not healthy.
 
00:52:44 Connor: St. Louis de Montfort famously got into bar fights over Our Lady’s honor… even after his ordination…
 
00:57:03 Anthony: Regarding "principles" in our Anglo-American world it seems to me some of our principles have been developed and used to harden us against conscience and towards vice.
 
00:57:16 Louise: I find that it is mostly the human gesture and the smile in return that is the gift, beyond the money given; the person feels treated as a human being at this moment.
 
00:57:41 Anthony: Reacted to "I find that it is mo..." with ❤️
 
00:57:49 Anthony: Replying to "I find that it is mo..." 
 
I agree
 
01:18:40 Cindy Moran: Thank you
 
01:18:43 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part XI and Chapter XVI: On Avarice, Part I

The Mystery of the Human Person! 
What comes forward in the ascetical writings of the fathers is not a moralistic or legalistic view of sin. Rather, we see within them a deep understanding of the complex beauty and dignity of the human person despite often being marred by sin. Perhaps too often we emphasize the negative; rather than fostering a desire both for God and for virtue and for the freedom and joy that it brings to the human heart. 
Like so many of the fathers, Saint John describes certain passions as a disease in need of remedy. While we must be disciplined in so many ways and vigilant in our thoughts, we never want to lose sight of how God has created us; that it is through our very being that we love and give ourselves in love. We are not meant to hate ourselves but rather sin. Self-contempt can often be our demise in the spiritual life. True love of the self begins with the desire for God; not with self-indulgence or laziness that reduces and diminishes the image we have of creation and our own goodness.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:12:42 Ashley Kaschl: I was trying to say we have a diocesan hermit so if you DO want to stay, he’s got room haha
 
00:34:50 Louise: An amazing movie just came out, called 'Sound of Freedom, about combatting child sex trafficking. Being a trauma therapist myself, I can only fathom that pedophilia is due to demonic influence. These people are untreatable. What are your thoughts?
 
00:35:22 carol nypaver: It was a very informative and well-done film!
 
00:36:43 David Swiderski: Doesn't abuse of food or lust devalue these things. I know when I break a long fast water taste sweeter, food is savored and so when we truly develop love rather than just physical attraction or objectification. The diamond is often hidden by the dirt on the outside.
 
00:39:33 Louise: By the way, 2.5% of priests abuse children sexually, 5% of physicians, and 10% of school teachers, according to three studies.
 
00:44:21 Art: What do you mean Father?
 
00:55:03 Charbel & Justin: “Prefer nothing to the love of God.”
 
01:10:59 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy! I must go.
 
01:12:17 Ashley Kaschl: I am friends with many people who are constantly worried about money, about their paychecks, jobs, etc. and it prevents them from choosing to move forward in their potential vocations, so they put it off and put it off and put it off. I think some of the downsides of our culture, and even the mindset of many who come out of universities today, is this absolute concern about climbing the ladder in their jobs or this habit formed to always look for “greener grass”/better opportunities. And this demand of function over substance makes me think of a quote by CS Lewis: 
 
“In a sort of ghastly simplicity we remove the organ and demand the function. We make men without chests and expect of them virtue and enterprise. We laugh at honour and are shocked to find traitors in our midst. We castrate and bid the geldings be fruitful.”
 
01:16:42 John: There's an old Rod Serling movie about the corporate mindset (ladder-climbing) called "Patterns."
 
01:17:16 Monk Maximos: Good night
 
01:17:51 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you ☺️
 
01:17:53 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:17:56 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:18:04 Art: Thank you!
 
01:18:17 Jeff O.: 🎉🎉🎉
 
01:18:22 Monk Maximos: Flying to the Holy Land on Saturday. Will be praying for you.
 
01:18:30 David Swiderski: Have a wonderful Birthday Father!
 
01:18:34 Eric Ewanco: happy birthday!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLI, Part II

Avoidance: often this can be the fundamental reason that an individual gravitates towards solitude, religious, or otherwise. We do not want to be in the presence of others, because it is there that we stand revealed - not only in their eyes, but in our own. In our interactions with others, we begin to see our dominant passions and the poverty of our sin. Our weak spots, blind spots and hard spots become perfectly evident to us. It is for this reason that the desert fathers counsel spending many years in the common life because it is there that true purification takes place. It is in our day-to-day struggle with the movement of our own thoughts and emotions and interactions with others, that sin is overcome and virtue begins to grow. To flee into solitude, prematurely, and even with the highest spiritual aspirations, promises only danger. It is perilous to enter into deep silence alone. If one falls, there is no one to pick them up. If one is swallowed up by delusion, there is no one to set them aright. How can we repent without having the other as one to whom we can direct our compassion or who reveals our darker side? 
Silence can never be an escape. In fact, silence can only be loved by one who has been freed from every impediment in order to encounter He who is Love and find true respite and peace in Him. 
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:04:13 FrDavid Abernethy: page 359 Letter C From Abba Mark
 
00:04:17 FrDavid Abernethy: Welcome Sandy
 
00:11:11 FrDavid Abernethy: page 359 Letter C
 
00:15:40 Cindy Moran: Is this like a consecrated virgin?
 
00:26:06 LauraLeigh: Replying to "Is this like a conse..."
 
Cindy, I think it is probably different, in that you can continue to live in the world in any way you feel called as a consecrated virgin, but I believe that being a hermit involves deliberately leaving the world to live apart, yet following the monastic rule. Maybe Father can add or correct this.
 
00:27:38 Cindy Moran: Thank you!
 
00:27:39 LauraLeigh: Replying to "Is this like a conse..."
 
Your diocesan office will probably have someone who can answer questions about both.
 
00:27:50 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "Thank you!" with 👍
 
00:31:41 Rachel: This reminds me of Saint Paul stating that he doesn't even judge himself. Years ago this statement left me wondering at what he meant and have now come to believe that what Cassian is saying is the same thing that Saint Paul was saying. He had a thorn in the flesh, knew a man taken up to the third Heaven yet does not even judge himself. Not even stopping to examen himself except to boast in his weakness in order to glorify God's great mercy.
 
00:32:15 LauraLeigh: Seems like, whether in community or as a hermit, one needs to be prepared to be a "plucky fighter"!
 
00:32:22 Eric Ewanco: Can you relate these eremitic hazards to ordinary laymen who live involuntarily alone but in the world? Obviously some hazards apply, but some may not. Can you comment?
 
00:32:39 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "Can you relate these..." with 👍
 
00:32:55 LauraLeigh: Replying to "Can you relate these..."
 
This is my question too.
 
00:38:05 LauraLeigh: The thing is, though, about living alone in the world, you know very well that there is no one there to catch you when you fall. Everything
 
00:45:47 Anthony: I suggest that maybe women have more living examples of a secular spiritual life since widows with their maturity and their link to other widows are more common than widowers
 
00:45:51 Anthony: Grand torino
 
00:46:25 Eric Ewanco: Oh that's where that came from! I've used that. :-)
 
00:52:47 LauraLeigh: Thank you for not running off to a cabin in the woods, Father.
 
00:53:26 melissa kummerow: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru..." with 👆
 
00:54:12 Anthony: Sometimes I think we try too hard to be good Catholics, so hard that we dispel that peace we might otherwise have if we didn't try so hard , since trying too hard can focus us on our turbulent selves. Perhaps it's to have a hobby and cigar and an occasional prayer than making and measuring ourselves against a lot of self imposed religious obligations.
 
00:56:55 Eric Ewanco: With all due respect to Tolkien, I'd rather live under corrupt government than anarchy.
 
00:57:21 sue and mark: Reacted to "Sometimes I think we..." with ❤️
 
00:58:09 Patrick: Reacted to "Sometimes I think ..." with ❤️
 
01:09:39 Anthony: Or by taking obligation to pray and fast because you're going to fight evil......that _can_ lead to obsessive type of behavior for an ostensibly good reason. It's perhaps like a modern day "Children's Crusade."
 
01:12:34 John: Yesterday's Gueranger article talks about exterior-only asceticism: "The Jewish casuists were not slow in drawing up their famous formula, that all moral goodness was guaranteed to him that had received circumcision! St. Paul, later on, told them how such a principle was a stumbling-block to the Gentiles, leading them to blaspheme the name of God. According to the moral theology of these Hebrew doctors, conscience meant only what the tribunal of public justice issued as its decisions: the obligations of the interior tribunal of a man’s conscience were to be restricted to the rules followed by the assize-courts. The result of such teaching soon showed itself: the only thing people need care for was what was seen by men; if the fault were not one that human eyes could judge of, you were not to trouble about it."
 
01:17:24 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:18:22 sue and mark: Thank you
 
01:18:32 Rachel: Thank you
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part X

The fathers have often been accused of having a negative anthropology; that is, a negative view of the human person and human nature. However, as we read through St. John’s teachings on chastity and purity, we begin to see that their understanding arises from a very high and exalted anthropology. Their understanding of how God has made us, the beauty that is expressed in our very nature is so high that we must respect its preciousness as a gift from God. Furthermore we must also respect the power that lies within us and that it is through this nature that we are able to love and give ourselves in love to others and serve God. 
 
Indeed, it is true that sin has darkened our vision of this truth and our will has often become weak so that we misuse our nature and the appetites associated with it. Yet, God looks upon us with mercy and compassion and gives us every aid for healing. It is the Evil One that becomes our accuser who tries through shame to draw us into despair. 
 
Part of the relentless nature of our struggle with these sins is that we are forever bound by nature to this body of ours. Yet we must remember in the struggle that the body is destined to put on immortality and incorruptibility by God’s grace. We are called all even now to make use of our body through the ascetic life to share in this incorruptibility through purity of heart.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:03:31 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: What step?
 
00:03:59 FrDavid Abernethy: Page 151 paragraph 76
 
00:20:36 Anthony: I wonder if "worm" means not the helpful compost bug, but is really the Anglo Saxon "wyrm" or dragon.
 
00:26:32 melissa kummerow: Reacted to "I wonder if "worm" m..." with 💡
 
00:27:51 Louise: Disgust and shame are useful emotions when we apply them onto our faults. Otherwise, we justify our faults. Would you say?
 
00:30:36 LauraLeigh: It seems to me that St Climacas, like other Desert Fathers, ask for a very difficult mental balance between being uber-humble while maintaining a healthy psychology. If you don't have a strong grip on your mental health, this ascetical lifestyle could trip you up or even take you down. Other than recommending a guide, like an elder, any thoughts about how we can cautiously yet profitably practice asceticism?
 
00:31:20 Anthony: I learned something,  I think from a talk by a Maronite. It can be helpful to pray Jesus Prayer in another language.  Sometimes that prevents thoughts in one's native tongue from arising in the mind.
 
00:34:39 LauraLeigh: I need to remember that the Fathers are talking to others already in the ascetical life. And then to remember to order everything toward God.
 
00:35:46 sue and mark: could it be said that simply looking for opportunities to practice self -restraint for the love of God is a good place to start.  especially in the areas of our passions.
 
00:36:06 angelo: Reacted to "could it be said tha..." with 👍
 
00:42:13 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "could it be said tha..." with ❤️
 
00:43:01 LauraLeigh: "The Way of the Ascetics"
 
00:46:46 carol nypaver: The Little Flower
 
00:52:15 Anthony: Remember: the demons don't play fair.
 
00:53:24 Cindy Moran: In the Classics of western spirituality version of the Ladder this verse translation is unclear to me
 
00:54:11 Cindy Moran: Yes.
 
00:54:40 Cindy Moran: I'm slow
 
00:56:14 Cindy Moran: Because the soul tormented by earlier sin is a burden to me I will save it from its enemies Lk 18:5
 
00:59:15 Cindy Moran: Much clearer to me now
 
01:05:31 LauraLeigh: Being proud of your sins is a sign of a darkened conscience, I think. And a sensitive and refined conscience is a great help in getting a handle on troubling or persistent sins. This is what I'm particularly working on.
 
01:06:36 angelo: Reacted to "Being proud of your ..." with 👍
 
01:08:26 Anthony: I think it also means that you've entrusted yourself to God,  He won't play legal games with that trust and so the evil thoughts are not as awful upon us as the devil wants us to think. Sure the devil is a deceiver and wants us to take full mortal sin culpability for what the demons sows.  But the struggle is evidence God loves you and takes your whole self and situation into account.
 
01:09:25 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "I think it also mean..." with ❤️
 
01:10:30 angelo: Reacted to "I think it also mean..." with 👍
 
01:10:37 Eric Ewanco: I've found it immensely consoling that empirical evidence from exorcisms establish that demons are extremely legalistic. The converse of this is that God is not. This is a great relief to me, as we often tend to see God as legalistic and looking for "gotchas"
 
01:12:08 John: After you've read Fr. Mateo's "Night Adoration in the Home," it's impossible to think of God as legalistic. He is the complete opposite!
 
01:12:21 sue and mark: Reacted to "After you've read Fr..." with ❤️
 
01:12:34 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "After you've read Fr..." with ❤️
 
01:12:50 LauraLeigh: Replying to "After you've read Fr..."
 
I have that! Thanks for the reminder!
 
01:13:05 Susan McShane: Reacted to "I've found it immens..." with ❤️
 
01:13:05 John: Replying to "After you've read Fr..."
 
👍
 
01:13:23 sue and mark: I have that too...
 
01:14:53 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:54 Louise: Thanks, Fr!
 
01:14:58 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...excellent session
 
01:15:02 Jeff O.: Thank you! Blessings
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part VII and Hypothesis XLI, Part I

In the advertisement for and description of this evening’s group, I wrote: “How does one deal with feelings of desolation in regards to one’s vocation, resentment towards others, being treated with envy or finding one’s circumstances to be a source of temptation? In the face of the many trials brought upon us by the evil one, great perseverance is needed and freedom from self will.”  This description, however, does not capture the depth of the wisdom that we were exposed to this evening. All of our asceticism, all the ways that we seek to remove the impediment of our passions, all the ways that we seek to remain focused upon the spiritual battle that lies within the heart has one end: to bring us to the place where we can enter into the Paschal Mystery in union with Christ. Not one of us should seek to leave the training, ground of the spiritual life prematurely or to choose to rest before God grants it. For it is precisely in this battle that all that remains an impediment to our ascending the cross with Christ is removed. Abba Isaiah, in the richest and most beautiful interpretation of the Passion, unpacks for us the meaning of every experience of our Lord; not that we might reflect upon it in an abstract fashion, but that we would take hold of His experiences as our own. We engage in the ascetical life not to reach the kind of moral perfection or emotional Nirvana but rather that we might reach the place where we can ascend the Cross with Christ. Once we are delivered from all of these things, we pass through our own Passion Week and enter into another, new age, thinking new and incorrupt thoughts. We are reminded of St. Paul’s words, “set your affection on things above, not on things on the earth. For you’re dead.“ We leave our sins behind and find mercy together with those who are worthy of Him!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:10:59 FrDavid Abernethy: page 353 paragraph 4
 
00:11:16 FrDavid Abernethy: And Elder said: “Just as a tree . . . .
 
00:32:56 Anthony: I suggest that the various revolutions, including the American,  were designed to uproot a stable society.  The mass migrations of the late 1800s to 1900s were caused by Socialist governments displacing their peasants. This uprooted stability and is a root of our mental and moral afflictions today.
 
00:36:36 Anthony: The honest peasant is an essential character for Solzhenitsyn.
 
00:37:05 Louise: Focus
 
00:37:07 Anthony: Vanishing point
 
00:37:40 Zoom user: True North
 
00:37:54 Carol: touchstone
 
00:40:59 Anthony: The reformation was a symptom of society failing in its "monastic " vocation.
 
00:48:48 Louise: Sartre
 
00:50:38 Louise: Ste-Thérèse-de-Lisieux forced herself to hang out with the most annoying nun in the convent in order to confront her impatience and find her deeper loving kindness.
 
01:19:37 Louise: Thank you, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:19:43 sheri: Thank you.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part IX

Gustave Flaubert once wrote, “God is in the details.“ The truth of this statement is born out in this evening‘s writing from Saint John Climacus on the fathers’ understanding and description of the development of a passion within the soul. With great clarity, St. John takes us step-by-step through the inner movements of the mind and the heart. The battle begins with an assault. An image or an idea is encountered for the first time and enters into the heart. There’s no sin in this, but our response is important nonetheless. If we begin to converse with the image or idea its presence will take us a step further. We cannot allow ourselves to linger with such images even if we do not seem to be moved by them. Eventually, Saint John tells us, if we do linger we can fall into consent; the soul bends down, as it were, and begins to take delight in the temptation. Such temptations can also come upon us with force; seeking all at once to destroy any semblance of order or peace within the heart. What is important is that we struggle; that we engage in the spiritual battle and fight with equal or greater force against what seeks to afflict us. A passion develops whenever a sin nestles with persistence in the soul and forms a habit. It is then that the sins has put down deep roots and begins to guide and direct our decisions and actions. The passion is unequivocally condemned in every case.  St. John tells us, therefore, that we must seek to cut off the first assault with a single blow in order to prevent everything that might follow.
Finally, Saint John reveals to us just how humble we must be in the spiritual warfare. There are temptations that can come to us that he describes as a “flick of the mind”. They are instantaneous and inapprehensible.  There can be something in our life that triggers a memory or movement from the depths of our unconscious.  It gives rise to or stirs a passion that has not been healed, but merely buried. All of this teaches us that our desire must be directed toward God and God alone. The human heart can be a treacherous thing, and as the prophet asks, “who can trust it?“ It is God alone who we must trust. We must hope in his promises and the grace that he offers us from moment to moment. This is our path to healing.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:15 FrDavid Abernethy: page 150 para 72
 
00:15:34 angelo: Reacted to "page 150 para 72" with 👍
 
00:19:25 Daniel Allen: Joined a little late, where are we at?
 
00:19:40 Bonnie Lewis: 72
 
00:19:55 Daniel Allen: Thank you
 
00:20:05 Bonnie Lewis: Reacted to "Thank you" with 👍🏻
 
00:20:37 Anthony: Read Agatha Christie, and this doesn't seem to strange.
 
00:40:17 Lawrence Martone: Pope Shenouda says “Be aware then, of the first step toward sin and run for your life.  You are not stronger than Adam…”
 
00:40:49 carol nypaver: 😲
 
00:43:16 Louise: Would you say that repentance involves feeling pain from having hurt another? This pain thus becomes a stimulus to possibly prevent the future repetition of this sin.
 
00:52:31 Anthony: A person can be so focused on avoiding temptation that the person's psychology or demons or something else can constantly bring to mind the thing to be avoided - kind of making the temptation always present.  Maybe it's an after-effect of eating from the tree we were not to eat.
 
01:06:49 Cindy Moran: Going postal
 
01:07:34 LauraLeigh: Blindsided.
 
01:10:31 Rory: May I speak
 
01:10:55 Patrick: Fr. David, can you please clarify the meaning of 'dispassion' in the last sentence of 15.74? Is it synonymous with asceticism in this context?
 
01:11:18 Anthony: But is he saying the flick of the mind actual moral guilt?  How much of this fault, how much is over-focus on the self?  Be focused too much on this, be too sensitive, and you can go nutty, not be a "man fully alive."  That's surely not good.  Our Lord was supremely sensitive to good and evil, but He was also self-possessed. 
It's possible even these saints went a little self-obsessed and accidentally project that forward to us.  It interferes with life to always be aware of every possibly evil and continually feel guilty.
 
01:16:31 Daniel Allen: How does this relate to Christ saying, “Do not let your heart be troubled. Believe in God, believe in Me also.”
 
01:17:54 Daniel Allen: To expand on that question, if a flick of the mind can cast us into sin without any noticeable stimulus how does one not become troubled?
 
01:18:39 Ren Witter: Replying to "How does this relate..."
 
Maybe the context of that is pretty important in this case. At that moment he is speaking about his crucifixion. At the same time, he also says of the peace he wants his disciples to have: “not as the world gives it do I give it to you."
 
01:20:40 David Swiderski: One must quiet the mind to hear the voice of God who is like a whisper on the wind while the devil is a constant irritating  and rattling of the passions.
 
01:21:07 Bonnie Lewis: Reacted to "One must quiet the m..." with 👍🏻
 
01:21:35 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:22:14 Cindy Moran: Replying to "How does this relate..." 
 
 Thank you Father!
 
01:22:23 David Swiderski: Thank you Father!
 
01:22:25 Bonnie Lewis: So beautiful.  Thank you Father David.
 
01:22:28 kevin: thanks Ren and Fr
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part VIII

The beauty of virtue! So often we discuss the spiritual life as if the main goal or the end of it is simply the avoidance of sin. While avoiding sin certainly is essential, we are called to something far greater. What we received through the Paschal mystery and through our baptism is adoption as sons and daughters of God; the capacity by grace to share in the life of the Trinity. The fathers speak of deification. 
 
As we read through Saint John’s description of purity and chastity, these truths begin to manifest themselves. We engage in this constant struggle with our own appetites and with the temptations from the demons not simply to avoid sin, but to give and receive love in the way God intended; for that love to be rightly ordered and also, by grace, to become something that is supernatural. 
 
We are to love one another as Christ has loved us. It is often very difficult for us to understand this because more often than not we have never tasted the fruit of this virtue. We are surrounded by its opposite; and often have been immersed in that which is impure for most of our lives. Yet, even as we struggle for this virtue, we must not fall into a purely moralistic or legalistic view of life. It is through entering into the love of Christ and receiving that love through the holy Eucharist, that we are given the capacity to love in a selfless fashion. Furthermore, it is also through this Grace that we become capable of receiving such love without any impediment. May God open our eyes to the beauty of the life that He is made possible for us and the beauty of virtue!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:08:51 FrDavid Abernethy: page 149 para 63
 
00:10:20 FrDavid Abernethy: page 149 para 63 “When we are in the world for some necessity”
 
00:35:38 Louise: If King David repented, why did his kingdom went down so badly via his descendance (Solomon)?
 
00:45:49 Eric Ewanco: He's referring to Peter who Scripture said had a mother-in-law
 
00:48:07 Lawrence Martone: Regarding the question on David, I would highly recommend:
 
00:48:51 angelo: Reacted to "452E4EA7-2A85-4B45-9031-4D3B09714915_1_102_a.jpeg" with 👍
 
00:49:43 Louise: Thanks to both!
 
00:52:06 Cindy Moran: Reacted to "452E4EA7-2A85-4B45-9031-4D3B09714915_1_102_a.jpeg" with 👍
 
00:52:18 TFredman: Reacted to "452E4EA7-2A85-4B45-9031-4D3B09714915_1_102_a.jpeg" with 👍
 
00:53:45 angelo: Replying to "452E4EA7-2A85-4B45-9031-4D3B09714915_1_102_a.jpeg"
 
it is free on pdf file in St. Philopateer Coptic Orthodox website.
 
01:02:32 Anthony: Long ingrained habits can be at play.  In NY, I remember Talk Radio or Frank Sinatra etc often being in the background.  It can be uncomfortable not to have something in the background.
 
01:08:16 Cindy Moran: Th orthodox seem to have more involved night prayer in their books.
 
01:13:13 Cindy Moran: I've done that at times...LOL
 
01:15:19 Rebecca Thérèse: Until very recently it was common for everyone to have two sleeps broken by some kind of activity in the middle of the night even including going out and visiting others
 
01:18:12 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...Happy Father's Day, too!
 
01:18:17 angelo: thank you
 
01:18:19 TFredman: Thank you Fr. Abernethy and everyone!
 
01:18:19 Jeff O.: thank you!
 
01:18:19 David Swiderski: Thank you
 
01:18:22 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:18:28 kevin: Thank you
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part VI

Stability of mind and heart: such are the characteristics of those who live the ascetic life. The mystery of the human person is such that we must suspend judgment of others as well as judgment of ourselves. 
On a psychological level, things are multi- determined. In other words, many things coalesce to form our thoughts and actions. Therefore, we must be very cautious in the spiritual life not to act quickly when tempted to leave our state of life or vocation. The change of mere externals does not bring healing. The passions that often drive us in the way that we view circumstances and others are only healed through persevering through many trials. 
We are ever so changeable. This is our great struggle and vulnerability, but it is also what allows us to repent. When we see our own sin or when we come to recognize the truth or when an illusion is revealed, we can turn toward God and cling to him and the healing he alone offers. “The Lord is an eternal rock”, the Scriptures tell us. Therefore, we must rest upon him. In him alone do we begin to experience an invincible peace and an unshakable hope.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:17:56 FrDavid Abernethy: page 351 para 11
 
00:33:42 Ambrose Little, OP: There are those who say that you are “lukewarm” if you don’t get upset about bad stuff happening in the world.
 
00:44:33 David Fraley: Reacted to "There are those who …" with 👍
 
00:47:50 Zoom user: Whoa
 
00:57:08 John Ingram: I've seen some of the psychological evaluation questions that are asked of candidates for the priesthood. They are truly bizarre and disturbing - and disconcerting.
 
00:58:40 Louise: Even in psychology departments, they do NOT use psychological evaluation for selecting PhD candidates. They are selected and evaluated only on grades.
 
00:58:48 Denise T.: This monk remained silent amidst the other monks' envy. Is it ever right to speak up for yourself and explain what you are doing? Or is it always better to remain silent when confronted with the envy of others.
 
01:04:27 Rachel: Yep
 
01:10:57 Denise T.: Thank you, Father. That is very helpful.
 
01:15:10 Rachel: Not leaving willie nilly..going to Mas. God bless!
 
01:15:17 Rachel: Mass
 
01:16:40 Louise: Thanks, Father!
 
01:16:53 Patrick Nugent, ObSB: Thank you, Father!
 
01:17:27 David Fraley: This has been a good session and a lot to think about. Thank you, Father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part VII

As we continue our reading of Step 15 on purity and chastity, gradually we are being shown a broader vision of what is offered to us through the ascetical life. Purity and chastity are not limited to dealing with our sexual appetites. Rather, we are striving to overcome any impediment to our seeing things and loving things in the manner in which God created us. Our vision is often distorted by our sin to the extent that we will objectify the things of this world and individuals to be used in whatever means we see fit. We lose sight of the dignity of the other as well as the beauty of creation. A heart that has been purified is capable of seeing the presence of God in every person, regardless of their deeds, and in every element of creation. A pure heart is the freest in its capacity to love. 
Perhaps many of us have never tasted such a thing even in the smallest measure.  It is for this reason that St. John presents us not only with aids in the battle for purity, but also with the image of the highest degree of purity  we see in saintly individuals. They are often moved to tears when their capacity to see the world and others is elevated from the purely natural to the supernatural; to see the very essence and beauty of all things created by God.
---Text of chat during the group:
00:09:33 FrDavid Abernethy: page 148 para 56
 
00:20:38 Lori Hatala: What is dwelling amongst the tombs?
 
00:21:08 Louise: They are suckling, not the breast but a bottle, nonetheless.
 
00:21:52 Anthony: St. Anthony the Great and St. Benedict were both assaulted by vivid images. It seems they are examples of struggle against the violence of images.  I think one of the Desert Mothers (Synclectica?) has a saying or two about this for women as well.
 
00:22:19 Rory: ?does God communicate through dreams?
 
00:25:46 angelo: The Jesus Prayer is also a great help.
 
00:34:51 Eric Ewanco: "a bruised reed he shall not break; a smoldering wick he shall not quench"
 
00:37:05 Patrick: St. John doesn't seem to often caution against attempting ascetical practices but seems to more often praise them. How does one balance gradually adding more over time while balancing a certain level of self-knowledge and identifying if, perhaps, it may be too much to apply a certain practice. Example: at least from my experience, vigils that impact getting a certain amount of sleep may seem to make fighting against various thoughts the next day more difficult. I suppose this must be discerned on a case-by-case basis since it seems nuanced in practice?
 
00:44:46 Nathan: I was thinking that sometimes as we 'rationally' reflect on these writings and concepts of ascesis or our various modes of living and ways of participating in the body of Christ that it helps us to remember that all of our relations and practices are to participate with Christ/Trinity in the wooing of all back into the intimate union of paradise and the kingdom - NOT so much discipline and effort but longing and love to restore full union between all and its dear God?
 
00:50:48 Rory: ?is there a presence of God in all people that can be seen?
 
00:50:50 Rachel: But perhaps it should be remembered that it is God Himself that reveals Himself in the other
 
00:52:26 Ashley Kaschl: Reminds me of a quote by Ven. Fulton Sheen: "Dear Lord, what can we, Thy followers, do to bring peace to the world? How can we stop brother rising up against brother and class against class, blurring the very sky with their cross-covered Golgathas?
Thy First Word on the Cross gives the answer: We must see in the body of every man who hates, a soul that was made to love. If we are too easily offended by their hate, it is because we have forgotten either the destiny of their souls or our own sins.
Forgive us our trespasses as we forgive those who trespass against us. Forgive us for ever having been offended. Then we, like Thee, may find among our executioners another Longinus, who had forgotten there was love in a heart until he opened it with a lance."
 
00:52:32 Rachel: That it is us who in the meantime patiently wait for Him to reveal himself, and grant this purity of heart and until then in all humilty know, that we guard our senses and hearts.. I only say this because it can be discouraging to find weakness so deeply rooted in our hearts
 
00:53:50 Nathan: Reacted to "Reminds me of a quot..." with ❣️
 
00:54:14 Ashley Kaschl: I love him 😂
 
00:54:23 Rachel: Reacted to "I love him 😂" with ❤️
 
00:54:23 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "Reminds me of a quot..." with ❤️
 
00:54:46 Louise: At the Traditional Latin Mass, there is a beautiful prayer, "Sanctus, sanctus, sanctus! Heaven and earth are full of Your glory, …Alleluia, alleluia."
 
00:55:20 carol nypaver: Reacted to "I love him 😂" with 🥰
 
00:55:33 Rory: Jesus spoke of the Samaritan who helps the man on the road who was beaten, as an example of how we treat our neighbor as ourselves
 
00:55:37 Rachel: This was meant to be attached to the other comment but the class moves faster than I can type +)
 
00:56:00 Ann Grimak: Reacted to "Reminds me of a quot…" with ❣️
 
01:00:21 Ashley Kaschl: That quote is either from his anthologies or from the little book of his sermons on the last seven words called “The Seven Capital Sins” it would be under the reflections on Anger/Wrath
 
01:00:53 Anthony: Maybe it would help to distinguish the different meanings of "sin" in the Bible and the Fathers.  It seems to me that one meaning is our general inclination to evil, another is entertaining what is wrong, another is doing what is wrong, another is "mortal sin."  These meanings maybe can get mixed up in our thinking about the Faith.  Sometimes the meaning "sin" seems univocal, but places like 1st John indicate that there are lots of meanings of "sin."
 
01:02:08 Jeff O.: Reacted to "Maybe it would help ..." with 👍
 
01:03:32 Rachel: What I was trying to touch upon was how we are supposed to see the other. With purity of heart. Amma Syncletica prayed that her heart would be pure towards all. This got me thinking many years ago about what that means. The purity of heart that Saint Climacus is speaking of is something rarely ever spoken of because many are stuck on the surface or, dont really know what it truly means to objectify the other. It is not only speaking in terms of lust but, there can be many ways in which we only seek ourselves and so God will not reveal himself or, we are incapable of seeing him in the other because our hearts have not been healed.
 
01:03:57 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "What I was trying to…" with ❤️
 
01:04:41 Rachel: I was trying to touch upon St. John speaking of how a soul in that state like Amma Sybcletica is speaking of does not pray that her heart be pure towards all so she may feel better about herself but so that she may see God, this side of the veil.
 
01:06:22 Rachel: Yes, just as you said Father, very simply. So she may love Him.
 
01:13:01 Louise: Thanks so much!
 
01:13:02 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:13:41 Nathan: Thank you so much (and for the Pentecost retreat) and
the so many many careful prayerful readings you guide us through
 
01:13:42 Rory: what is the email address? 
Have a good night
 
01:13:46 Michael Abele: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:49 Nathan: Replying to "Maybe it would help ..."
 
'inclination to evil'?  Guess I had understood that both evil and sin were swerves or mistaken applications of the good - not anything in themselves - but twistings of what is good in means or ends or fulfillments of the 'true' desire that evokes the activity?  Ascesis and 'purification' are to reorder these aims aright (in union with God)?  I had thunk - finding the fullness of the misguided in the way-truth-life?
 
01:13:50 Jeff O.: Amen! Thank you!
 
01:13:50 David Swiderski: Thanks father!
 
01:13:54 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part V

We are truly being nourished on solid food in reading the fathers. They present us not simply with a moralistic or legalistic view of sin and its impact upon our lives in the lives of others. We are to hold the peace of another’s heart as precious as we do our own. And when we are stirred to anger or hatred because we have been maligned and mistreated, we must not give way to hatred. Rather, we must suspend judgment and recognize that others are first and foremost tempted to sin as we are. We can hate the sin and the evil and in fact we should do so. But we must never lose sight of the dignity and identity of others or our own identity. 
When we get angry, we can lose our stillness and peace of mind and heart. These things are often hard won and so we must be careful not to cast them off easily. Nor should we cast off brotherly love lightly. We often can treat others with harshness and lack of generosity - never realizing that we place our souls and theirs’ in jeopardy. Again, I’m not speaking simply in moralistic terms. If we goad others to anger, we can make them lose hope in the providence and love of God. If we treat their vulnerability, not with generosity and support but abuse it, then we sin against charity - we sin against Christ. 
We must learn to slow things down internally; for we do not see all ends; even when we think we see things clearly. Our goal should be to live in divine love and help this divine love be maintained in our relationships with each other. In fulfilling, the commandment to love, we are offered and promised everything - to be sons and daughters of God. In light of this, whatever lengths we go to guard our minds and our hearts from anger is worth it.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:12:20 FrDavid Abernethy: page 348 letter G
 
00:22:19 Adam Paige: I just received an icon today of the Synaxis of the Bodiless Hosts
 
00:29:53 Rory: ?is divine providence the stillness among the passions of life?
 
00:37:05 Rory: ?is God revealing the truth in our silence when anger is expressed from another?
 
00:39:57 Louise: Father, what would you say about people who sue here and there to deal with their anger?
 
00:48:25 John Ingram: This reminds me of the Roman judges who flew off the handle, into a rage immediately upon hearing the testimony of the Christians they were sentencing.
 
01:03:55 David Fraley: I’m sorry I’m so late. I forgot today is Monday.
 
01:04:23 Ambrose Little, OP: Reacted to "I’m sorry I’m so lat..." with ➕
 
01:07:27 Rory: when someone trespasses another, 
is this God's way of showing us the clarity through peace and hope.
 
01:09:52 Rory: ?is anger really fear? 
and wouldn't Divine Love 
quell that fear
 
01:17:44 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:18:08 Louise: Thanks you, Father.
 
01:18:09 Helena Babington Guiles: Thank you Father David. Very helpful. 🙏🏼🤍
 

”The Prayer of Fire” - A Pentecost Retreat, Session Three

”The Prayer of Fire” - A Pentecost Retreat, Session Two

”The Prayer of Fire” - A Pentecost Retreat, Session One

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part VI

John continues to draw us ever deeper into the mysteries of the human mind and heart. We are in a constant state of receptivity as human beings. We are constantly engaged with the world around us through our senses. Our vigilance, therefore, must be of such a nature that we take these things into consideration. The sense of touch, the sense of hearing, etc., all can be things that give rise to the passions. In and of themselves, they may not be sinful and may not lead to sin on many occasions. However, our understanding of the power of this receptivity leads to the realization that the evil one can use them as a source of temptation. There is no room for pride in the battle that emerges from sensuality. 
Even actions and behaviors from the past remain forever in the imagination and memory. They are deeply ensconced in the unconscious. No matter how long ago certain things took place, something in the present day can give rise to and trigger those memories ever so powerfully. Conceit will always be our downfall; when we think our spiritual practices or circumstances, place us outside the reach of temptation. Saint Isaac the Syrian said in the spiritual battle there is no Sabbath. In other words, there is no rest in this life when dealing with the temptations of the evil one.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:26 FrDavid Abernethy: page 147 top of the page
 
00:12:40 FrDavid Abernethy: page 147 top of the page
 
00:17:47 Anthony: Maybe the way "Theology of the Body" is approached by some teachers, the way physicality and theology are intertwined and appealed to by the imagination is a dangerous thing.
 
00:19:46 Rory: ?is the silent stillness our spiritual existence?
 
00:24:51 Louise: Could reading the Psalms written by King David stimulate the sexual appetite because he gravely fell in the sins of fornication and adultery, and also murder?
 
00:35:48 Cindy Moran: I don't understand this about the man & his mother...
 
00:37:58 Rory: ?are words a sense of touch?
 
00:38:15 Cindy Moran: Ok...I am getting more clarity...thank you.
 
00:38:50 Anthony: It's a sad reality that such a thing as incest exists.  I guess the watchword is chastity or prudence, not focusing on so many permutations of evil that exist.
 
00:43:26 Cindy Moran: My mother told us to remember that you can't "unsee" something.
 
00:49:54 David Swiderski: There used to be a long tradition of contemplating the 5 wounds. I have found this extremely helpful to also sort out personal wounds. There is something strangely beautiful in overcoming suffering.
 
00:51:08 Rory: ?are deep wounds transcended by surrendering our weakness to God?
 
00:52:11 David Swiderski: The cross itself is our sign of victory
 
00:52:51 B.M.: Reacted to "The cross itself is ..." with ❤️
 
00:53:16 David Swiderski: Water from the side of Christ, wash me.
Passion of Christ, strengthen me.
O good Jesus, hear me.
Within your wounds conceal me.
Do not permit me to be parted from you.
 
00:54:41 Lorraine Green: Is there a third order for laymen that is mainly Eastern?
 
00:54:54 Anthony: The demons see out want to follow Christ and take advantage of our weakness to crucify us by our weakness, so we then have a real solidarity with the Crucified One.
 
00:56:12 wayne: I belong to the eastern rite, and to my knowledge there is not third order in the east
 
00:57:33 Anthony: Replying to "Is there a third o..."
 
An internet search shows there are "associates" of monastaries - Holy Resurrection Monastery, Sisters of St. Basil.  These are answers at byzcath.org.
 
01:14:05 Cindy Moran: Replying to "Is there a third ord..." 
 
 Excellent session...thank you Father!
 
01:14:13 Lorraine Green: Replying to "Is there a third ord..."
 
Thank you
 
01:14:17 Rachel : Thank you
 
01:14:19 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:21 Bonnie Lewis: Thank you Father David.
 
01:14:38 Louise: Thank you!
 
01:14:39 Cindy Moran: Replying to "Is there a third ord..." 
 
 🙏
 
01:14:44 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part V

The subtlety of Temptations! Again, and again the fathers show us the relentless work of the evil one in drawing the mind ans the heart of individuals into sin. He can create within our hearts a kind of childishness; a veneer of sanctity or virtue. One can experience, joy or tears or consolation in their soul, but it can all be an illusion, and not truly rooted in repentance. It is for this reason that we so often backslide in the spiritual life. We do not let go of the attachments that we have to the things that lead us into sin. We may repent and go to confession, but within our hearts we still hold on to a multitude of things that give rise to temptation or that stimulate our inclination to particular sins. Fornication in particular is something that is seen as having great weight among the fathers because it is so tied to our very make up as human beings and to our bodily appetites and desires. We can fall into error in our thinking and be corrected of this error even when we cling to it with pride. But once we have acknowledged the error we are unlikely to return to it. However, when the sins of the flesh become tied up with our imagination and memory, and when we give ourselves over to the sin, the deeper the roots become. What is lodged in the imagination and memory is easily taken hold of again through fantasy, at first, and then finally an action. Therefore the sins the flesh often need the greatest commitment to ascetic disciplines in order to uproot them. We were told in the Scriptures that the kingdom of heaven suffers violence, and the violent to bear it away. Similarly, there are things that we must be willing to cut out of our life in order to keep us from falling into the same sins again. Our desire and our courage in doing so, however, is often lacking.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:54 John Ingram: Greater Cincinnati/N KY
 
00:08:32 FrDavid Abernethy: page 145 para 42
 
00:25:53 Ashley Kaschl: Is St. John saying this over sharing/emotionalism be a symptom of this sin?
 
00:25:53 Louise: Blind to consequences.
 
00:29:25 Louise: Hooking up maybe to avoid aloneness at all cost.
 
00:29:26 Debra: Hook Up culture isn't just on Universities
 
00:32:27 Rory: Being in the moment with prayer, incarnate with God, we are never alone, as a temple of the Holy Spirit
 
00:36:40 Rory: ?is sin a correction?
 
00:37:39 Anthony: When I look at the history of heresy, I see that mental and physical errors often go together.
 
00:39:00 Anthony: Examples that come to mind: Marcion & other Gnostics; Cathars; Lutherans; Munsterites
 
00:45:48 Louise: As a Catholic child, I was taught that we were forgiven if we recognize our fault, repent (suffer from having caused pain, which would reduce repetition), and to repair (in reality as much as possible). The last two requirements seem to be dismissed these days , especially the third one.
 
00:48:17 Ambrose Little, OP: It goes both ways. Some heretics go the way of
overly puritanical approaches to the Faith.
 
00:54:31 Ashley Kaschl: The thought troubles me, and there’s a lot more to be said, I think, but the penance of not being permitted to receive the Holy Eucharist because of the sin of fornication makes a lot of sense. 
 
Being that we receive the whole Christ, if someone has developed a deeply rooted habit of fornication they would have a kind of morbid, contraceptive disposition of soul that says “I want the pleasure of receiving Christ in the Eucharist, but I do not want His effects.” Even if the soul is fighting against the sin, that person still needs to be freed from that disposition before seeking a union with God they have trained their body and, thus, their soul not to seek above all other things. Obviously it’s not so cut and dry but I can see what the footnote is saying 😅
 
00:54:38 Rory: ?are there degrees of repentence?
 
00:58:03 Melissa Kummerow: Reacted to "The thought troubles..." with 👍
 
00:59:45 sue and mark: communion is the medicine....  I think that I disagree
 
01:02:49 Anthony: In my opinion, that goes back to the Germanic we-gild, or man price to satisfy for offenses in place of taking a "pound of flesh" so to speak.  When the Roman Catholic Church became more of a Germanic entity, we used a Germanic example (in my opinion) of penance, and of Purgatory / indulgences.
 
01:02:59 Anthony: "wer-gild"
 
01:04:00 David Swiderski: I have to admit the desert fathers helped me tremendously as they have practical things to overcome temptations, situations or vices. I wish in the confessional there was more application of those especially to younger people who give up before knowing of these weapons in the spiritual battle.
 
01:04:21 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I have to admit the ..." with 👍
 
01:04:23 Melissa Kummerow: Reacted to "I have to admit the ..." with 👍
 
01:04:32 Art: I recently heard about priests telling people in the confessional “Be brief, be contrite, and be gone”.
 
01:05:04 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "I have to admit the ..." with 👍
 
01:05:05 LauraLeigh: Reacted to "I have to admit the ..." with 👍
 
01:05:12 John Ingram: Reacted to "I have to admit the ..." with 👍
 
01:05:28 Bonnie Lewis: Yes, I had a priest say, "just get to the sins!"
 
01:06:29 Lyle: Reacted to "I have to admit the ..." with 👍
 
01:07:10 David Swiderski: The church as an ER and priest or elders as spiritual doctors
 
01:08:45 Eric Ewanco: I hate it when I go to a scheduled confession period in an unfamiliar church and no priest is there
 
01:09:34 Michael: Unfortunately, I have mostly seen the opposite problem. Exponentially more people going up for communion than are going to confession. I think many people are not well-catechized and don't realize the gravity of receiving communion without ever going to confession.
 
01:09:59 Ambrose Little, OP: Not our job to be judging others..
 
01:10:25 Michael: I don't mean to judge those people, I just think it is a big problem that so many are unaware. It isn't their fault
 
01:11:15 Michael: Precisely
 
01:13:17 Cindy Moran: Any thoughts about a book called The Philokalia and The Inner Life On Passions and Prayer written by Christopher Cook Psychiatrist
 
01:14:10 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:15 angelo: Thank you father David.
 
01:14:22 Michael: Thank you Father David
 
01:14:25 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:14:32 Jacqulyn: Thank you! Quite a blessing. :-)
 
01:14:33 Bonnie Lewis: Thank you always Father.
 
01:14:37 John Ingram: Thank you, Father!
 
01:14:49 Louise: Thanks so much!
 
01:15:23 sue and mark: Good night and thank you.
 
01:15:27 Jeff O.: Amen, Thank you!
 
01:15:29 Debra: Thank you, for all you do!
 
01:15:29 Cindy Moran: Excellent session
 
01:15:31 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part IV

Once again, we are presented with a kind of fickleness that can plague the human heart. We can be ever so changeable. This includes how we look upon even our greatest commitments. The moment something becomes a trial for us or where we are asked to endure something that is reprehensible, or that causes us some suffering, we will want to change the external circumstances of our life. 
However, the fathers in their writing show us how the evil one constantly seeks to magnify such experiences to the point that they breakdown our commitment to our particular vocation or vows. The one who has lived the common life for years can have the seed implanted in his heart that he would be happier or holier as an anchorite. Or one who is old of age might be tempted into thinking that his life no longer has value, and that he can no longer fulfill the rule in the way that he did as a young man. He begins to think about retiring from the religious life all together. Such thinking is pervasive and enters into every vocation. 
Having said this, however, we also have to be aware of the fact that we can face obstacles in our environment, such as the envy of others that becomes destructive or immorality. In these circumstances, it may be necessary to change one’s environment.  We need to recognize that we are responsible for the spiritual well-being and fidelity of others. If we treat others without love, without respect, then we can put their vocation and their spiritual life in jeopardy. This is a sober reminder of the solidarity that exist between us. The only way that we are allowed to treat another person is to love them.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:03:09 FrDavid Abernethy: Hello Navy Dave!!!
 
00:03:26 David Fraley: I love those photos of you and your mom! Neither of you have changed!
 
00:03:42 FrDavid Abernethy: I look older than she does
 
00:04:24 David Fraley: Mrs Abernethy, you and I met at the Oratory a few years ago.
 
00:47:37 Ren Witter: Something about all these examples makes me really sad, and I think it has something to do with how they show that our words and actions can have such a profound on the ability of another to resist temptation. In all these examples, the temptations would have little weight if the elder in question was treated in such a way that he was assured of the affection and support of his fellow, younger monks.
 
00:48:08 Ren Witter: I just imagine how the way we treat others makes them more or less susceptible
 
00:51:00 David Fraley: Reacted to "I just imagine how t…" with 👍
 
00:54:46 Ren Witter: I am thinking, and I don’t think this is an overstatement, that when we treat others in a way that says “you are worthless,” “you are not worth my time,” “you don’t deserve kindness,” “you are a lost cause,” and many other such things, that we are not just making them more susceptible to the temptations of the demons, but are in fact becoming the tempting demon ourselves. We are already doing the demons’ job for them.
 
00:58:14 Anthony: "The Three Musketeers" has a plotline about a woman who left the convent in a bad way, and she brought ruin and misery to several men throughout her life until an avenger caught up with her.  It ties together some themes discussed today.
 
00:59:58 Louise: Sometimes, to be ethical, we have to confront, directly or indirectly, the obvious incompetence and even maliciousness of others. Of course, their hidden demons come out then forcibly. This would not be a sin, right?
 
01:03:07 John Ingram: Replying to "Sometimes, to be eth..."
 
I think St. Francis de Sales talked about how to respond to negative people (heretics, etc.): treat them with honey, not with vinegar.
 
01:05:48 Louise: Replying to "Sometimes, to be eth..."
 
Good point! However, some people even envy you when you treat them with honey, because they do not have honey and they hate you for having honey.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part IV

Piercing! The vision of a Saint becomes ever so sharp. Out of their own experience of the desert, and the spiritual warfare engaged in there, comes a wisdom that strikes, hopefully, our hearts. Our hearts can become hardened by being so long immersed in sin. When the sin becomes hardened and habitual, becomes a passion, it is not easy to break free from it. 
Yet words alone, even the words of the Saints, are unable to break us free. There must be within our hearts a faith and willingness to take hold of the grace of God that comes to us through Christ to enter into the fray, to fight the good fight of faith, and to engage fully in the ascetical life. 
Both the habit of sin and the temptation of the Evil One often keeps us mired deeply in darkness. Yet we must strive to let the little light that is given to us draw us forward and emboldened our hearts. A different vision of reality is set before us; one that has come into being through the Incarnation and the Paschal mystery. We are called, not simply to be good people and those of high natural virtue but rather sons and daughters of God. Christ’s virtue is to become our virtue. His strength must become our strength. This is not something that we seize upon with our own hands but receive with humility and gratitude. With these two virtues may we set out on the journey with an invincible hope.
---
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:04:27 FrDavid Abernethy: page 144 paragraph 31
 
00:11:03 FrDavid Abernethy: page 144 para 31
 
00:23:03 Michael: Is there any truth to the idea that God is particularly merciful about "natural" sins? CS Lewis said something similar in Mere Christianity.
 
00:31:28 Anthony: I suggest we read the passage of the Woman caught in Adultery in the context of Susanna and the Elders.
 
00:53:09 Lawrence Martone: Sometimes we have to question if we are doing the right thing, but we don’t have a spiritual director.  Is there an equivalent of Ignatian Discernment methods with the Desert Fathers?
 
00:56:54 Daniel Allen: Is that type of humility why someone such as St Philip Neri can say (paraphrasing), I have done nothing good today I will begin again… and mean it? Because to the outside observer obviously St Philip did much good.
 
01:05:57 Brad Smith: Is this similar to Psalm 137:9 about dashing infants against the stone…i.e. dealing with the sin early and completely?
 
01:06:41 LauraLeigh Monterey: My Egyptian is food. :-) So, I am to turn the power behind that appetite toward its source, which is God, yes? Can you explain a little more what that means in practical terms? That is, how exactly does one "kill the Egyptian"? Would it depend on what the Egyptian is?
 
01:11:18 Ashley Kaschl: This makes me think a lot about a Christmas Carol when Scrooge is first visited by Marley and how he’s fearful of this chain wrapped all around his friend more so than the fact that he’s a ghost. And Marley asks him “do you know the weight and length of the chain you bear yourself?” And I think that’s a lot like this Egyptian and how we may not know we are slaves to our sin and wrapped in chains.
 
01:11:23 Anthony: Replying to "Is this similar to..."
 
That's what I was thinking.  I think the monks interpret it this way.
 
01:12:47 Cindy Moran: What is the title of Pope Shenouda's book?
 
01:13:35 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:19 angelo: Thank you!
 
01:14:22 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!!
 
01:14:27 Bonnie Lewis: Thank you so much Father.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part III

We returned to hypothesis 40 and found ourselves sitting at the feet of Saint Ephrem the Syrian. We are shown with frightening clarity how the evil one works upon our minds and our hearts by making us question the value and the significance of our particular vocation.  We are often tempted to change externals; thinking that when we do so we will find a place that fosters greater sanctity, peace of mind and heart, or offers a greater opportunity for prayer. The evil one constantly seeks to tempt us to this instability in order that we might never put down deep roots - and so also never bear ripe fruit, if any fruit at all. 
The grass always looks greener on the other side. There are always going to be things that seem to be lacking in our life or in our relationships, whether real or perceived, that make us vulnerable to this kind of attack. Therefore, we are counseled to be equally relentless in putting things to the test. We must fast and pray and seek the counsel of others. Likewise, we must never make decisions in moments of desolation. It is not as though the fathers are saying that we can never be called to walk another path. Rather, they are telling us that all of our actions must be guided by prudence; a kind of practical wisdom that arises out of long experience within the inner desert of the heart. 
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:04:58 FrDavid Abernethy: page 342 top of the page
 
00:43:21 John Ingram: I'm wondering whether the extreme depravity of the modern world creates a greater temptation to retreat to a more extreme asceticism than, say, a century ago, or even during the times of the Desert Fathers. Thus we're in more danger of being thrown off balance from a balanced approach.
 
00:50:30 Louise: Would  recommend allowing ourselves to experience the void elated to the longing to be with the Beloved, being conscious and tolerating the pain of longing while also being in this world with its joys and pleasures in a contained way.
 
01:07:24 Louise: I think of Job these days. He was thrown into ascetism, losses, and pain, beyond his volition. God tested him via the evil one. At times, I imagine myself in the place of Job in a near future, in the hope to remain faithful and in love with God whatever happens, even I do not understand why this is occurring. Maybe Job's trial was a demonstration for us.
 
01:11:02 Adam Paige: It’s the feast of Job this week actually
 
01:14:05 Melissa Kummerow: Wish I had been able to tune in earlier but everything that's been talked about so far has been very timely to my own life right now. Seems to be par for the course with your groups, Father David lol
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part III

How does one begin to speak about purity and chastity in an age that hyper-sensualizes the human experience?  When we define ourselves so tightly and, in particular, so tightly to disordered desire, how is it that we bear witness to and embrace the call of Saint John and the other fathers to purity? Part of the answer to these questions is to immerse ourselves in the vision of the fathers; their anthropology and psychology and the spirituality that shapes these things. However, this only begins to lead us to an understanding of who and what we have become in Christ.  If it remains purely notional we will inevitably be drawn back in to what the culture puts before us. What Christianity calls us to is to see ourselves only in light of Christ and to find meaning and identity in Him. Likewise, we must see the radical solidarity that exists between every one of us as human beings made in the image and likeness of God. We are called to a life of radical conversion and repentance.  When we look out into the world and see great evil or sin, our response must be to turn to God with even greater zeal and desire. We must embody the love, joy, peace, and purity of the kingdom. Anything less is going to ring hollow to the world. To speak of purity or chastity in simple moralistic or legalistic terms is to fail to understand what we have become in Christ. It is the Spirit of God that dwells within us and we are not called to embody natural virtue much less what private judgment puts forward as good. It is the beauty of Divine life that must shine forth in our every thought and action.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:08:51 FrDavid Abernethy: page 142, para 19
 
00:30:23 Anthony: I kind of think I (we?) try too hard to be Christians, and that is a self-centered and very difficult focus.  It's not the way of easy relief of Christ's cross.  It's my cross.
 
00:31:39 Anthony: My pastor once mentioned how we make our own heavy, too heavy crosses.
 
00:33:50 Eric Ewanco: I try to project the seraph serpent mounted on a pole to the Eucharist lifted up during the liturgy, sending out healing to me from the crucifixion of Christ
 
00:50:56 Michael: Oh wow, I thought it was just a metaphor. I didn’t realize he was literally talking about bestiality.
 
00:51:29 angelo: Reacted to "Oh wow, I thought it..." with 👍
 
00:55:18 Ashley Kaschl: This isn’t necessarily related to chastity but there’s a book about how normal people became murderers during WWII called “Ordinary Men” and its incredibly humbling. I would definitely recommend it. There’s a quote that always sticks with me from the psychological study of genocide in that book that states “Evil that arises out of ordinary thinking and is committed by ordinary people is the norm, not the exception.” (Ervin Staub, author of “The Roots of Evil: The Origins of Genocide and other Group Violence”)
 
00:58:41 Anthony: I get this idea from E Michael Jones: "Sexual Liberation is a tool of Social Control."  He bases this on St. Augustine and events in world history which illustrate how sexuality has been used to enslave the imagination and soul.  Maybe that will help.
 
01:01:03 Louise: At an older age, there is an appeasement of the bodily
pulsions. Therefore, there is a lot of good to say about older age. I am thankful. Maybe it is partly due to my turning to the Beloved many years ago, repeating again and again in my Heart, ''There is no god but God.''
 
01:17:16 David: Isn't a lot of this the consequence of "Relativism". Feelings have replaced truth.
 
01:17:50 Louise: Otherwise, these people will sue you, as an honest clinician.
 
01:18:01 carol nypaver: True, David.
 
01:18:13 Ashley Kaschl: I wonder if it’s a step further than relativism. Vice has replaced virtue to the extent that it has become “virtuous” to extol it.
 
01:18:58 angelo: Thank you Father.
 
01:19:02 melissa kummerow: Thank you!!!!
 
01:19:05 David: Thank you father!
 
01:19:06 sue and mark: Good night everyone.  Thank you Father.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part II

Stability of place leads to and protects internal emotional and spiritual stability. One must not be tempted to change one’s external environment; thinking that somehow another place holds greater promise for producing virtue within our hearts. Such thoughts must be tested over the course of many years and placed before one’s spiritual elder for scrutiny. Often the evil one will seek to draw us along another path because we are being afflicted or frustrated or our self-esteem is being diminished in some fashion. We must keep our focus upon Christ in the midst of this battle. He alone is the wholly innocent One. He did not flee the Cross that was set before him and ultimately gave his assent to the Father’s will. Our faith and hope in God and what he can bring about by his providence and grace must be our guiding light.
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:08:00 FrDavid Abernethy: page 336, Letter C
 
00:48:34 Ashley Kaschl: What you said about scripture where Jesus asks “do you want to be well?” reminded me of a part of the Surrender Novena to the Sacred Heart: “In pain you pray for me to act, but that I act in the way you want. You do not turn to me, instead, you want me to adapt to your ideas. You are not sick people who ask the doctor to cure you, but rather sick people who tell the doctor how to.”
 
00:52:55 Louise: Could it be that Theodora fully accepted this ordeal because she had previously deceived the monks of the monastery in believing that she was a man? Thus, this was a just punishment by God, which she embraced.
 
00:55:59 Louise: I see.
 
01:02:11 John Ingram: Not sure where this poem came from, but on the subject of spiritual pride, here is one stanza:
 
01:03:47 John Ingram: "And when the prayer unto my lips doth rise/"Let me but offer Thee some glorious sacrifice/Let me accomplish some great work for Thee!"/Subdue it, Lord, let my petition be Make me but useful in this world of Thine/In ways according to Thy Will, not mine."
 
01:05:00 Louise: Father, would you see anorexia as an ego-based asceticism driven by diabolical obsession?
 
01:05:30 John Ingram: No idea!
 
01:07:05 Paul Fifer: Found the poem…. Here is a link:  https://www.google.com/books/edition/Irish_Monthly/_W43AAAAMAAJ?hl=en&gbpv=1&dq=%22And+when+the+prayer+unto+my+lips+doth+rise/%22Let+me+but+offer+Thee+some+glorious+sacrifice/Let+me+accomplish+some+great+work+for+Thee!%22/Subdue+it,+Lord,+let+my+petition+be+Make+me+but+useful+in+this+world+of+Thine/In+ways+according+to+Thy+Will,+not+mine.%22&pg=PA509&printsec=frontcover
 
01:07:09 John Ingram: Follow-up to other stanza: first stanza is: "Let me not die before I've done for Thee/my earthly work, whatever it may be./ Call me not hence with mission unfulfilled/ let me not leave my space of ground untilled."
 
01:07:51 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Follow-up to other s…" with ❤️
 
01:09:38 David Fraley: Reacted to "Follow-up to other s…" with ❤️
 
01:14:39 Sandy Nelson: A first time listener this evening . . where can I get a copy of the Evergetinos?
 
01:15:08 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "A first time listene…" with ❤️
 
01:15:23 Sandy Nelson: Thank you
 
01:16:58 sue and mark: Thank you Father.  God bless everyone.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part II

The depth of the fathers’ understanding of the workings of the mind and the heart, the appetites and desires, is staggering. One of the great fruits of the ascetic life of the Desert fathers is what it reveals about the desert of the human heart. Jeremiah the prophet wrote: “The human heart is a treacherous thing.  Who can endure it“. How true this is! St. John Climacus gradually begins us to draw us in to the subtle workings of our bodily appetites, in particular those tied to sensuality. Our vision of ourselves, and others can become so easily distorted by our sin. We become unable to see the beauty not only of the world around us, but of the human person and every aspect of their being. We all use ourselves and others and the things of this world in a desperate attempt to fill a void within our hearts. We long for the love of God. Even the atheist, one who denies God with all their heart, experiences this longing. They may be completely unaware of its source but nonetheless desperately seek something to fill it. And in those times when we are not wrapped up in the attempt or the delusion of fullness, we experience depression. There is no human being that does not experience isolation and the pain of loneliness even when surrounded by others and an abundance of worldly goods. St. John painstakingly reveals to us the nature of the struggle for purity of heart in order that we might be freed from seeking for the love and fullness anywhere else than in the bosom of God. 
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Text of chat during the group:
00:01:25 Kevin Burke: I am just getting started on this forum and really enjoying it, I plan to catch up with the previous lessons as well.
 
Can you tell me what version of the book that we are using in this forum? I have the Paulist version but it’s very different and I would like to get the precise same version.
 
00:03:14 Adam Paige: Replying to "I am just getting st..."
 
The Holy Transfiguration Monastery version we use is a revision of this earlier 1959 translation: http://www.prudencetrue.com/images/TheLadderofDivineAscent.pdf
 
00:31:20 Anthony: St. Gregory of Narek on the Song of Songs does a very good job of drawing holy innocence from a love story.
 
00:34:04 Anthony: Replying to "St. Gregory of Nar..."
 
"The Blessing of Blessings: Gregory of Narek on the Song of Songs" Translated from the AArmenian by Roberta Ervine, Cistercian Publications, (c) 2007
 
00:34:48 Louise Gaston: Would you say that purity of heart coupled with an observing ego allows for a sensitive detachment and discernment? With God's grace too?
 
00:34:51 angelo: Reacted to ""The Blessing of Ble..." with ❤️
 
00:38:55 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: "greater still is the man unhurt by all he has looked upon." says this translation...
 
00:39:24 Rodrigo Castillo: The Blessing of Blessings: Grigor of Narek's Commentary
on the Song of Songs (Cistercian Studies books) (Volume 215) https://a.co/d/7ZqSBAW
 
00:40:44 angelo: Reacted to "The Blessing of Bles..." with 👍
 
00:41:31 Louise Gaston: Would you say that one's engagement in pornography, gluttony, etc. is basically a defense against the pain of our longing for God's presence?
 
00:45:59 Adam Paige: Reacted to ""The Blessing of Ble..." with ❤️
 
00:46:08 Adam Paige: Reacted to "The Blessing of Bles..." with 👍
 
00:50:07 Anthony: Fr. Barnabas Powell (Greek Orthodox) has a saying "You are not your thoughts."  I think that has a place in psychological reflection
 
00:50:30 Jeff O.: Reacted to "Fr. Barnabas Powell ..." with 👍
 
00:52:18 Sean: In ‘Christ — Our Pascha’, the Ukrainian Catholic catechism, it says: 
 
“When a person in prayer meets God in the depths of one's heart, one already here on earth directly experiences that which the apostle Paul describes as seeing God ‘face to face’ (1 Cor 13:12). The person ‘sees’ the One in whom he or she has believed. The person abides in God's presence. The apostle Paul compares this new state of the person to a ‘seeing’ of God…it is a ‘seeing’ of the Invisible One.“ And Metropolitan Hierotheos in ‘Orthodox Psychotherapy’ writes: “The pure heart is the organ of knowledge, the organ of Orthodox epistemology.” 
 
Thank you, Father☦️
 
https://eeparchy.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/08/Christ-our-Pascha-Catechism-of-the-Ukrainian-Catholic-Church-by-Comission-for-the-Catehism-z-lib.org_.pdf
 
00:53:42 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Fr. Barnabas Powell ..." with 👍
 
00:59:12 Anthony: So truth must be, as Soren Kierkegaard said, Objective-subjective.  The internal assent must be actively given to the external reality.  This is how the Blessed Virgin MAry lived.
 
00:59:46 Adam Paige: Reacted to "So truth must be, as..." with 🇩🇰
 
01:01:13 Louise Gaston: Difficult question - Is Christ in the Eucharist when it is
consecrated by ''funny'' modernist priests? (those with an irrespectful attitude)
 
01:04:47 angelo: Fr. I have a question: self-flagellation as a mortification is still be helpful in this battle? I heard  that it is no longer permitted by the church.
 
01:07:15 David: This seems different by culture. The chapel of N. Sra of Guadalupe still washes blood on the cobblestones from the knees of faithful entering the chapel
 
01:08:08 David: Opus Dei still uses the cilus
 
01:10:16 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:10:18 Sean: Thank you, Father☦️
 
01:10:19 David: Thank you father!
 
01:10:22 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:10:28 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XIV: On Gluttony, Part IV, and Chapter XV: On Chastity, Part I

Tonight we made the transition from St. John’s Step on Gluttony and its offspring to our discussion of Purity and Chastity in Step number 15. Again, as we read slowly through the text and begin to unpack it, we begin to see the larger picture; the image of humanity redeemed. We see what it means to be made in the image and likeness of God, and the experience of embracing our full dignity and identity. 
What is held out to us is an incorruptible freedom and joy as our love becomes ordered toward God. We begin to see the true beauty of the things of the world, of others, and of God himself. As I’ve often mentioned, the desert fathers were the first depth psychologists; they present to us the path that brings healing of soul. They see the human person in his fullness and we see in their writings such our true dignity and destiny. 
Our struggle often is found in the fact that we’ve never come to taste that freedom, the joy, the capacity to love unimpeded by our sin. The ascetic life is not about endurance, or personal health or the ordering of our life so much as it is about the desire for God, his love, and to share in the life that he makes possible for us. It has been said that “Beauty will save the world”. In the writings of the fathers, we are called to see this beauty first in the person of Christ; and in and through him the beauty of the life that is held out to us. May we desire it with all of our hearts.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:12:16 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Who? Author?
 
00:12:44 Anthony: Pope Shenouda
 
00:13:09 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: THanks
 
00:13:35 FrDavid Abernethy: page 138
 
00:13:38 FrDavid Abernethy: no 32
 
00:14:03 Anthony: If y'all have Coptic Orthodox parishes nearby with food festivals .... GO!
 
00:23:15 Cindy Moran: This reminds me of: the kingdom suffers violence and the violent seize it by force--Mt 11:12
 
00:25:17 Debra: What Step and paragraph
 
00:26:44 Lori Hatala: step 14 para 36
 
00:26:55 Debra: Replying to "step 14 para 36"
 
Thank you!
 
00:32:35 Anthony: I get it, but cooking is an art.  Food is beautiful.  Nothing God made - matter or form - is evil.  What we consider to be food needs reform.  Our habits need reform to appreciate the art.  But I'm a bit concerned that some of these fathers are a presenting the stick too much and the carrot to little.
 
00:39:23 Ambrose Little, OP: Replying to "I get it, but cookin..."
 
The carrot is food, which is bad. ;)
 
00:39:39 angelo: Reacted to "The carrot is food, ..." with 😂
 
00:40:08 Anonymous Sinner: The movie Babette’s Feast comes to mind
 
00:42:27 Anthony: In Sicilian, the word for this kind of boorish glutton is gavonne (cafone).
 
00:43:47 Bonnie Lewis: I love that movie.  It's beautiful.
 
00:47:27 Anthony: I don't suppose I pray as much as I "should," but I have a wondrous happiness when creating like cooking
 
00:48:58 Bridget McGinley: Father this is a little off topic… was St John Cassian a priest? Also, Do you know of any books which talk about his devotion to St Mary Magdalene? I recently returned from France/Spain where I learned St John founded a monastery adjacent to her cave in 415. The Cassians protected her cave for hundreds of years. The Dominicans have had it since about the 1200’S. It just seems like he understood penance on the same level as she did.
 
00:49:54 wayne: Well we now have foods that create little preparation and in turn we have lost the art form of preparation and also we don't have the sense of where our food comes from.
 
00:50:57 Bridget McGinley: Sorry I know it was a little off topic.
 
00:51:39 angelo: That is true Father that the meal table is no longer table of sharing, I live and I am from a family first immigrant of this country and we all have jobs in different shifts and we don't see each other, eating alone is so sad that leads to eat more and more and watch tv until we doze off.
 
00:52:02 Anthony: Replying to "I get it, but cook..."
 
Carrot slaw, carrot cake....
 
00:52:10 Anthony: Reacted to "The carrot is food..." with 😂
 
00:52:21 Anthony: Reacted to "Well we now have f..." with 👍
 
00:52:39 Anthony: Reacted to "That is true Fathe..." with ❤️
 
00:54:34 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: In Eastern monasteries, the refectory walls are covered with iconography.
 
00:54:44 Anthony: Reacted to "In Eastern monaste..." with ❤️
 
00:54:49 Vicki Nichols: Replying to "Father this is a lit..." 
 
Saint Mary Magdalene by Fr. Davidson is a good book
 
00:55:17 angelo: Reacted to "In Eastern monasteri..." with ❤️
 
00:55:33 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Saint Mary Magdalene…" with ❤️
 
01:18:43 Ashley Kaschl: It’s probably obvious, but this section makes me think of the Beatitudes. Aristotle had a maxim that said, “As a person is, so does he see.” And I think that once we are granted the grace necessary to slowly make our hearts undivided in love, then too, do we become pure of heart, and our vices are chipped away to make room for virtue so that we might, at the end of our lives, see God face to face. “Blessed are the pure of heart, for they shall see God.”
 
01:19:37 Anthony: Reacted to "It’s probably obv..." with ❤️
 
01:19:48 Ashley Kaschl: 😂😂😂
 
01:20:09 angelo: Reacted to "It’s probably obviou..." with ❤️
 
01:20:10 Ambrose Little, OP: Reacted to "It’s probably obviou..." with ❤️
 
01:20:18 Debra: Reacted to "It’s probably obviou..." with ❤️
 
01:21:38 angelo: thank you
 
01:21:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:51 David: Thank you father!
 
01:21:52 Bonnie Lewis: good night Father.
 
01:21:56 Jeff O.: Thank you! God bless your pilgrimage Angela!
 
01:21:58 Rachel : Thank
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XL, Part I

We rarely think of the importance of stability; not only in our external environment, but the stability of thought and emotion. It is precisely this that is addressed in Hypothesis 40. One can easily be tempted, with good reason, for a multitude of reasons, to move to another place, where one can find greater tranquility and peace in the spiritual life. Yet, such thoughts are often the work of the evil one. Wherever we go, we take our selves with us, including our passions. 
And so, we receive multiple stories and examples of monks and saints who were put to the test in this regard.  We can allow ourselves with great ease to begin to daydream; to imagine a kind of life that will bring peace and happiness to us or that would be pleasing to God. The danger is that we often are motivated by our personal judgment and sensibilities or by the actions of the evil one. 
We must understand that in this world we know no peace, except for that which is found in Christ. While we are in this world, we are engaged in constant spiritual warfare and should expect nothing less. In fact, we were told that we must become like the cherubim - “all eyes.”  We must constantly watch for the subtle ways that the evil one seeks to draw us away from the path of obedience and humility.
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:11:33 FrDavid Abernethy: page 330 Letter E
 
00:54:48 Erick chastain: What hypothesis/ book are we on?
 
00:55:21 carol nypaver: P.334
 
00:55:26 Eric Ewanco: XL.A.2
 
00:55:59 Erick chastain: Reacted to "P.334" with 👍
 
00:56:28 carol nypaver: Please say book name again?
 
00:56:52 John Ingram: https://www.amazon.com/Life-Repentance-Purity-Pope-Shenouda/dp/0881415324?ref_=nav_ya_signin
 
00:56:59 Cindy Moran: Great idea.
 
00:57:55 Sean: Reacted to "Great idea. " with 👍
 
01:03:37 Sean: Along this line, I have friends who have considered converting to
Orthodoxy. Can you speak to pursuing holiness in our Church and not leaving in this context? Thank you, Father☦️
 
01:06:26 Erick chastain: Pope Francis said Sunday that evangelization doesn't get done by keyboard warriors
 
01:08:17 John Ingram: I think Our Lord told us that in these times, charity would grow cold - which is exactly what is happening with all these internal disputes in the Church.
 
01:17:31 Eric Ewanco: “One does not proclaim the Gospel standing still, locked in an office, at one’s desk or at one’s computer, arguing like ‘keyboard warriors’ and replacing the creativity of proclamation with copy-and-paste ideas taken from here and there. The Gospel is proclaimed by moving, by walking, by going.” — Pope Francis, General Audience, Wednesday, 12 April 2023
 
01:27:27 Cindy Moran: 🙏
 
01:27:58 sue and mark: God Bless everyone.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent- Chapter XIV: On Gluttony, Part III

How striking it is to hear the nature of the struggle with gluttony and the need for fasting spoken of with such zeal and clarity! Such practices have for the most part fallen by the wayside or have been minimized to such an extent as to be equally nonexistent. The unfortunate fruit of this is that we often have never tasted the freedom and the strength comes through ordering our appetite for food. Thus, the humbling of the mind and the body and the deepening of the experience of prayer through the stilling of the thoughts is also rarely experienced. 
We need to take hold of the wisdom of the fathers and their zeal that will allow us to put it into practice.  St. John tells us that when God sees the movement of the mind abs the heart towards Him through these practices that He will aid us with His grace. 
We also see that the fathers have a very clear sense of the workings of the human mind and how we experience our bodily appetites. Their observations of what takes place on a physiological level are astute and reveal the depth of their experience. All of it is meant to fashion within our hearts a renewed desire for the ascetic life. 
We must see that which is uniquely an distinctively Christian about these practices. For while St. John and the other fathers speak of them so frequently, they also understand that their beginning and end is found in one’s relationship with God. The desire for God’s love must compel us. 
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:51 FrDavid Abernethy: page 136. paragraph 17
 
00:11:08 FrDavid Abernethy: page 136 paragraph 17
 
00:17:21 Bridget McGinley: Whose end is destruction; whose God is their belly; and whose glory is in their shame; who mind earthly things- Philippians 3:19
 
00:23:45 Emma C: I have a question!
 
00:24:02 Emma C: I was wondering can fasting help with other attachments to the world like shopping?
 
00:24:10 Brett Pavia, BCMA: I have a question …
 
00:24:15 Emma C: Excessive shopping*
 
00:36:18 Rachel : That's a fantastic idea.
 
00:36:40 Anthony: The back of the Publican's Prayer Book has a guide to ease into fasting, written by Patriarch Gregorios III.
Also, Italian food is a LOT of peasant food (cucina povera).
 
00:41:40 Rachel : You have good friends. In Cali, you can find something at a steakhouse though.
 
00:42:12 Rachel : "Crab feed"
 
00:42:19 Anthony: This one does.  Fish is usually penance.  So is soup. ;)
 
00:42:21 Ambrose Little, OP: I dunno. Ours is plain, and I don’t like fish. 😄 😄
 
00:42:27 Ren Witter: Reacted to "I dunno. Ours is pla..." with 😄
 
00:42:44 Ren Witter: Yea, I’ve smelled some fish fries that seem pretty penitential
 
00:57:18 Ambrose Little, OP: Ora et labora?
 
01:01:31 Anthony: Prayer is serious. It takes work.  A person can stay up and watch entertainment, but it isn't work - but stay up too late and you feel horrible.  Maybe it's a counterfeit to work to make the work of a vigil distasteful.
 
01:06:06 Anthony: Same here, Brett
 
01:08:01 David: A priest suggested finding a rock or something to hold in one hand during prayer. I have a rock from a Jesuit retreat house and it helps get my mind focused. It becomes a habit when held my mind goes to God.
 
01:15:31 Debra: Reacted to "Yea, I’ve smelled so..." with 😆
 
01:15:51 Mitch: On our commitment to Christ I’ve often felt like I have spiritual amnesia. I feel at home when in the spiritual work and then I go out into the world with its suffering again and forget my true home. I feel like my task each day is to remember the truth
 
01:19:33 Sean: Met. Kallistos of blessed memory said that unceasing prayer is not something that we say from time to time, but rather something that we are, all of the time (even during sleep)☦️
 
01:20:21 Jeff O.: Reacted to "Met. Kallistos of bl..." with 👍
 
01:22:29 Mitch: Thank you very much Happy Easter/Pascha to everyone!
 
01:22:30 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you!🙂 Happy Easter everyone
 
01:22:34 Sean: Thank you, Father
 
01:22:36 Jeff O.: Thank you! Happy Easter
 
01:22:36 angelo: thank you
 
01:22:37 Rachel : Thank you!
 
01:22:43 David: Thank you!
 
01:22:43 Deiren: Happy Easter
 

Behold His Face: They Shall Look On Him Whom They Have Pierced

As a special reflection for this Holy Week, we chose a reading from Fr., Thomas Acklin‘s book “The Passion of the Lamb.”  In particular we reflected on the chapter entitled “Behold His Face.” As one participant in tonight‘s group stated: “This reflection is a gem!”  I agree. It is a rarest of gems and I’m grateful to Fr. Tom for writing it and the entire book. While small, it has had an incalculable effect upon me and I hope for all who listen to this podcast. 
What Fr. Tom seeks to do is to open our minds and our hearts to the truth revealed in the Passion of Christ. So often we approach this mystery bound by the limits of our reason and our sin. Fr. Tom challenges us to allow ourselves to be guided and drawn into the mystery by faith; to comprehend what God has revealed to us and what is beyond the measure of man’s mind. 
Many Christians throughout the centuries have struggled with the mystery of the Cross and the reality of our Lord’s suffering. Theologically, the human mind, almost in a form of resistance, intellectually and spiritually, tries to hold on to the notion of God being impassible. We are comfortable with notions of God being all powerful and all knowing. What we have trouble understanding and what we are often unwilling to embrace is the reality of a God who is Omni-kenotic and Omni-vulnerable. What Fr. Tom wants us to reflect upon is a God in whom we see and attribute not human deficiencies and sinfulness, hatred, ignorance, or illness. Rather, he wants us to contemplate and attribute to God in an infinite and perfect way the good qualities that we have in a finite and even deficient way. Thus, Fr. Tom says, rather than being impassible, incapable of feeling or having passion as we do as human beings, it would be more accurate to say that not only Christ but all three persons of the Trinity are infinitely caring, infinitely affected by us; Omni-passible. To believe such a thing is to understand that “at the height of his agony, he could see, not only the people who stood before him, jeering or weeping, but all the people of all time. He saw us in our loving and in our refusing to love, our sinning and our repenting. At the same eternal moment, he took on all the moments of every life and death. He could be the infinite love of God in person to each human being who ever lived, and who will ever live.” 
May God bless us this Holy Week with the gift of faith to see this love, this perfect vulnerability, even in the smallest measure.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:42 FrDavid Abernethy: https://mcusercontent.com/c38acab568d650f7ef65f39df/files/679d1720-7a17-e9b4-7355-2bd4ae5431fd/Behold_His_Face_Booklet.pdf
 
00:14:52 Cath Lamb: I don't have microphone or camera 😊
 
00:18:31 Rebecca Thérèse: England
 
00:18:36 CathyQ: Canadian too!
 
00:18:41 Kristen's I Phone: Alberta Canada!
 
00:18:59 Michael: Pittsburgh!
 
00:19:07 michele: Buffalo ny
 
00:19:09 Cath Lamb: Colorado USA
 
00:19:10 kevin: BOSTON
 
00:19:16 James Moran: Appleton WI
 
00:39:47 Michael: Shroud of Turin video
https://www.youtube.com/live/HAbuG-oVq1Q?feature=share
 
00:43:25 CathyQ: Reacted to "Shroud of Turin vide..." with ❤️
 
01:44:49 Sean: Hi Father, I think (from what I have seen) that a problem might be people seeing heaven in the future rather than deification as a reality we can begin to participate in here and now. ☦️
 
01:44:49 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:45:53 Kristen's I Phone: Reacted to "Shroud of Turin vide…" with ❤️
 
01:47:30 sheri: Thank you.  Good night.
 
01:47:40 Patricia: Thank You!
 
01:47:46 Michael: Thank you Fr
 
01:48:04 Kristen's I Phone: Thank you!
 
01:48:12 michele: Thank you
 
01:48:53 kevin: beautiful talk excellent ,  thank you for sharing Father
 
01:49:08 David Fraley: Thank you, Father David.
 
01:49:09 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Fr. Tom needs our +prayers.. He's sick.
 
01:49:28 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Long term problem
 
01:49:34 Patricia: Do you know Fr. Justin?
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XIV: On Gluttony, Part II

We continued to our reflection on step number 14 - gluttony, or that “clamorous mistress, the stomach.”  We are being exposed to the wisdom of the fathers, so deeply rooted in their experience of human nature and how it has been effected by sin. St. John, in his typical fashion, reveals to us the subtleties (psychological, emotional and spiritual) of how we are deceived by the evil one and how our bodily appetites can be used against us. It is precisely because our appetite for food is natural and needed for sustenance that it is something that can be used against us and so powerfully. 
This step shows how St. John and the other fathers were not only spiritual warriors, but the first depth psychologists. They knew how the mind and the heart work. We are easily deceived and easily moved to rationalize our use of food. Perhaps what is most significant is that St. John shows us how essential this practice of fasting and abstinence is in our spiritual life. We can’t be dabblers or minimalists. Because it is such a part of who we are, our appetite for food must be formed and shaped both by discipline and by the grace of God. What and how we eat is often a reflection of our emotional state a response to a need and desire for consolation. Rather than nourishing ourselves upon the love of God, we will choose some thing that offers immediate satisfaction - even though we know it is ever so temporary.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:22:56 Anthony: Months ago we talked about the monk who cut off his genitals, to great spiritual and physical harm.  Fasting is a healthy way of cutting off an appetite; it cannot be complete, since that is absolutely repulsive to natural law.  It encourages both cutting something off and moderation in approach.  Maybe that is a reason why fasting is a help for both gluttony and lust.
 
00:24:00 Anthony: In addition, fasting is accessible to both men and women - a remedy for all.
 
00:25:03 angelo: Reacted to "Months ago we talked..." with 👍
 
00:28:20 sue and mark: am I correct in thinking that this can be modified for special health needs effected by diet.
 
00:28:40 Sean: I recently watched a good lecture on Evagrius, “Evagrius the Monk and the Care of Souls” by Dr. Robin Darling Young at the Byzantine Catholic Seminary: https://youtu.be/Lp-EpQB_A6U
I didn’t know that he was condemned along with Origen. I have only heard good things. Thank you, Father.
 
00:38:41 David: Aren't a lot of perceived contradictions looking at absolutes rather than stages and a process. As a child uses training wheels, then has someone behind him, then only a flat road. Over the period of time and conquering basic steps bigger challenges can be adopted.
 
00:41:00 sue and mark: Reacted to "Aren't a lot of perc..." with 👍
 
00:46:47 Anthony: So, Mardi Gras can actully harm the spiritual goal of Lent, but Meatfare then cheesefare is to enhance the Lent
 
00:47:52 Jean-Baptiste Giroux: There are many people these days practicing prolong fasting up to 72 hrs. Should that be  encouraged?
 
00:48:11 Patrick Caruso: Fr. David, could you please speak to how one should incorporate fasting and/or restraint on Sundays, solemnities, etc? With the approaching Easter season, how is one to best continue forward with some of the fasting they may have been practicing during Lent in the Easter season?
 
00:49:31 Adam Paige: Reacted to "There are many peopl…" with 👍
 
00:49:34 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Fr. David, could you…" with 👍
 
00:53:48 David: In the early church wasn't Wed and Friday all year what Christians were know for in fasting?
 
01:05:11 Jeff O.: Reacted to "In the early church ..." with 👍
 
01:05:35 Brad Smith: If the “warrior-ascetic” is distinct from the “perfect ascetic,” is Climacus implicitly warning the warrior to be careful not to delight to the point of succumbing to pride in there heat of battle when successful?
 
01:14:54 carol: “You are she who is not, I AM He Who Is.” to St.Catherine of Siena
 
01:18:16 David: Fear of the consequences of our sins? And acknowledging he is also All Just, a Judge? Ideally fear of disappointing God through love is best but sometimes fear of consequence can be good at times.
 
01:21:22 Anthony: Wisdom Chapter 12 - God tries to correct people by degrees.
 
01:23:22 carol nypaver: Well said, Father!
 
01:23:57 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:24:10 Krissy: Thanks!
 
01:24:49 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:24:53 David: Thanks you and bless you Father!
 
01:24:55 angelo: thank you
 
01:24:55 sue and mark: good night an dGod bless you father.
 
01:24:58 Brad Smith: Thank you
 
01:24:59 Jeff O.: Amen, thank you!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXIX, Part I

Tonight, our 100th Episode of the study of the The Evergetinos, we began reading Hypothesis 39.  The subject matter is manifold. We are not to trust or be overly confident in ourselves, our own judgment or our spiritual strength. Rather, we are to trust first and foremost in the grace of God and also the intercession of our spiritual father. Every good that we accomplish takes place because of God’s mercy; this includes the prayers, and the intercession of one’s elder. 
We are presented with a multitude of stories of individuals who were protected, strengthened, or guided by the prayers of their spiritual fathers. However, we are not to see this as  magic; nor are we to see it as something that would protect us from hardship, or the crosses we may be called to carry. Rather what is emphasized for us is the radical solidarity that exists among us as men and women of faith. We do not travel the road through this world in isolation. Rather, we are under the care of others or we are responsible for on another’s well-being. 
As so many times before, such stories emphasize for us the need for humility. We have to let go of the illusion of power. In fact, we cannot present the gospel from a standpoint of power, at least not as it is seen and understood in the world. The love that we bear witness to is obedient and self-emptying. The truth and the wisdom that we speak is that of the kingdom. Are these the realities the guide us in our life?  Are our sensibilities any different from those who do not have faith?
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:10:14 FrDavid Abernethy: page 322
 
00:10:23 FrDavid Abernethy: New Hypothesis XXXIX
 
00:29:03 Rachel : This happens when we in our ascetic efforts in union with Christ, try to divest ourselves of self and the world.
 
00:31:11 Anthony: I just finished reading St. Bonaventure's life of St. Francis.  It made the real power of intercession more real to me. St. Francis and his friars are very much in the mold of these older Fathers.  It shows me the real catholicity of the Faith.
 
00:40:16 carol nypaver: What would you recommend for a young man who feels drawn to the priesthood in this day/age?
 
00:48:57 David Fraley: Reacted to "What would you recom…" with 👍
 
01:09:04 Anthony: Modern practical question: Does this speak to Concealed Carry of Firearms, especially now when brigandage is more common than in past decades?
 
01:14:58 Ambrose Little, OP: Be inspired by the circumcellions! ;)
 
01:15:55 Paul Fifer: “He said to them, “But now one who has a money bag should take it, and likewise a sack, and one who does not have a sword should sell his cloak and buy one.”  Luke 22:27
 
01:17:07 Rodrigo Castillo: Ambrose:  Donatists in North Africa in St. Augustine’s time.
 
01:20:52 Paul Fifer: The verse before that… “He said to them, “When I sent you forth without a money bag or a sack or sandals, were you in need of anything?” “No, nothing,” they replied.”
 
01:22:13 Ambrose Little, OP: NAB commentary at end of that passage: “It is enough!: the farewell discourse ends abruptly with these words of Jesus spoken to the disciples when they take literally what was intended as figurative language about being prepared to face the world’s hostility.”
 
01:26:07 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 

City a Desert Lecture Series, Lecture Three: Interiorized Monasticism Part III: Chastity and Obedience

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XIV: On Gluttony, Part I

Tonight we picked up with Step, 14 on “that clamorous mistress, the stomach“. Climacus begins to draw us into a discussion of one of the most important and neglected spiritual practices - fasting and the struggle with gluttony. 
This is a struggle, Saint John tells us, that remains with us through our entire life. Our desire for food or our misuse of food is something that is part of the very fabric of our life. It is a bodily appetite. Not unlike other appetites, it must be ordered toward the good or in the way that is in accord with the wisdom of God. 
Yet, John tells us, gluttony is hypocrisy of the stomach. In a sense it deceives us. Even when we are filled, it tells us that we are empty, and even when we are bursting, it “cries out that it is hungry.“.  It also leads us to devise seasonings, and sweet and rich dishes. The moment that we think that we have control of it, it shows itself in another area of our life. Unchecked, it leads to something even more serious - fornication. If we do not order this basic appetite for food, then we are going to be disordered and the use of our other bodily appetites, including our sexual appetite. And so, St. John tells us that he who coddles the body makes it wilder.  If we do not control it, then it will overcome us. 
If we are self-aware, we know we eat for many different reasons. On an emotional level, we often eat to console ourselves or because we are feeling aggressive or anxiety. We distract ourselves and deal with feelings of emptiness by filling our bodies with food. There are many ways that we convince ourselves that restraining ourselves is inappropriate. For example, we tell ourselves that hospitality demands that we break our fasting practices. Rather than being honest with ourselves and others, we freely let go of these disciplines, not out of love for others but to satisfy our baser needs.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:38 Bonnie Lewis: I agree wholeheartedly!
 
00:15:46 Bonnie Lewis: Let's do it.
 
00:16:35 CMoran: Was it Rod Dreher?
 
00:36:57 Anthony: On Fasting, I recall sayings from people like St. Paisios to the effect that we live like pagans since we neglect prayer and fasting.  I wonder if there is an inverse correlation between a failure to fast and pray and the increased use of unwholesome images.
 
00:38:05 Jeff O.: Is there a reason or importance in the way Climacus orders anger and acedia before gluttony/fornication/greed etc on the ladder? I just find it interesting the order of things and the way he presents the vices
 
00:42:30 David Swiderski: What is the best practice in fasting. I fasted with a Syrian roommate a couple years he for Ramadan me for Lent. The hardest was no water all day which could be dangerous. What was strange most Muslims gain weight and have huge feasts every night and before the sunrose would drink juices to excess.
 
00:53:24 Anthony: I was talking about Easter Grain pie within the last 90 minutes....
 
00:56:49 Eric Ewanco: If we go over to someone's house during a fasting/abstinence period, how should we handle this if they plan food that breaks the discipline?
 
00:57:07 angelo: Reacted to "If we go over to som..." with 👍
 
00:58:24 Ambrose Little, OP: Well, our Lord did tell us to not appear to be fasting. 🙂
 
00:58:37 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "Well, our Lord did t..." with 👏🏻
 
01:01:08 Ambrose Little, OP: “When you give, do not let your right hand know what your left hand is doing.” There does seem to be an impetus to “hide” our discipline and good works, to avoid pride.
 
01:01:14 Bonnie Lewis: excellent Father
 
01:01:17 Brad Smith: Your reference to hospitality as an excuse for gluttony seems the height of fornication (paragraph 1) as it is essentially to use the other person as a means to our own ends; gluttony is to misuse God’s good creation for our self-centered ends. Yes?
 
01:02:07 Brad Smith: I meant paragraph 5…Brad
 
01:02:07 Ambrose Little, OP: So we can’t win. LOL
 
01:04:37 CMoran: A few of my casual Catholic friends think that no meat on Friday has been done away with after the reforms.
 
01:05:43 CMoran: Not even knowing that some other penance is required.
 
01:08:28 Helena Babington Guiles: He who is in us is greater than he who is  in the world…and when we commune with Him within, His  nourishment exceeds any other.
 
01:10:49 Ren Witter: I am going to someone’s house for dinner tomorrow, and they already know I am vegetarian so I was going to just go and eat what was there, but I literally just texted them to say I can’t have eggs or cheese 😄. It makes me feel strangely anxious 🤣 I also told them to blame Father David 😄
 
01:11:09 Bonnie Lewis: Reacted to "I am going to someon..." with 😂
 
01:11:20 angelo: can we replace fasting with good works? This was my experience years ago when I was aspirant in a religious community.
 
01:14:07 Eric Ewanco: You can't "beat your body and make it your slave" (St. Paul) by doing good works
 
01:14:13 carol nypaver: We should not make others “suffer” because of our sacrifices. Right?
 
01:15:35 Rebecca Thérèse: I thought that the recommendation for a fast day was two small meals OR one large one, is that what you meant?
 
01:16:18 Debra: I gave up coffee on Lent...and my family suffered lol
 
01:17:16 Eric Ewanco: @rebecca the requirement is one meal, and up to two smaller meals not adding up to another meal as needed to maintain your strength
 
01:17:18 Ren Witter: Replying to "I thought that the r..."
 
In the Latin Rite the official rule is “one large meal, and two small meals that do not together equal one large meal” and yes, its pretty lame :-D
 
01:17:25 Ren Witter: Reacted to "@rebecca the require..." with 👍
 
01:17:49 carol nypaver: When I have to prepare a meal for someone who is “wheat-free,” meat-free, dairy-free makes me not want to host them.  They don’t have allergies, just sacrificing these things.  That makes me “suffer."
 
01:17:58 Bonnie Lewis: No, don't Father.  Amen
 
01:18:25 Rebecca Thérèse: @Ren thanks
 
01:20:05 Ambrose Little, OP: Here’s the USCCB on the topic: https://www.usccb.org/prayer-and-worship/liturgical-year-and-calendar/lent/us-bishops-pastoral-statement-on-penance-and-abstinence  
 
The focus seems to be about internalizing and owning our asceticism (as Christian adults) rather than having it spoon fed to us in a one-size-fits-all approach. But the important part of the message seems to have been lost on many.
 
01:21:05 Eric Ewanco: "many" is an understatement
 
01:21:30 Bonnie Lewis: I never hear this spoken on from the pulpit.
 
01:22:17 Ren Witter: Replying to "When I have to prepa..."
 
Its actually a pretty reasonable thought - “don’t host them” when I think about it. If I had friends, and they were strictly kosher for instance, it would be basically impossible for me to host them because I don’t know how to cook that way. At that point, its better if we go to a kosher restaurant, or if I simply go to their home and play with the kids while they cook.
 
01:22:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:23:26 CMoran: Thank you Father...excellent session...most
necessary for me!
 
01:23:35 angelo: Thank you
 
01:23:37 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:23:44 Cath Lamb: Thank you!
 
01:23:44 Debra: Thank you Father! This was really good!
 
01:23:47 iPhone (2): Thank you!
 
01:25:02 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos, Hypothesis XXXVIII

As we move more deeply into the first volume of the Evergetinos - reading hypothesis 38 - we find ourselves also being drawn more deeply into the mystery of humility and obedience. The wisdom of God, revealed in our Lord through his incarnation and through the Paschal mystery, shows us the vulnerability of divine love and humility. For the love of us Christ empties himself, becomes a slave and obedient unto death on the cross. It is upon him that we must fix our gaze if we are not to be drawn into the illusions of pride. 
Religious people are not above having their own delusions; including and especially the delusion of holiness. We hold on to the demands of our ego. Pride rules our will.  Thus, we were given multiple stories this evening of God in his providence guiding souls along a path He desires and presenting them with circumstances that unexpectedly revealed to them these greater truths. There is so much of us that is prideful that we are often blind to the humble ways that God comes to us and reject those through whom He speaks to us.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:43 FrDavid Abernethy: page 314 letter C
 
00:23:57 Anthony: Is this the concept of "doing Purgatory" now so you don't have to go to Purgatory later?
 
00:39:57 Anthony: On preaching the gospel, among "Evangelicals," there is an emphasis of calling someone to recognize their sin and "accept Christ."  That doesn't seem to be the Catholic tradition, is it?  In the Bible it seems only prophets did that and we are not prophets.
 
00:47:24 Eric Ewanco: think you missed a paragraph?
 
01:13:16 Anthony: This so goes against modern education.  The intellect is separated from morals and we are taught to set ourselves up as judges
 
01:17:04 Anthony: "you have many teachers but not many fathers"
 

City a Desert Lecture Series, Lecture Two: Interiorized Monasticism Part II: Fundamental Principles

INTERIORIZED MONASTICISM PART II FUNDAMENTAL ELEMENTS
• Prayer• Eschatological Maximalism• Evangelical Counsels as Seen through Three Temptations of Christ in the Desert:
1. Poverty
Next Week:
Chastity: the Sacredness of Creation and the Virginity of Heart that Should Belong to All
Obedience to God: Receptivity to the Spirit of Truth and the Creative Freedom of the Life of Grace.

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XIII: On Despondency

How do we talk about and understand despondency? I never heard about the word or the nature of the vice until I was in my 20s and after having read the fathers. And yet we hear from the fathers that it is the greatest and gravest of the eight capital vices. It afflicts the soul in such a way that it draws it into darkness. The soul loses its capacity to see the presence of God or to love the things of God. It becomes most dangerous when we are engaged in the spiritual life in isolation; either as those who live the life of a hermit, or as those who see the spiritual life as a private affair.  We live in a radical solidarity with each other, and with God. Our understanding of this, and our embrace of that reality may be the one thing that keeps us from falling into a general death. 
This demon uses the most subtle forms of temptation to make us lax in our spiritual practice or come to despise it all together. There are very few remedies for it for this reason. One must remember death and the brevity of our life. We must understand that we are in the end times and see the urgency of the moment. We must also cling to obedience; placing our thoughts before another and allow them to guide us when we cannot see the path before us. 
Prayer filled with hope, St. John tells us, is the only thing that brings this vice to utter death. Only when we cling to He who is life and love and hope and let go of the illusion that we can simply endure the spiritual trials of this world on our own will this vice be conquered. But once it is conquered, a person has come to experience all that is good; they are prepared for every spiritual battle that lies ahead.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:19:17 David: Question on translation: Acedia wouldn't this be closer to insouciant or melancholy rather than despondency?
 
00:35:37 Daniel Allen: Despondency is a child of talkativeness but community life is opposed to it? That seems sort of contradictory.
 
00:37:21 Anthony: The spirit of despondency also perverts a concept of what it means to be "elect": I am the only true one, everyone is against me."  That's not a good place to be.
 
00:37:51 Daniel Allen: As a follow up it seems that despondency is always a lurking threat.
 
00:38:32 Daniel Allen: Ok that clears it up thank you
 
00:41:21 Cindy Moran: Noonday Devil from Ps 90:6 [DRV]
 
00:43:22 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Also, many monks would not eat before 3 pm so beginning around midday hunger and hungers may start.
 
00:46:55 Anthony: The dinner bell represents hope that suffering will end.
 
00:59:02 Kathy: What do you mean by deification?
 
01:00:26 Eric Ewanco: Deification is become by grace what Christ was by nature -- becoming God-like, sharing in the divinity of Christ as he shared in our humanity, being partakers of the divine nature (2 Peter 1:3-4)
 
01:01:26 Anthony: A great Roman Catholic imagery / interpretation of deification is in Dante's "Paradiso," especially the later cantos.
 
01:02:14 Kathy: Thanks
 
01:06:45 Daniel Allen: St Therese - “May you trust God that you are exactly where you are meant to be.”
 
01:06:59 Kristen Brotemarkle: beautiful quote, thanks for sharing that. ^
 
01:09:55 Liz: Sorry, what´s the name of the author Father is talking
about?
 
01:10:26 Anthony: Paul Evdekimov
 
01:10:32 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Paul Evdokimov
 
01:10:35 Liz: Thank you!!!
 
01:18:25 Ambrose Little, OP: Gender equality. Very modern.
 
01:20:56 Jeff O.: It seems like despondency (and gluttony as well) have a tendency or propensity to draw us towards numbing…which, paired with the nature of our culture which attempts to provide numbing or comforting in all things seems like an almost double whammy of sorts…
 
01:21:34 Anthony: Reacted to "It seems like desp..." with 👍
 
01:24:21 Kristen Brotemarkle: Reacted to "It seems like despon..." with 👍
 
01:37:38 Art: Got me too!
 
01:38:30 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:38:53 Rodrigo Castillo: That is a great idea!  The forum!
 
01:39:53 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...rich teaching tonight.
 
01:39:57 Jeff O.: This was great! Thank you.
 
01:40:07 David: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos, Hypothesis XXXVII

How does one approach something such as grumbling and murmuring against others, or complaining about what our judgment and sensibilities react to negatively in our lives? How is it that we suspend that judgment? Beyond this, how is it that we let it go all together and allow ourselves to be drawn along in the darkness of faith; where God alone illuminates the path before us to draw us into the truth and the love of the kingdom? 
 
The short answer to all of these questions is: through experience. Only God can reveal to the human heart that has the faith, perhaps only the size of a mustard seed, the depths of His mind and His truth. The greatest miracle, if you will, is to move the mountain of our ego and self-esteem. Our passions make it so difficult to keep our focus solely upon God, upon his love, and upon the truth that is being revealed to us. 
 
These stories are not about disciples being slavishly obedient to their masters no matter what the circumstances. In fact, the stories given to us tonight were how novices and disciples, who were pure of heart, were able to see the truth with clarity and bring about the conversion of their Elders who had lost their way. The stories are presented to us in order that we would not be tempted into condescension. We must understand that God can reprove us and correct us in the most unexpected of ways. What these hypotheses (36 & 37) reveal to us is the preeminence of humility and love. Age, experience or depth of discipline are no guarantee that we will see the truth or embrace it. May God have mercy and illuminate our hearts.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:12:16 FrDavid Abernethy: page 309
 
00:12:34 FrDavid Abernethy: On Grumbling :-)
 
00:33:19 Eric Ewanco: In terms of grumbling, I was listening today to a podcast on joy and the speaker pointed out that the early Christians did not even complain about Nero (who took Christians, covered them with tar, and lit them to shed light on his parties), but kept their focus on God and their own faith, and cultivating joy in the midst of persecution. A good lesson for us today in the hostile environment we live in where Christians tend to get distracted by their grumbling over the circumstances.
 
00:48:21 Eric Ewanco: Doesn't this just contradict everything we've heard previously about the value and importance of unalloyed obedience?
 
01:16:26 Anthony: "Father David, Build My Church, which you can see is in ruins"?
 
01:19:56 Ambrose Little, OP: It seems like the habit of humility teaches us to see more clearly. Humility as “true self knowledge,” but with that practice of patience with yourself and with others, not jumping to conclusions and avoiding rashly adopting opinions of others. You give yourself time and suppress the passions that can interfere with being open to seeing things as they really are. So that practice of humble obedience is at least in part what helps us to see more clearly when it might be right to not obey—or at least not obey in particulars in order to be obedient in a a deeper way, as with that disciple tonight.
 

Repentance

I have one word for tonight‘s group: Beautiful! Repentance “brings to us the power of the living God, revealing once again, the true Christ Jesus who dwells in us.” As with so many aspects of the faith, we have a tendency to compartmentalize not only the practice of virtue or of prayer but of our relationship with God as a whole. Yet our faith and our relationship with God should touch the very fabric of our beings and shape the essence of every relationship and every work that we engage in throughout the course of our lives. It should shape also our experience of death and our realization of our own mortality. Repentance is not an episodic reality but a continual effort, the continual straining of the heart - reaching out to God to experience his love and mercy. In this sense it is the most important of things.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:06:18 sue and mark: microphone is not working
 
00:08:33 Ren Witter: PDF Handout: https://mcusercontent.com/c38acab568d650f7ef65f39df/files/34558acb-864f-f9f8-1546-e7decdc9605b/Repentance.pdf
 
00:34:44 charlesevers: What gets us (causes) trapped into thinking of past sins?
 
00:34:55 Irene Bridget Hutchinson: Fr, how would a scrupulous person go about being constantly repentant with peace of soul?
 
00:44:00 David: The past few years I have also focused on taking time in prayer and adoration to express gratitude and thanksgiving. Isn't it equality important to give thanks as to deepen repentance. No amount of regret changes the past, no amount of worry will change the future but any gratitude will change the present.
 
00:50:52 charlesevers: Very good. Thank you Father.  Excellent explanation.
 
00:55:37 charlesevers: St. Bonaventure wrote a colloquay
 
01:12:54 Rachel : Yes. Only true Beauty. Most,. I include myself, can tend to misuse t|
 
01:21:53 Missi White: That's a tough pill to swallow, especially in what has become such a narcissistic culture.  How I needed this conference, thank you!
 
01:24:26 Art: Helpful reminder for me at times: But to all who received him, who believed in his name, he gave power to become children of God; who were born, not of blood nor of the will of the flesh nor of the will of man, but of God. (Jn 1:12-13)
 
01:25:21 Bonnie Lewis: I have found that when I pray for someone who is causing me to harbor a resentment toward them, I am the one who changes internally.  The other person may remain exactly how they were, yet I have received a peace of mind and thought toward them.  This doesn't happen overnight.  sometimes it takes some time.
 
01:36:29 Rachel : Who wrote the book? A continual effort. With no temptation or battle a soldier is not made stronger through resisting. St. Faustina, and  St Therese had clear experiences of people who tried their patience. They felt the irritation. Its not like the new lens that Father is speaking of will mean that somone will not need to actively practice patience but that the life of repentence, living constantly in the presence of God, in Truth, the person "drunk with compunction" just simply cannot not forgive when they see who they really are in Christ and the dignity of others as well. All mankind seen through the lens of love
 
01:37:12 Rachel : This book should be gone through very slowly.
 
01:41:33 Rachel : I think Ren mentioned that this past year in a group! I need to get that book.
 
01:44:13 Bonnie Lewis: Thank you Father David.  This was beautiful.
 
01:44:15 David: Thank you Father!
 
01:44:27 charlesevers: Thank you Father.  This was wonderful
 
01:44:30 Lori Hatala: so very helpful.
 
01:44:31 Rachel : lol
 
01:44:31 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:44:32 Melissa Kummerow: Yes thank you! I like the occasional "bonus" groups :)
 
01:44:34 Rachel : Thank you
 
01:45:17 Rachel : Thank you
 
01:45:18 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:45:26 Cindy Moran: I hope Father's talj will be available for what I missed.
 
01:45:27 Rachel : Praying for you
 
01:45:31 Mary Jo: Thank you !!
 
01:45:31 Mitch: Very profound. Thankyou Father take care
 

City a Desert Lecture Series, Lecture One: Introduction to Interiorized Monasticism

INTRODUCTION TO INTERIORIZED MONASTICISM
Interiorized Monasticism and Ascetic Ideal:• Obscured: Out of reach to majority.• Revealed: Fundamental principle of life in Christ.
Eschatological Dimensions:
Obscured: Life cut off from the world or world cut off
from life of the kingdom.
Revealed: Incarnation and kingdom of God present;
Kingdom within through gift of the Spirit (active eschatology, touching every aspect of the world; living now in light of the End).
Beauty Saves the World:
Obscured: Culture as cult, autonomous from God and
guided by sensibilities of the age.
Revealed: Rediscovery of culture through the beauty
of holiness. Jesus is the Holy One - the most beautiful of the sons of men. He is the perfect icon, manifesting God unveiled.
The Monastic Ideal:
Obscured: Return to the ancient forms of monastic
ascesis.
Revealed: Internalized. The human psyche is renewed
from within.
Five Fundamental Elements of Interiorized Monasticism (Upcoming Lectures):
• Prayer• Eschatological Maximalism • Poverty• Chastity• Obedience

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XII: On Lying

Tonight we read Step number 12 on Lying. Surprisingly this has always been a challenging step to read and to read as a group. Immediately our minds begin to swirl with the costs of loving the Truth and understanding that Truth is a person. Our starting point in such discussions is often examples that are extreme; things or circumstances that people might face within this life where lying might be justified. St. John addresses this and much more within the step. However, one has to be willing to suspend judgment and allow St. John to guide us along a path that deepens our sensitivity in regards to the Truth as a whole. Our starting point must be Christ. We must begin to understand that lying is a sin against charity, and to lie when making a vow or an oath is a denial of God himself. St. John understands very well that the Evil One can use something as innocent and enjoyable as humor to justify and to legitimize lying.  Yet, John tells us that there are no small lies and once spoken they have an effect upon ourselves and others. They diminish the spirit of mourning; that is, compunction within the human heart. In doing so they distract us from the remembrance of God and the things of God. We must remember that God has given us a conscience, a means of knowing the truth with Him. This is what we must form through the gospel and through our participation in the life of Christ. We must also remember that the Evil One is the Father of Lies and will use a lie under the pretext of protecting others. In the face of this, St. John tells us, “when we are completely cleansed of lying, then we can resort to it, but only with fear and as occasion demands.” Only when the heart has been completely purified, where there is no love of falsehood and where there is the presence of great discernment, can such a decision be made. To love truth, St. John tells us, is the root of every good because it is to love Christ.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:25:04 Anthony Rago: I've also been thinking that our bodies and societies are parables of truth; and we can be lying by engaging in bad lifestyles.
 
00:37:35 Anthony Rago: I can imagine a confessor becoming very exasperated if we treat all this as confessable sins; and it would be very wearing on all of us.
 
00:39:28 David Swiderski: Like many other things isn't discernment take a place here. Is this so people will think I am funny (pride), will this hurt someone, will it erode trust (the cost of lies) or lead to a habit?
 
00:39:39 Anthony Rago: That makes sense, thanks
 
00:40:57 Cindy Moran: Corrie ten Boom  lied to the Nazis when they asked if jews were in the house. This is ok?
 
00:44:09 Ren Witter: I feel like this is a really hard one. Intellectually, I actually feel like it is easy to understand. Emotionally, it kind of feels like one of those instances where being Christian can feel like a “kill-joy” to put it in a light way. Maybe the immense anxiety I feel in response to this is coming from the fear that being a Christian means no joy or every-day happiness. Its weird because I know that that isn’t true, but sometimes it can be hard to reconcile the lived experience of Christianity with the things the Fathers write.
 
00:46:34 Debra: Replying to "Corrie ten Boom  lie..."
 
I've read a priest's response to this, is Yes, it's ok; because the Nazis didn't have a right to what's going on in their home
That we have dignity, and a right to privacy
 
I'm interested to hear what Fr Abernethy says 😄
 
00:55:06 Anthony Rago: With humor - movies, comedy routines, Facebook - it is easy to go along, and then the story teller sneaks in covert of blatant evil things, and "bam," there they are in the head, coming to mind in an ambush when they are most unwelcome.
 
01:04:10 Daniel Allen: Ok so this may be making a little more sense to me. If the concern is with Truth, and Truth is a person, then we can have a tendency to come between Truth and another person (between the other and his remembrance of Truth Himself), which sort of reminds me of two parts of the Gospel - better to have a millstone tied around your neck and cast into the sea than to cause the fall of one of these little ones, and also, what God has joined let no man divide. Neither are traditionally applied to this type of thought, but if by our jesting, and always (or often) making light of things we can get between a person and his remembrance of God (or mourning), then in a way we are doing just that on a spiritual level, dividing the person from his remembrance of God. We can (generally unintentionally) get between God and another person, and generally to pump up our own ego. The lying part makes sense, it’s the joking that’s hard to get.
 
01:11:37 Jacqulyn: Proverbs 26:18-19 - Like a maniac shooting flaming arrows of death is one who deceives their neighbor and says, "I was only joking."
 
01:15:40 Debra: Cindy Moran, up above, asked about that very point
 
01:20:23 David Swiderski: The trap of whataboutism deflects from a general truth
 
01:23:09 Bonnie Lewis: So I will only be finally cleansed in Purgatory?
 
01:23:49 Debra: In vino veritas
 
01:24:08 Anthony Rago: Greek Text of this chapter is here: https://el.wikisource.org/wiki/%CE%9A%CE%BB%CE%AF%CE%BC%CE%B1%CE%BE/%CE%9B%CF%8C%CE%B3%CE%BF%CF%82_%CE%99%CE%92
I can barely read Greek and can't now locate the word "torture."
 
01:25:16 Ambrose Little, OP: About being jovial, I have a fondness for this part of St. Thomas Aquinas’ prayer “for ordering a life wisely” (notably the last three lines):
 
O Lord my God, make me
          submissive without protest,
          poor without discouragement,
          chaste without regret,
          patient without complaint,
          humble without posturing,
          cheerful without frivolity,
          mature without gloom,
          and quick-witted without flippancy.
 
Being dour and scolding is not good, neither is flippancy and frivolity. Cheerfulness is a good thing within measure.
 
01:25:32 Anthony Rago: "agoneia"
 
01:25:49 Debra: Reacted to "About being jovial, ..." with ❤️
 
01:25:50 Daniel Allen: I think one thing I take from this is that I often don’t consider the significance of my own words, and that words have greater significance than generally thought
 
01:26:08 carol nypaver: Reacted to "About being jovial, ..." with ❤️
 
01:26:09 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "About being jovial, …" with 🔥
 
01:26:25 Cath Lamb: Reacted to "I think one thing I ..." with ❤️
 
01:27:19 Anthony Rago: Reacted to "About being jovial..." with ❤️
 
01:27:21 Cath Lamb: Thank you!
 
01:27:27 Cindy Moran: Excellent session...thank you Father
 
01:27:30 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:27:42 Art: Thank you!
 
01:27:55 Jeff O.: Thank you! Good to be with you all.
 
01:27:59 Bonnie Lewis: Prayers of course!
 
01:29:15 Bonnie Lewis: that's right because I received an email.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXV, Part II and Hypothesis XXXVI

In these hypotheses, we have been reflecting upon the practice of asceticism, especially in light of the relationship between an Elder and his disciple; that is, in relationship to obedience. We are shown in these stories the ABC’s of the ascetic life and in particular that of the virtue of obedience. 
 
What does it mean to let go of private judgment? What does it mean to set aside one’s will even in small things in our day-to-day life? How do we train the mind and the heart in this virtue; so that when we are asked to pick up our cross or when we are reduced to raw endurance and cannot see the road ahead of us, we are able to respond in love?  We are shown in the stories that one must begin small. It is in letting go of our sensitivities in the small things, and allowing love to trump everything that this virtue takes root. It means being more attentive to the “other”, to what is asked of us and what people need, than to holding on to what we want, or what seems right or convenient to us. 
 
There is part of us that shrinks back in a spirit of objection to what is being taught here. It seems unnatural to us. But what is really being asked of us or rather where we are being led to embrace is the supernatural. What we are being guided to is the perfect love and self emptying obedience that we see in Christ. We should have a similar desire to have obedience to God’s will as our very food.  We must see it as something that sustains and nourishes us mystically. 
 
Not fulfilling the will of God or choosing the path of sin should become something that is abhorrent to us. Such lessons can be learned only with humility. Beyond this, we are shown the incredible responsibility of those who are elders. Their actions, their requests and demands of their disciples must be rooted in the desire for their salvation, and for their good. They will be held accountable as shepherds.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:17 David Fraley: Hello Mrs Abernethy!
 
00:08:28 FrDavid Abernethy: page 305
 
00:08:28 David Fraley: Hi Fr David!
 
00:08:35 FrDavid Abernethy: Hi Dave!!
 
00:14:32 Debra: Step 11...on talkativeness....was really convicting
 
00:14:51 FrDavid Abernethy: yes it was!!
 
00:15:10 Debra: Ooops...wrong meeting LOL
 
00:25:19 Rachel: Maybe he wanted to see if his disciple was stuoid.
 
00:25:37 Rachel: stupid. Sorry. I should not joke.
 
00:28:57 iPhone: Reacted to "Maybe he wanted to s…" with ❤️
 
00:29:19 Rachel: Yes, I doubt he was stupid nor did the elder think that.
 
00:30:07 Rachel: I wonder though, what would be all of our reactions to this reality in our everyday lives?
 
00:52:38 Anthony Rago: This has got to be specific to novices.  Saints (Elizabeth of Hungary?) are praised for charity against the wishes of the head of household
 
00:55:36 Anthony Rago: But if these people can't use discretion, they also can fall into legalism - oops I don't have permission, I can't act on my own.
 
00:58:32 Anthony Rago: The religious life then is horribly dangerous.
 
01:01:01 Anthony Rago: That indicates then that people cannot abandon their discretion, they have to withhold some obedience, so they can  judge the situation, whether it is healthy or crazy - or just not for them.
 
01:05:15 Anthony Rago: Yes, I've seen situations both of people in religious life and married life that were just psychologically off.
 
01:05:25 Ambrose Little, OP: He also says submit to each other.
 
01:08:30 Debra: I always suggest Chrysogonus
 
01:09:09 Debra: for a baby's name
He could just be called Chrys
 
01:18:36 Rachel: Thank you all, Thank you Father
 
01:19:08 Rachel: :) lol
 

To Love Fasting

Tonight we explored an often neglected aspect of the spiritual life; or one might better say an essential part of the spiritual life – Fasting. Throughout the spiritual tradition, we have heard the Saints tell us that “prayer without fasting is weak” or that “where there is no prayer and fasting there are demons.”
With the coming of Christ, however, we see a unique and distinctive meaning of fasting emerge. It is not only a discipline to help order the appetites or a form of penitence. It is tied directly to Christ: what we see in His practice and in what He teaches us about it.  His own fasting is guided by the Holy Spirit in preparation for embracing the Father’s will, and His desire that it might be accomplished. Beyond this, Christ teaches us that our practice of fasting is forever tied to our desire for Him. He is the Heavenly Bridegroom and each soul the Bride. We see and experience in Him the One alone who can satisfy the deepest desires of the human heart. He is the Bread of Life. 
The focus of our discussion this night was on recapturing not only the practice of fasting, but seeing it as something that is to be “loved”, precisely because it draws us to Christ. It is not a discipline but a path to draw nearer to the Beloved.  
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Text of chat during the group:
00:25:01 Stephen McCane: I have doing this “Exodus 90” and it is like a warm up to Lent.
 
00:25:51 Stephen McCane: For women it is called “Fiat 90”.
 
00:45:48 Adam Paige: Hi Father, should laypeople share their Lenten fasting plans with their spiritual director in the same way Saint Benedict instructs his monks to do with their spiritual father in his rule ?
 
01:14:51 Victoria: here is the book pdf: https://ia902908.us.archive.org/6/items/tolovefasting/To%20Love%20Fasting.pdf
 
01:15:41 Victoria: Free on Internet Archive :)
 
01:16:14 Adam Paige: Original version in French: https://folleautonomie.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/adalbert-de-Vogue-Aimer-Le-Jeune.pdf
 
01:21:00 Adam Paige: Reacted to "here is the book pdf…" with 👍
 
01:33:07 angelo: Reacted to "here is the book pdf..." with ❤️
 
01:33:20 angelo: Replying to "here is the book pdf..."
 
thank you
 
01:33:53 Matt Mondorff: I’ve found that our physical bodies don’t require much food, it’s mainly our mind and habits that convince us that we’re hungry. So to realize that and push through the initial hunger, knowing it’s coming but we’ll be ok has helped me a lot. Then, little by little it gets easier to go longer and longer. Eating healthy and moderately helps also…it seems to my anyway
 
01:47:52 Lori Hatala: you can saute in broth.
 
01:48:12 Fr. Michael Winn: A former monk of Mt. Athos once told me that in North America it would be inadvisable to stop all use of oil during the winter seasons - reduce, but do not eliminate.
 
01:57:15 Kathy: My experience of fasting is that it is a type of prayer in and of itself.
01:59:22 angelo: Thank you for that short clarification of the centering prayer and the danger of falling into delusion.
 
02:06:09 angelo: Thank you so much Fr.
 
02:06:29 Lori Hatala: thank you so much Father.
 
02:06:31 Stephen McCane: Thank you Father.
 
02:06:33 Ryan McMann: Thank you!
 
02:06:40 Monk Maximos: Thank you Father
 
02:07:18 kevin: thanks father that was great!!
 
02:07:21 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
02:07:22 Fr. Michael Winn: Thanks, Father!
 
02:07:25 Rachel Pineda: Thank you father Abernethy!!
 
02:07:31 Siggy Evers: Thank you Fr.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XI: On Talkativeness and Silence

Tonight, we read Step number 11 on “talkativeness and silence.”  Fittingly, it is very brief, if not the briefest of all of the steps of The Ladder. This brevity is St. John’s way of teaching us that so much of our speech involves vainglory; putting ourselves on display. We seek through it to step out of ourselves; betraying the painful experience we have as human beings of our lack of identity.  God has created us for himself. He has created us in his image and likeness precisely that we might not experience ourselves in isolation, but rather in communion. However, to enter into communion with God means to step out of our limited ways of perceiving the world around us and reality as a whole. This means allowing God, through the silence,to draw us in faith into the experience of His life, light and love.  To give ourselves over to talkativeness is to find ourselves dissipated. Our desire for God cools and the emptiness that we feel drives us to fill our lives with anything and everything so that we do not feel alone. Despite having God dwelling within us, once we lose sight of him, silence becomes an enemy. Therefore, John tells us that we must foster silence as a habit. We must allow God to show us its value, and what it makes possible for us. The first step is to create external silence. Once we have done this, we often see the unsettledness of our minds and hearts.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:11:45 Cindy Moran: Is your patron saint Matthew?
 
00:15:18 John & Heather: Do you mind mentioning what edition this group uses?
 
00:15:54 Debra: I saw your post on FB about it
 
00:16:41 John & Heather: Replying to "Do you mind mentioni..."
 
Great...thank you.
 
00:16:43 Cindy Moran: I really liked Ren's presentation on the prayer rope
 
00:17:38 FrDavid Abernethy: Yes.  Excellent.  She makes the most exquisite prayer ropes as well.
 
00:17:51 FrDavid Abernethy: Maybe she will put up the website address.
 
00:27:32 Eric Ewanco: My translation says "foe of license" instead of "enemy of freedom of speech"
 
00:41:56 Bonnie Lewis: This is why adoration before the Blessed Sacrament is such a beautiful gift where silence is filled with God's love for us.
 
00:43:12 Vicki Nichols: Would this silence include silencing the "inner chatter" of your thoughts or is it only external silence?
 
00:53:28 Rebecca Thérèse: I've found that people who chatter continuously don't care if you're listening or not so I can zone out!
 
00:54:01 wayne: Reacted to "I've found that peop..." with 😂
 
00:55:21 iPhone: Amen
 
00:56:08 Ambrose Little, OP: Reacted to "I've found that peop..."
with 😂
 
00:58:48 iPhone: Totally
 
00:59:06 Ambrose Little, OP: My in-laws feel that way about visiting here—the kiddos are a constant background buzzing. 🙂 You can get acclimated..
 
00:59:19 Eric Ewanco: How do we in the world balance silence with the cultivation of valuable relationships in life, for example at work or whatever? In other words, how do we discern the threshold of silence to maintain -- there is the absolute silence of a monk, and the rambling of the garroulous, where do we draw the line?
 
01:00:17 Debra: I wear hearing aids, but only if I'm going somewhere were I HAVE to listen...like Mass, or meetings
As soon as I'm out of that meeting, I take out my aids, because the world is such a noisy place!!
 
01:00:54 Debra: Reacted to "My in-laws feel that..." with 😁
 
01:08:21 iPhone: + 1
 
01:12:20 Anthony Rago: Being someone who does work from home, and lives alone, the silence does not feel too great all the time.  Only the deep silence when in my workshop or working in my kitchen or dining room or times like that is satisfying.
 
01:12:49 Debra: So much ambient noise...Like you mentioned, noise does create anxiety
I can literally feel tension leave, when I take my hearing aids out.
 
01:13:18 Debra: Reacted to "Being someone who do..." with 🤗
 
01:16:40 iPhone: Making a note of it
 
01:16:53 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:48 Debra: Thanks be to God
 
Thank you! Good night!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXV, Part I

Obedience!  The root of the word is to hear or to listen. What emerges in reading the fathers is that our capacity to hear the word of God is rooted in our willingness to set aside our own willfulness, ego, and our private judgment. We often become obstinate and entrenched in our own view of things in such a way that we are no longer able to hear the advice or counsel of others. We are shown in this evening’s text that sometimes we must be left to our own devices to experience the poverty of our choices that are contrary to the will of God and His love. 
What also emerges is that obedience is not rooted in law but love. Obedience is the fruit of a deep relationship with God, and with one’s spiritual elder. An elder must love his disciple, and recognize that he bears responsibility for his salvation and so must give him constant care. The disciple must reciprocate this love and respect. In doing so, he enables the elder to be a true shepherd and not a mere hireling. This mutual obedience elevates the entire church and allows it to make present the humble love of Christ crucified to the world.
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:49:18 Anthony Rago: I may have heard that sentiment too
 
00:49:29 Ambrose Little, OP: It’s probably saying that he’s true enough to Scripture and expansive in his guidance to cover such a loss. But it’s just a hypothetical.
 
00:50:35 Ambrose Little, OP: Hyperbole, like when Jesus says to cut off the hand that causes us to sin. Exaggeration to make a point about the quality of his teaching.
 
00:52:01 Anthony Rago: How may we properly revere persons not exactly in communion with Catholics?  I LOVE the works of St. Gregory of Narek - but if Pope Francis had not made him a Doctor of the Church, I would have forced myself to be cautious.  I'd love to go wholehearted into Coptic Orthodox spirituality / theology, but how cautious should we be?
 
01:00:58 Ambrose Little, OP: Echoes what St. Ignatius of Antioch (disciple of St. John the Apostle) says of the faithful’s relationship with their bishop.
 
01:12:12 Ambrose Little, OP: There is an amazing genius in the story-based instruction of the Evergetinos. It really makes ideas stick in a memorable way.
 
01:14:17 Anthony Rago: I'm open to it
 
01:14:19 David Fraley: I’d be interested.
 
01:14:21 carol nypaver: Sure!
 
01:14:29 Paul Fifer: Me too.
 
01:14:54 John & Heather: Would be interested.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter X: On Slander or Calumny, Part II

This evening we continued and completed Step number 10 on “slander and calumny.”  Something very special emerges about John in the writing of this step. We see something very personal about John’s capacity to love and his purity of heart. He acknowledges his own struggle with judging others as sinners, when in reality they were pure of heart in secret. Thus, John’s repeated counsel is not to judge at all; even when we see things with a kind of clarity. We often have blind spots and dark spots in our evaluation of the others. Beyond this, the Evil One puts before us smoke, if you will, making us think that there is sin present where none exist. 
All that we are allowed to do is to love others. This means that we always attribute their sin to the action of demons. We are to look for the good in others and look for ways that we can support and lift them up if they are struggling. This means setting aside the morbid delight that we take in judging and the feeling of emotional power that we think it gives us over and against them. We must acknowledge the radical solidarity that exist between us and foster a spirit of generosity towards each other. To seize for ourselves a prerogative that belongs only to God is ruinous to the soul. May God preserve us!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:23:24 Bridget McGinley: Father, sorry...little long....I just wanted to follow up from last week with a comment/question. I was not able to type this fast enough. It was in relation to what you were saying about being serious and stern in presenting the Faith. You mentioned about your early sermon and how it was perceived by the college kids. I used to be pretty sanguine. Life has taken it’s toll. I once heard Bishop Sheen say something that was pretty profound. He stated, “Christ had many emotions that were written about in the Bible but never did he smile or laugh.” Bishop Sheen stated that He is saving those for us in Heaven. Looking at Step 10 point 2 many people nowadays are pretty “shameless and very happy” and it is hard for me to find smiles and joy surrounded by the deluge. In tip-toeing around the obvious moral problems these days how does one escape mental slander which sometimes manifests as verbal slander? And how does one show a non-judgemental face?
 
00:37:37 iPhone: Anen Father
 
00:49:25 Rebecca Thérèse: Part of Leviticus 19 came into my mind in relation to not judging at all  15 You shall not render an unjust judgment; you shall not be partial to the poor or defer to the great: with justice you shall judge your neighbor. 16 You shall not go around as a slanderer[a] among your people, and you shall not profit by the blood[b] of your neighbor: I am the Lord.
 
17 You shall not hate in your heart anyone of your kin; you shall reprove your neighbor, or you will incur guilt yourself. 18 You shall not take vengeance or bear a grudge against any of your people, but you shall love your neighbor as yourself: I am the Lord.
 
00:57:02 Anthony Rago: Since the Late Middle Ages, our culture has been both immoral and curious.  We want the knowledge of St. Thomas Aquinas' Summas, but we have not as eagerly gone to the other side of him, the one that made the Pange Lingua
 
00:57:39 Anthony Rago: We want knowledge for curiousity's sake, but not the humility of devotion
 
00:57:54 Ambrose Little, OP: Do you think the nature of social media has made this particular trap of the Devil more prevalent?
 
00:58:30 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: How great it would be to always be centered on noting the virtues it observes in others!
 
00:58:47 Ambrose Little, OP: Amen, Sister!
 
01:03:12 Bridget McGinley: As a nurse I can attest it is physically and mentally debilitating communicating. Many of my co workers talk about how they can't even talk after a shift. Verbal interaction is very challenging.
 
01:11:45 Ambrose Little, OP: About #12 and #15.. I recently learned of a few very vocal critics (including a former apologist) in the Church ending up leaving the Faith, either entirely or moving to a sect. It’s very sad. There is something in what St. John is saying they’re for sure—that this kind of behavior can be ruinous.
 
01:17:21 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:17:23 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:18:23 Ren Witter: Philokalia.link/tolovefasting
 
01:18:41 carol nypaver: Time??
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXIV

Tonight we picked up with Hypothesis 34. Again we are introduced into the practice of asceticism; in particular, how it is embraced in the spirit of obedience. We were given multiple stories of individuals who, out of love for their elder, respond with an immediacy to their demand or request. In each case we are shown the deep fruit that this bears. 
However, the greater task for us is to look at our lives and to see if we have prepared our hearts to receive the seed of our Lord‘s word as he calls us to the life of holiness. Do we respond with swiftness when called to prayer or with zeal when called to embrace the practice of fasting or urgency when called respond to someone in need or jeopardy? 
What the stories show us is that obedience is based upon a relationship, not law. It is love that makes us run to respond to Christ and to those He has given to us to guide us along the path to Him. If our asceticism or obedience lacks this love, then it is something that is suspect.
---
Text of chat during the group: 
00:10:43 B David: hi all 
Ben David here.  sort of new here...
 
00:10:55 FrDavid Abernethy: welcome Ben!
 
00:12:24 David Fraley: Hello Ben!
 
00:12:59 David Fraley: I did. I found a place in West View.
 
00:21:09 Bridget McGinley: St Hesychios in the Philokalia states “ a faithful servant is one who expresses his faith in Christ through obedience to His commandments.  Father, if one cannot find an “elder” can one be assured of the graces and gifts of obedience by simply following the commandments?
 
00:24:33 Bridget McGinley: thank you
 
00:33:13 Anthony Rago: This is in stark contrast with the pagans - example the fear in the Adventures of Ulysses, in the trip to Hades, land of the shades.
 
00:35:22 Anthony Rago: The Coptic Hymn to St George names him the conqueror of his tormentors
 
01:14:40 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter IX: On Remembrance of Wrongs, Part II and Chapter X: On Slander or Calumny, Part I

The subtle movements of the human heart and mind stand revealed while reading the Ladder of Divine Ascent. As one makes one’s way through the text, it becomes clear that it is an inevitability. We must stand ready to have our hearts illuminated and the places that we desire to keep in darkness, whether consciously or unconsciously, exposed. Yet, somehow, when these words come from the pen of a Saint, there is a healing that one begins to experience; even as we know the sting of the words. Knowing and seeing the truth lightens the mind and the heart and opens us to experience the grace and the mercy of God. By removing the impediments to the action of that grace, we find ourselves no longer running with a heavy tread under the burden and the weight of some hidden guilt or wound, but freely and swiftly moving towards He who is Love. 
The jarring nature of John’s words is eventually overcome by the confidence in his desire, as well as God’s, to bring us healing. Such is the case with John’s description of the remembrance of wrongs. He makes it clear that without remedy, it can poison the heart and become dark spite. The more we nurture our anger, the more the heart becomes poisoned, and we eventually only see the faults of others.  To be free of this burden, he tells us, allows us to boldly ask our Savior for the release of our own sins. 
John would have us show no hesitancy and experience no doubt about what coming to God brings us. If we do not attend to this wound, what is born from it is slander. This, he tells us, drains the blood of love and becomes the patron of a heavy and unclean heart. In our anger, we may diminish another through our words, but the consequence that has for ourselves is far greater. It is a coarse disease that only Christ and gazing upon Christ crucified can heal.
---
Text of chat during the group: 
00:07:24 Anthony Rago: Tractor Supply, too
 
00:08:15 Anthony Rago: time for an exorcism of the air....
 
00:09:39 FrDavid Abernethy: page 126 para 13
 
00:12:43 Cindy Moran: Oooo...Yes!
 
00:22:53 Anthony Rago: Then this would apply also to wrongs WE have done, too, that filter our His healing?
 
00:27:03 sue and mark: I have found that if I am struggling in this area..that if I ask God to forgive them for me...  it is easier  also to bring me to that place of forgiveness that he desires
 
00:32:12 Anthony Rago: This is what I have a hard time understanding: sin, mortal and venial, which is emphasized so much in the admonishion if frequent confessions....so much emphasis on me, me, me.
 
00:35:42 Anthony Rago: How often is good?
 
00:39:56 Anthony Rago: Thank you
 
00:55:41 Rebecca Thérèse: I'm still puzzled as to the difference between spite and dark spite
 
00:57:43 Cindy Moran: Who is the author of the book you mentioned last week "Orthodox Psychotherapy"?
 
00:57:44 Ambrose Little, OP: Maybe something like.. If you harbor it secretly in the “darkness” of your inner self. You don’t allow it to be brought into the Light, examined for what it is, and see that it is wrong and needs to be eliminated.
 
00:57:59 carol: Dark definition includes “angry, threatening, arising from evil, sinister”
 
00:58:38 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you all
 
01:01:16 Ambrose Little, OP: “Speaking the truth in love” is one of the most abused phrases.
 
01:03:23 Anthony Rago: Chastity covers up, it is modest.  Unchastity is an unholy exposure.
 
01:11:29 Rachel: LOL
 
01:11:49 Anthony Rago: I think you're right.  More St. Francis is needed, less "vert few will be saved."
 
01:13:08 Lee Graham: The river of life flowing out of us
 
01:14:37 Rachel: ouch
 
01:15:45 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:15:47 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:15:56 Devansh Shukla: Thank you
 
01:15:57 Rachel: YES!!
 
01:16:08 Bernadette Truta: Yes please!
 
01:16:09 Art: Thank you good night.  Yes I’m interested in the Zoom group on fasting.
 
01:16:10 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:16:10 Ambrose Little, OP: Yes
 
01:16:12 Deb Dayton: Is this in person?
 
01:16:13 sue and mark: yes
 
01:16:16 Jacqulyn: Yes... I am interested!
 
01:16:19 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: when?
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXIII, Part IV

Reading the fathers deeply is unsettling. It strikes against every sensibility that we have and calls into question our perception of reality itself. In this sense, their writings are meant to illuminate the gospels for us and allow them to challenge us. So often we become lukewarm simply because things have become familiar and comfortable to us. We lose sight of the fact that in the face of Christ’s teaching individuals tore their garments and repeatedly wanted to put him to his death and eventually did accomplish this. 
What does reading the gospel or the fathers give rise to within our hearts and consciences? The stories about obedience in this hypothesis are startling; we can hardly imagine ourselves enduring such things for a moment, let alone seeing them as something that are a means to freeing us from self-will and from the ego. What is it that we love? What stirs our hearts to their greatest desire? What are we willing to die for? Is Christ our Beloved or merely the construction of our minds and imaginations to make us feel safe in this world?
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Text of chat during the group:
00:21:29 Paul Fifer: This paragraph sounds a lot like the Russian movie named “The Island”.
 
00:21:58 Anthony Rago: Reminds me of "Ostrov / Island" in which the foolish monk tends the coal furnace for 30 or so years
 
00:22:30 Charbel: A fantastic film, I get some folks together to watch it at the beginning of the Fast every year.
 
00:24:03 carol nypaver: Profound film!  I need to watch it again.
 
00:24:38 Ambrose Little, OP: Much like having small children. 🙂
 
00:25:52 Anthony Rago: Culturally, in Sicily, my family had livestock on the ground floor.  Same with Padre Pio's family.  Living quarters were upstairs.  Maybe the monk lived in a downstairs "barn" and the others lived on the floor(s) above.
 
00:27:54 Deb Dayton: Reacted to "Much like having sma..." with 😂
 
00:28:00 carol nypaver: Very interesting, Anthony.  Thank you for the insight.
 
00:39:16 Charbel: Apologies for ducking out. I'm taking an extra shift at the shelter and may have to step away from time to time as folks come into my office.
 
00:39:22 Joyce and Jim Walsh: Story of the Monk reminds me  of the indignities suffered by St. FAUSTINA as noted in her Diary.
 
00:51:40 Anthony Rago: But if we are in the image of God, I see a tension.  One the one hand, there is the parable of the unworthy servants doing only what is expected of you.  But on the other hand, you are made in the image of God, and I would thing, there is room for some sense of ego and satisfaction.  Not smugness, but joy and satisfaction.
 
00:53:52 iPhone: Amen Father
 
01:04:05 iPhone: Really Powerful Message.
 
01:13:14 Denise T. : This is probably really worldly of me, but if you allow someone to hurt you unjustly or lie about you or anything else that is deliberately inflicted by another without saying anything, will that be good for them. There seems a sense of justice is lost. Not saying anything. 
 
01:20:05 Denise T. : Thank  you, Father.
 
01:20:16 carol nypaver: Do those who inflict the “punishment” on us,  also become more saintly even if their intent is NOT that we become more patient, humble, etc.? Especially if they are not our “elders”? If we become holier for what we endure at their hands, do they also grow in holiness if we endure patiently?
 
01:21:27 Sharon: Thank you

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter IX: On Remembrance of Wrongs, Part I

There are certain moments while reading the fathers when one trembles. The truth expressed is so vivid and pierces so deeply that the experience of it is visceral. One is shaken.  This is not easy to endure, and perhaps there are moments when reading such texts becomes a stumbling block for our minds and our hearts. However, when they speak the truth of Christ and when they reveal the depth of love that we are called to in Him, ultimately these words are healing. The fathers, in so many ways, are spiritual physicians. Their words cut like a scalpel and cut deeply. But they cut out the “rot” as John describes it. The remembrance of wrongs, which is the offspring of anger, is not something that we can remove on our own. Untreated it spreads like a cancer. The fact, John tells us it has no offspring because it poisons the soul so completely that it makes us incapable of love. 
May God give us the grace to listen with humility and gratitude. We are given such loving fathers who desire nothing but our healing. When we begin to trust that, then their words become as bright and illuminating as the sun.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:03:54 FrDavid Abernethy: Page 125 Step number 9
 
00:20:29 Anthony: Another kind of remembering wrongs is to trod the path of bad example someone has set...examples, hearing cursing, and then carrying on that "tradition" instead of cutting it off; or doing violence because someone else did violence to you (a chain of abuse).
 
00:22:58 Eric Ewanco: My translation titles this section "On Malice" (with a translation note that also offers "remembrance of wrongs). Your translation refers to "hourly malice" (mine says "rancor by the hour"). Can you elaborate on the relationship between malice and remembrance of wrongs?
 
00:24:12 Ashley Kaschl: Could a victim mentality be tied to the “pleasureless feeling cherished in the sweetness of bitterness” part?
 
00:24:26 Bonnie Lewis: So I shouldn't be troubled that I can relate so deeply to this step?
 
00:27:16 iPhone: Whoa.  Amen Father
 
00:28:30 Anthony: Healing.  In Divine Comedy, Dante is washed in a river of forgetfulness when passing from Purgatory to Heaven, so he can forget all memory of sin.
 
00:31:35 iPhone: +1
 
00:48:05 iPhone: Love these Sessions Father !
 
00:48:53 Daniel Allen: The internet, for a million different reasons, is dangerous… not reading the fathers.
 
00:50:52 carol: How does one speak freely in the context of therapy or spiritual direction while also avoiding the remembrance of wrongs?
 
00:55:37 Charbel & Justin: Demons are fundamentally chaotic.
 
01:05:47 Anthony: Remember that the demons make suckers and schlubs out of all of us.  It makes it easier to have compassion on another.
 
01:07:09 iPhone: Amen
 
01:08:37 Bonnie Lewis: true
 
01:08:47 iPhone: Love that
 
01:10:37 iPhone: Much work to do in this regard.
 
01:12:17 Ashley Kaschl: This entire section reminds me of a quote by St. John of the Cross: “Whenever anything disagreeable happens to you, remember Christ crucified and be silent.”
 
01:12:25 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:12:26 Bonnie Lewis: This step is excellent Father.  Much to ponder.
 
01:12:43 Debra: Reacted to "This entire section ..." with ❤️
 
01:12:44 iPhone: Amen Father.  Tremendous !
 
01:13:39 Jeff O.: Amen, thank you Father. Great to be with you all.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXIII, Part III

The further we get into the Evergetinos, the more we are poised to begin to understand something important: our pursuit of virtue, such as obedience, is rooted first and foremost in our love and desire for God. We embrace the ascetical life, we embrace very difficult practices and and pursue virtue, not as a test of endurance. It is a response to a love and a desire deeply rooted within our hearts. The grace of God begins to allow us to comprehend that we are heirs of the kingdom, that we are sons and daughters of God. To pursue this path outside of this context is to make ourselves the most pitiable of all creatures. To embrace all, even the hatred of the world for the love of Christ is most beautiful and precious of things. 
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Text of chat during the group:
00:12:04 FrDavid Abernethy: page 290 paragraph 6
 
00:42:10 Anthony: Is this why there are numerous examples of the monastics in tears, but little about the sacrament of Confession?  Because they saw their hearts and were in a state of grief and contrition?
 
00:42:55 Lee Graham: “Love and do what you will.” Augustine (354-430). A sermon on love. St Aurelius Augustine Sermon on 1 John 4:4-12.
 
00:44:10 carol nypaver: I thought it was “Love God, then do as you please.” ?
 
00:59:19 Ambrose Little, OP: See #8 here for the St. Augustine quote in context: https://www.newadvent.org/fathers/170207.htm
 
01:01:19 Anthony: Then St. Francis of Assisi was a marble pillar - almost a Fool for Christ, but so joyful and at times profoundly mournful
 
01:03:11 Anthony: Did saints like Francis and Philp Neri have elders or were they directly inspired?
 
01:03:12 Ambrose Little, OP: You mean he didn’t publish a blog about how wrong the Holy Father was?? 😄
 
01:07:19 Anthony: Well in our time we were not brought up with the saints.  We were brought up with revolutionaries, with men who bent society to their will - with ambitious men, and THIS is virtue to us when we are young.
 
01:10:15 Ambrose Little, OP: Independence and Liberty are the chief American virtues.
 
01:15:52 Ambrose Little, OP: May you be saved!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VIII: On Freedom from Anger, Part III

As we follow Saint John’s teaching on the passion of anger, we truly begin to get a sense of what a great spiritual teacher and physician he and the other fathers are. St. John has the capacity to see the various ways that anger manifests itself in our lives, the subtlety of the demon’s trickery, and the danger of our own blindness to self-conceit. St. John makes it very clear to us that if we struggle with the passion of anger we must be willing to place ourselves in a situation where we are going to be able to diagnose it and bring it before another in order that a healing balm might be applied. The person who is in the grip of anger is going to bring agitation to all those around him. Therefore, a person must go where this passion might revealed by testing and overcome by trial. Austerity in life and firmness from one’s spiritual director or elder is often needed to break one free from the grip of this passion. However, John tells us, he who has won this battle by sweat has conquered all the passions that precede it. Let us then not be afraid to be mortified in regards to our self-esteem and pride; for they both collaborate to hold us captive.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:07:22 FrDavid Abernethy: page 122, paragraph 17
 
00:10:12 Bonnie Lewis: Hi Father David!
 
00:14:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 122 para 17
 
00:55:12 Ambrose Little, OP: “fuller’s shop”: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulling
 
01:03:43 Bonnie Lewis: we lost you
 
01:04:17 carol nypaver: Come back, Father!
 
01:04:28 Sheila Applegate: You are frozen for us all. :(
 
01:15:58 Rafael Patrignani: Thaís week I had to face w tough situation from my Chief, who received false accusations against me. The advice I had received from my spiritual director was to be ready to listen for understanding but not for having a reaction. I found this very coincidental with your speech Father David. That position was very useful in that meeting and for that kind of attack
 
01:16:10 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:11 Rafael Patrignani: * this
 
01:16:12 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:16:17 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:16:17 Rafael Patrignani: Thank you
 
01:16:23 Dev Shukla: Thank you
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VIII: On Freedom from Anger, Part II

What is our standard of judgment? When we consider anything about life in this world, or our struggle with vice, or seeking to grow in virtue, where do we look? So often we, even in our spiritual struggles, look to our own reason and judgment. The problem with this is that we only see partial truths, even when we see things clearly. We all have hard spots and blind spots in our perception of reality and of others. If anything, John’s writing on anger and meekness remind us that there must be a willingness as Christians to suspend our judgment and allow the grace of God to touch our minds and hearts; so that we can perceive the greater reality about the other person, even when they commit evil against us. The standard for us is Christ. The standard is the cross and cruciform love. It is when our minds and our hearts have been shaped by this Love, that we begin to be guided by the spirit of peace; and our minds are illuminated with the greater truth of the goodness of the other created in the image and likeness of God and redeemed by the blood of Christ.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:32:08 Deb Dayton: So many (me) hear to rebut, rather than listen for understanding
 
00:44:13 Jeff O.: So holy/righteous anger is anger directed at the true enemy - the “demons” - and anger towards another undermines their dignity as an imager of God>
 
00:48:14 Ambrose Little, OP: Might have more luck typing it in.
 
00:51:25 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: What about anger that motivates one to take action for justice for others?  Any room in the Fathers for this?  Or is that called something else in their terminology?
 
00:54:34 Daniel Allen: It is interesting because it seems like Christ acted by suffering with the suffering and without destroying the one causing the suffering
 
01:00:49 Daniel Allen: A hopeful reading for the Irish such as myself
 
01:03:24 carol nypaver: Can’t acting out a virtue (patience/silence) lead us to actually acquire that virtue?
 
01:06:05 Ambrose Little, OP: It seems like while anger can be a useful motivator to act, the more perfect motivation is love. If we see someone hurting and in need, the motivation of compassion and charity seems more than sufficient motive to act, even when the pain/need is caused by some injustice. And when love is our motive, we can then turn that same love towards even the offender, who may be in even greater need by their damaging of their relationship with God and others—they may be imperiling their eternal soul, in addition to whatever circumstances may have led to their unjust action. Contrast that to anger, which only tends to act in favor of the victim, while often seeking the suffering of the offender (or at best ignoring the offender’s need).
 
01:14:51 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:54 iPhone (2): Thank you!
 
01:15:01 Jeff O.: Thank you, great being with you all.
 
01:15:01 Art: Thank you!!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXIII, Part II

What does obedience allow us to hear? This may seem to be a funny question. In light of how we often characterize obedience or think about it in our own lives, so often it is about setting aside our own will and having to do what another tells us to do. But in light of the fathers’ writings, it becomes clear that obedience is not a kind of slavishness. The etymology of the word obedience is “to hear.”  It allows us to listen and to receive a Word from God that reveals divine truth. Obedience raises us up to comprehend the very love that has saved us. 
Of course, one must admit that it is jarring to our sensibilities and our reason. When we hear the stories of the monks’ obedience, we begin to see that it had to do more with their desire for God, their yearning to be conformed to Christ who emptied himself to take upon our humanity and become obedient even unto death. Our obedience leads us to hear that word spoken in our own heart, inviting us to draw close to Christ in every way. This means embracing a wisdom that is wholly unlike what is made manifest within the world and so often shaped by sin. The fathers are living icons of the gospel. What they write and what they do becomes a window revealing the path that we are to walk and that will draw us closer to Christ. 
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:14:43 Anthony: I believe there are different sizes and thicknesses for different strength dogs
 
00:15:05 Debra: Yes...I think you can get them rated for different breeds
 
00:15:09 Babington (or Babi): I have one too
 
00:27:03 Paul Fifer: How would one then differentiate between this zeal and scrupulosity?
 
00:28:12 Babington (or Babi): Hmmm. Perhaps I’m being ruled by flesh at the moment but I feel resistant to this as the Word of God. If I heard correctly the the teacher led the seeker of God to starve himself potentially very destructively in year two. I don’t see that as God’s love. But again perhaps I’m missing something as I’m distracted by cooking for my dogs.
 
00:36:09 Babington (or Babi): Oh wait. A second day? I thought he directed him to fast for a whole year, not day.
 
00:41:00 Babington (or Babi): I get that saturated trusting submission and have tasted it as seeker towards a teacher. 
 
But not a whole year of very unhealthy fasting. As you clarify, extremes aren’t the Way. But I’ll go back and listen to podcast. Perhaps I misunderstood him and you. So sorry if so. Much love and gratitude. 🙏🏼🤍
 
00:43:10 Babington (or Babi): Fasting is great. I thought you read a year not day. A year seems like starvation.
 
00:45:59 Anthony: I suggest the stick was a fig branch; It is not entirely unreasonable to have him do this.
 
00:46:32 Anthony: Figs take about 3 years to fruit and this is one way how you start them (I've done it).
 
01:09:39 Ashley Kaschl: We don’t often come upon stories, though I know there have been a few, of brothers who were stirred to anger or resentment in the keeping of their obedience. Is there a correlation between being purified of anger, and the lack of an interior movement that might convince someone that the authority figure is lording their commands over the one being called to obedience?
 
01:11:46 Ashley Kaschl: So our anger can point to us the areas in our life where we need to grow in virtue so that we can be perfectly obedient?
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VII: On Joy-Making Mourning, Part VII and Chapter VIII: On Freedom from Anger, Part I

Today someone mentioned to me that Saint John Climacus does not mince words when speaking about the spiritual life, and in particular when speaking about the passions. This is unequivocally true. John does not varnish the truth. His heart has been formed in such a way that it would be impossible to do so; his view of God, man, redemption, and sin is shaped by the cross, and by the fullness of the gospel. Such is the case in our reading this evening of Step 8. St. John begins to define for us the nature of freedom from anger and the virtue that leads us along that path: meekness. 
In this step like so many others, our view of reality and our experience as human beings is going to be challenged. Our experience of aggression in ourselves and from others must be seen now through what has been revealed to us in Christ and through the Cross. We must allow the grace of God to shape our identity so deeply that we remain unmoved either by dishonor or by praise. Meekness is allowing the love of God to touch our emotions and affective state as well as the incensive faculty that protects us from sin. 
The Scriptures teach us that “the anger of man does not bear fruit acceptable to God.”  The reason for this is that such anger is often driven by an insatiable desire that we be treated in a fashion that satisfies our vainglorious needs or our sense of justice. Anger, however, can become so deeply rooted within the soul that bitterness becomes the lens through which we view relationships, and circumstances of every kind. It can become the log in our eye that prevents us from seeing any goodness in the world or others. Let us, then, listen attentively to what John says and allow him to guide us along this challenging path.
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:03:22 FrDavid Abernethy: page 119, para 66
 
00:18:02 Maple(Hannah) Hong: What page?
 
00:19:24 Sean: Top of 120
 
00:20:06 Maple(Hannah) Hong: Thank you, Sean!
 
00:57:54 Jeff O.: Evagrius talks a lot about the blinding effect of anger on the intellect of the mind, blinding the seer and consequently how meekness allows us to see (know) God
 
00:58:11 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "Evagrius talks a lot..." with 👍🏻
 
00:58:40 carol nypaver: 👍🏼
 
01:02:24 Ashley Kaschl: Something that might help give a little guidance in regards to feeling the emotion of anger is something that Ven. Fulton Sheen said when he gives perspective on Wrath vs. Righteous Anger, in that he writes, 
 
“Be angry, and sin not”; for anger is no sin under three conditions: (1) If the cause of the anger be just, for example, defense of God’s honor; (2) If it be no greater than the cause demands, that is, if it be kept under control; and (3) If it be quickly subdued: "Let not the sun go down upon your anger.”
 
01:04:03 Ambrose Little, OP: “How can one take a fire to his bosom and not be burned?”
 
01:04:36 carol nypaver: Awesome, Ashley.  Can’t go wrong with Ven. Fulton Sheen!
 
01:08:22 Meghann (she/her) KS: is it like God's, Christ's expressions of anger are always intended toward repentance not punishment... opportunities of wakening not retributive...?  Always pathways toward salvation, not "justice" or closure?  Ours tend to be mixed and partial expressions
 
01:14:07 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:14:54 kevin: Thanks father
 
01:14:55 Jeff O.: Thank you, great being with you all.
 
01:15:05 Art: Thank you father!
 
01:15:11 Mitchell Hunt: Thanks father David
 
01:15:12 Larisa and Tim: Thank you!
 
01:15:13 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:15:17 Babington (or Babi): Thank you
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXII, Part IV and Hypothesis XXXIII, Part I

To have Christ praying within us, to have Christ fasting within us, to have Christ suffering within us. We hear from the fathers that the ascetical life is meant to draw us into deeper communion with the Lord. The ascetic life must begin and end with Him. If not, it will bear no fruit. Only when our spiritual life is elevated by the grace of God does it become pleasing in God’s sight. Even our virtues must be perfected by His grace. We may have spent many years in silence and prayer and the pursuit of virtue. Then God in his providence may lead us along another path in order that he might fulfill the deepest desires of our heart as well as to bring us to salvation and the perfection of virtue. 
We can have no conceit in this regard. Only God sees the nature and the depth of our desire and love. We must follow Him and allow Him to guide us through those He puts in charge of us or those He makes responsible for us. At times, it is only when we are pushed beyond the limits of human strength that we begin to see the power and the action of God’s grace. 
Again we can have no illusions about our own desire. As strong as it might be, and even if it does come from God, our weakness and poverty can only be overcome through His mercy and by His wisdom. We must allow Him to draw us more and more deeply into the Paschal Mystery. We must allow our hearts to be shaped by Divine and self-emptying love.
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:09:01 FrDavid Abernethy: page 279 J
 
00:51:54 Anthony: for Sunday of the Syrophoenecian woman, Father told us God tests all of us to have the faith to persevere to the end.
 
01:19:23 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VII: On Joy-Making Mourning, Part VI

What does it mean to live in Christ and for Him? Perhaps this is a question that we rarely ask ourselves because it’s too threatening. What would our lives look like if our response to God was absolute? What would our mourning for sin look like if our love for God was filled with desire for Him and for His will? 
One would imagine that life, our lives would look much different. It is not just one part of ourselves that is to be touched by the grace of God, but every aspect of our being, our very essence. Saint John and the other Desert fathers speak of mourning for one’s sin in such a visceral fashion because they understood that they were called to participate in a Godly love. God took our flesh upon Himself in order that we might come to experience the fullness of His life and love. To experience themselves as turning away from this gift or betraying this love could only bring about the deepest mourning and their hearts. The question that we perhaps should be asking ourselves is: “why do we lack this quality of mourning?”
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Text of chat during the group:
00:24:51 Charbel & Justin: What page?
 
00:25:00 Bridget McGinley: 118
 
00:36:55 Anthony: This is interesting since I can't be the only one who wants to understand _before_ practicing; who wants to know before and judge whether something is worth perseverance.
 
01:05:59 Anthony: From my college Greek class, there is another connotation: "eleison" comes from the root "luo", "to loosen."
 
01:22:24 Ambrose Little, OP: It didn’t quite strike me this way before these meditations we are studying, but St. Paul seems to have been expressing this kind of mourning when he wrote about his inability to do the good he wants to do (in his inner self that loves the law of God) but instead does the evil at hand (in his flesh which is at war with himself): “Miserable one that I am! Who will deliver me from this mortal body?” But also immediately he proceeds to gratitude for victory through grace: “Thanks be to God through Jesus Christ our Lord.” The same also leads him to “glory in [his] weakness.”
 
01:25:47 Ambrose Little, OP: (The above was from NABre 🤷🏻‍♂️ 🙂 )
 
01:26:05 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:26:57 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:27:08 kevin: Thank you
 
01:27:19 Cindy Moran: thank you
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXII, Part III

The times reading The Evergetinos I find my mind and heart swimming not in darkness but rather in a light with which I am unfamiliar. For in reading the fathers, everything seems to be turned on its head. The writings are often jarring, but in a similar way to that of the Gospel.  To read deeply is to find one’s heart inflamed. To listen closely is to find something stirred within us that perhaps was once lifeless. The words can be so piercing that they reveal parts of ourselves that we were unaware of or did not know existed. This is what we were shown tonight; and this is what makes every moment of reflecting upon the fathers worth it.
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:29:34 Mark Kelly: Fr. David is speaking of Fr. Lazarus el Antony.
 
00:31:23 Mark Kelly: Fr. Lazarus vide:  https://vimeo.com/9794946
 
00:35:54 Anthony: This section by Isaac is jarring because it appears to conflict w\ith duty to family and community; and it conflicts with the Christian culture ideal which Europeans at least remember from the Middle Ages.  Pope Benedict's catecheses on the saints which built Christendom would be very different if he came from a culture that was dominated by, say, Islam.
 
00:41:01 Bridget McGinley: I am from Philly...… he ended pretty disgraced. I think the Princehood got to his head. That is a big crown to wear. I agree it is contrary to religious life.
 
00:43:13 Anthony: In my opinion, I believe I see this "worldiness" emerge in Europe after the rocky path the Germanic tribes had in full conversion to the Faith.  The Romano-Greeks in the East had similar problems manifested in another way - hence the unflattering term "byzantine".  Each culture needs to fully convert and not flatter themselves.
 
00:43:55 Babington (or Babi): I think it was Saint Therese who wrote “Everything I have and am everything I am is pure gift.”
 
00:44:17 Babington (or Babi): Oops miswrote
 
00:44:35 Babington (or Babi): Everything I have and everything I am is pure gift.
 
00:45:56 iPhone: Principalities ?
 
00:52:17 Mark Kelly: One of the better-known sayings of the desert fathers is,” There are two things to avoid, an easy life and vain glory.”
 
00:53:18 iPhone: principalities and powers
 
00:57:17 Anthony: Monk is from monos = single
 
00:57:24 Anthony: single minded, so I have heard
 
01:13:17 iPhone: Really Excellent !
 
01:15:19 iPhone: Whoa.  Amen
 
01:18:01 Ambrose Little, OP: Reminds me of the style of parables. First of the unfaithful servants. Then like the inverse of the parable of the lost sheep. But in this case, it’s the celebration of Satan and all of Hell when just one “sheep” is lost.
 
01:20:52 Bridget McGinley: Thank you Father!
 
01:20:59 Babington (or Babi): Good stuff.  Thank you Father. God bless you all. 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VII: On Joy-Making Mourning, Part V

Our journey with Saint John Climacus has not been an easy one; in fact, we get a taste of walking upon that narrow path that leads to the kingdom simply through reading about his vision of the spiritual life and his experience. It reflects the reality and the challenges of the spiritual life, and in particular a life of penance and repentance. To give ourselves over to God, to seek his love above all things, to desire him more than we desire our own lives is the path that St. John is putting before us. 
However, there is something within us that resists walking this path. Quite simply it is our ego - the self. Even in our pursuit of God, we can make ourselves every bit as willful in our spiritual discipline as we are in our relationships with others, and in our day-to-day work. Through his description of compunction (sorrow over one’s sins eventually leading to the experience of Godly Joy) St John is seeking to free us from the grip self-centeredness and its delusions.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:09:51 FrDavid Abernethy: page 166 para 49
 
00:09:56 Kate Truta: Hello!  We are new to the group.  We live in Colorado.
 
00:10:13 FrDavid Abernethy: page 116
 
00:10:20 Eric Ewanco: Welcome, Kate!
 
00:10:41 Kate Truta: Thank you!  Good to be here!
 
00:19:40 Deb Dayton: Some I send to bring Father s lot of joy!
 
00:19:49 Deb Dayton: *Duke
 
00:21:20 Anthony: It's as if these accusations are like a kind of hell
 
00:24:59 Eric Ewanco: … or, purgatory
 
00:25:01 Kathy Locher: Can someone tell me what page we're on?
 
00:27:21 Bridget McGinley: 117 number 51
 
00:27:43 Kathy Locher: thanks!
 
00:29:40 Anthony: How does one distinguish the right "amount" of compunction versus a demonic despondency due to slander?
 
00:29:48 Cindy Moran: Flippant
 
00:30:14 Eric Ewanco: 👍🏻
 
00:31:08 Rebecca Thérèse: I'd heard previously that demonic knowledge is incomplete. Is that true and if so what does it mean?
 
00:41:49 Rachel: It seems like he means something even deeper than not distracting oneself from pain of heart or just as you are alluding to, he is taking it even further. Some songs can console and/or enhance one's sorrow that comes from a passionate nature or natural temperament. When the morning is composed, hidden and is allowed to go deep within by waiting on Our Lord, not escaping into a sorrow that consoles but waves of that abyss wash over one..
 
00:42:18 Rachel: Mourning'
 
00:43:08 Rachel: lol me!
 
00:44:13 Rachel: Sorry, didnt complete that because St. John is describing it..
 
00:48:35 Rachel: Father, can you think of a Saint whose life really manifests this gift St. John is speaking about? I am sure all of the Saints in some degree experience this but I mean whereit was clearly manifest. Would St. Theresa and St. Therese be examples of this joy?
 
00:51:55 Vicki Nichols: St. John Neumann manifests this gift, particularly when he was a  young man.
 
00:52:10 Anthony: So then this fear is not necessarily "wrong" and self-focused, it is not merely an assault of the enemy but it is a permitted stage of repentance?  Is it like what we call attrition that leads to contrition?
 
00:54:40 Vicki Nichols: iwas responding to the person before
 
00:54:44 Vicki Nichols: yes
00:56:17 Ambrose Little, OP: St. Dominic was said to often weep while keeping vigil. And he was also known to be supernaturally joyful.
 
01:00:00 Anthony: Another deep poet on these themes is St. Gregory of Narek, Doctor of the Church.
 
01:06:39 Cindy Moran: How does this apply to the Jesus Prayer?
 
01:08:49 Anthony: Is "constant receptivity" you often mention, or overthinking, evidence of the faculty of contemplation, but it is turned to an unworthy and self-destructive subject?
 
01:14:42 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:14:46 Rachel: haha
 
01:14:52 Cindy Moran: 😊
 
01:15:29 Bridget McGinley: Thank you
 
01:15:35 Anthony: Thank you!
 
01:15:38 Ashley Kaschl: Thank you, Father!
 
01:15:39 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:15:44 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 
01:15:52 Rebecca Thérèse: Happy New Year🙂
 
01:15:57 Riccardo Orlandi: God bless
01:16:01 Riccardo Orlandi: thank!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXII, Part II

We continued our reading of hypothesis 32 and once again the words of the Fathers are piercing, very much like the words of scripture. This is what makes them ring so true. The Fathers never seek to varnish the truth. The path that we are called to walk upon is the path of Christ. We are called quite literally self-crucifixion. We are to die to self and sin, and to live for God and to live for Him alone. St Paul reminders us: “it is no longer I who lives I (ego) but Christ who lives within me. 
It is for this reason that monasteries would put men to the test, making them wait long periods of time before entering. Why do you want to be here? Do you understand what it is that you were taking upon yourself and what you are setting aside?  Do any of us understand what it is to love in the way that we have been shown on the Cross and in the Holy Eucharist?
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Text of chat during the group:
00:18:35 Debra: HAPPY NEW YEAR EVERYONE!!
 
00:19:35 Debra: Wow! I didn't realize you have listeners from ALL over the World!!
 
00:19:58 Ambrose Little, OP: Angela, always nice to have bright sunshine in these meetings. Especially this time of year. 🙂
 
00:39:28 Anthony: The Rule of St. Basil is pretty stern, too. It surprised me.
 
00:44:12 Mitch: The Fathers are harsh but it’s refreshing in a watered down, “everything is good enough” society
 
00:53:52 Anthony: Perhaps this is an example of the heresy of Americanism affecting the Church's attitude to priesthood as a profession.
 
01:00:10 Paul Fifer: FYI… Here is a link to a pdf for the book Father mentioned “The Struggle with God”… https://jbburnett.com/resources/evdokimov_strugglewGod1966.pdf
 
01:16:46 Anthony: Don't we vow perfection in baptismal vow?
 
01:18:02 Bridget McGinley: I was thinking the same thing Anthony. THis was the early Christians way of life married or lay
 
01:20:58 Anthony: IS this why the demons even suggest blasphemous thoughts - to make us see our beautiful God as ugly? Or to drive us away from trying to contemplate God?
 
01:23:49 Bridget McGinley: Thank you. Goodnight.
 
01:24:06 Anthony: Thanks :)
 
01:24:09 Ashley Kaschl: Thanks be to God. Thank you, Father!
 
01:24:09 Mitch: thankyou
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VII: On Joy-Making Mourning, Part IV

We continued our discussion of “joy making mourning” from the Ladder of Divine Ascent. It is like seeing an image slowly come to a state of clarity. There is something so difficult and stinging to our sensibilities when reading this text that it is hard to allow that to happen. But this evening we began to get glimpses of the beauty that St. John is trying to place before our eyes. He wants us to see that tears came into this world as a result of sin. God has given them in order that He might cleanse and purify the heart, and that our sorrow might give way to joy and laughter. God does not ask or desire that we should mourn from sorrow of heart, but rather that out of love for Him we should rejoice with spiritual laughter. God wants to heal us and bring us to the place where sin will be abolished and pain, sorrow and sighing, will have fled away.
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:15:03 FrDavid Abernethy: page 114 no 28
 
00:17:58 Ashley Kaschl: I’d say hi but my mic is being weird 😂
 
00:18:08 Ashley Kaschl: 😂😂
 
00:20:33 Rebecca Thérèse: Sorry I'm late, connectivity issues
 
00:31:53 Ren Witter: I am finding this just so hard. If there is a hurt or injustice, that at times brings up intense feelings of resentment, is that going to be a constant impediment to union with God for as long as the hurt lasts? I guess it just makes me feel a bit hopeless
 
00:40:21 Ambrose Little, OP: Interesting aside: I saw a scientific experiment recently that showed tears have different chemical compositions based on the circumstances causing them.
 
00:40:48 Ren Witter: Yes! I love that study
 
00:40:48 Bridget McGinley: Ambrose that is fascinating!
 
00:41:41 Ren Witter: And not only that, but they contain a natural pain relieving component particular to the cause. Its really amazing.
 
01:19:46 Ashley Kaschl: Do you think the grace that leads to compunction is stopped by a division in one’s heart? Like we can want to be truly contrite for sins but also have a hidden attachment to sin which allows for a tension to present itself, but maybe we think about it as frustration or failure? When in reality, it’s a matter of God’s timing?
 
01:22:43 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:22:52 Bridget McGinley: Goodnight thank you
 
01:23:32 Babington (or Babi): Thank you!
 
01:23:39 Ashley Kaschl: Thank you, Father! Good to see you!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXI, Part II and XXXII, Part I

Tonight, in Hypothesis 32we are, one might say, confronted with the deepest challenge. It is not unlike the challenge of Christ in the gospel. What is in our hearts shapes who we are as human beings. The externals of religion may be maintained perfectly, and give the appearance of religiosity and holiness. But in reality, our hearts may be very far from God and seeking to do His will. Our hearts may not have the purity of Christ, or what comes about by the action of His grace within us. Such a life not only diminishes monasticism as a whole, but we can easily see how this is true of Christianity and of Christians. if we call ourselves Christians and we receive all that we are given through the Church and by Christ and yet our hearts do not seek him or his will, then we are scandal and a stumbling block. A monk may be tonsured and wear the external garb, but what does this mean in reality? Would he not be the most pitiful of individuals to leave everything in the world externally, but in his heart to cling to these things?
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Text of chat during the group:
01:01:14 Anthony: The thorns of the world (praise, false glory, a desire for sophistication) choke out the good seeds that. sprouted.
 
01:08:26 Anthony: Part of the issue:  show "me" a sacrifice that is worthwhile, and "I" can do it.  We need to find a worthy sacrifice.
 
01:13:44 Anthony: And in that case, each of us can "intuit" (?) by grace what is the particular sacrifice or charism we are called?
 
01:13:59 Anthony: such as Francis' life being different than Basil's charism.
 
01:14:46 Ren Witter: Wow
 
01:16:14 Anthony: Thanks.  I like the Our Lady of Constantinole(?) in the background.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VII: On Joy-Making Mourning, Part III

Even in the act of mourning the loss of a loved one, our thoughts can return very quickly to the things of this world. The reality of death is something that we rarely linger long with in our thoughts and imagination even when it draws close to us. 
Yet, in the writings of the fathers, it is precisely the urgency that the awareness of the brevity of our life places upon us that is so important. We must not neglect the fact that our life in this world is very short. 
What is it that we spend our time on? What is the focus of our energy? Do we desire God and what He alone can fill within the human heart or are we constantly seeking the things of this world? 
St. John’s writing on mourning over one’s sin is a stark reminder of who we are as human beings. We have almost an infinite capacity for self-delusion and self-deception. Even the shedding of tears can be filled with self-esteem or concern with self image more than with the sorrow over the diminishment of the relationship of love with God. Do we really love virtue and hate sin? Is there an urgent longing for God that leads to zeal in the spiritual life and prayer or do we easily slide into sloth and negligence? Do we distract ourselves with intellectual discussions about the faith and yet never practice the mourning of which St. John speaks?
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Text of chat during the group:
00:12:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 122
 
00:18:23 Debra: Just walked in from shoveling snow!
 
00:18:43 FrDavid Abernethy: page 122
 
00:18:45 FrDavid Abernethy: 112
 
00:21:01 Rebecca Thérèse: jailors
 
00:21:23 Rebecca Thérèse: It's the British spelling
 
00:27:04 Anthony: There is the kind little dog mentioned in Book of Tobit! :)
 
00:28:05 Anthony: The theives break in to steal, but the watchdog of concentration scares them away - maybe?
 
00:34:25 Daniel Allen: That makes me think of the wise and foolish virgins. The foolish virgins were told to buy more oil, and they wept outside of the wedding banquet. Is John playing off of that at all, suggesting we must mourn - and so acquire more oil - before we can enter the wedding feast as the wise virgins?
 
00:39:38 Anthony: Father, is there a "psychological" element to help us govern these thoughts?  Because, meditating on all the evil one has done - veen the littlest bit and the evil one can do can make one go almost mad.
 
00:49:02 carol nypaver: Amen!
 
00:53:47 Anthony: Like the Apostles in the Garden of Gethsemane
 
00:54:04 Debra: That #21 could be on a bookmark for my Breviary
 
00:58:49 Debra: I think Ven Fulton Sheen said, in response to 'The Mass is so long', 'It's because your love is short'
 
01:10:54 Anthony: adulteration?
 
01:10:56 Anthony: alloy?
 
01:16:48 Anthony: And THAT's how Nephilim could be made....
 
01:22:46 Jeffrey Ott: Amen, thank you!
 
01:22:51 Anthony: Thank you :)
 
01:22:52 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:22:55 Rachel: Thank you
 
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XXXI, Part I

How do we view our life in this world? Such a simple and straightforward question, and yet one that we contort ourselves so as not to have to answer directly.  It can be a frightening question to answer. Who am I? Who is God? What does this mean for my life in this world? 
The fathers do not present us with a path that allows us to put on airs. The Christian life, or the monastic life in particular, is not about creating a self image that is pleasing to us, or that gives us a sense of identity that we are comfortable with or that fits in neatly with our perception of reality. What the fathers present us with is an unvarnished view of the gospel, the incarnation and the cross. God entered into our world, took our flesh upon himself, lifted us out of our passions, and then ascended the cross. God did all of these things, not in order that we might receive them in a passive fashion, but that we might enter into that reality to the fullest extent. The Paschal Mystery is the Reality in which we are called to live. The ascetic life is meant to free us in such a fashion that we hold nothing back from God, that we die to self and sin, and so become willing to pour ourselves out in selfless love for God and others.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:15:24 Fr. Miron Jr.: nope...not allowed
 
00:15:46 Cindy Moran: Allegheny County Airport West Mifflin
 
00:34:26 Bridget McGinley: Juan Diego was 57 with no children when Our Lady appeared to him. He was not a religious just a beautiful soul doing his simple duty.... a very humble example for me.
 
00:38:43 Anthony: This paragraph reminds me of "Luther and Lutherdom" by Fr. Denifle.  Luther took concepts like this way our of context, and with the current of depravity among religious in the late middle ages, great harm came to the Church.
 
00:48:00 Ren Witter: What a perfect reading immediately following the Sunday of the Holy Forefathers!
 
00:48:32 Anthony: St. Vincent de Paul went from galley slave to a priest preaching and living the mercy of God.
 
00:57:48 carol: Like a wedding ring
 
01:01:42 Bridget McGinley: POWERFUL BOOK! Love it. Our Lady of Silence icon is beautiful!
 
01:02:25 Anthony: Father, it seems there is a contradiction between these paragraphs of waiting on the Lord and the (presumably bad) example of Ioannikos' mother in section B, who was content to labor with the other women but not formally take the yoke of a nun.  It looks like maybe people should have left her alone.  Am I wrong here?
 
01:03:36 Ashley Kaschl: I was learning about Biblical Botany on Saturday from a friend and this reminds me of the study of why the fig leaf is so important in the fall of Adam and Eve. The fig leaf excretes something that is very irritating to human skin. So, in their haste to remedy their shame, and to hide what they’d done, to solve their own problem, they actually made it worse and caused themselves pain. And this God gave them animal skins to wear.
 
01:06:34 Anthony: sorry...Alypios' mother
 
01:08:31 Ashley Kaschl: I had also not heard this before 😂😂
 
01:12:17 Ashley Kaschl: Sorry I have to run. Gotta get to Mass 🙏 thanks for tonight, Father!
 
01:16:22 Bridget McGinley: Thank you Father
 
01:16:47 Babington (or Babi): Thnx!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter VII: On Joy-Making Mourning, Part II

The more deeply one reads the fathers, the more one begins to see that what is being revealed is the terrain of the human heart. The fathers do not present us with a varnished truth about ourselves or our sin. The path that leads to freedom and holiness is Christ alone. It is by his grace and mercy that we are brought healing and hope. So much of the spiritual life involves letting go of the illusions that we cling to about ourselves and life in this world. It involves slowly breaking down those defenses that, while fulfilling their purpose, are too costly.  They prevent us from seeking healing where it can truly be found. We are called to more than just cope with reality. We are called to enter into He who is Reality and allow Him to heal us and transfigure us by His grace.  This brings us to a state of deep mourning. We gaze into the abyss, the hell that is sin. Yet while painful, St John begins to explain, it gives place to incorruptible chastity and the warmth of the “immaterial Light that radiates more than fire!”
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:16:42 CMoran: My family in Slovakia make it...you can run your lawnmower on their stuff.
 
00:25:56 Anthony: Father, would you please distinguish these tears from the tears of sin born of scrupulous fear?
 
00:30:50 Eric Ewanco: www.scrupulousanonymous.org
 
00:31:44 Anthony: Thank you, Father, that is a good way to distinguish the two fears.
 
00:33:47 CMoran: Would St Philip Neri be a good example of this?
 
00:36:15 Bridget McGinley: I heard that Solzhenitsyn in The Gulag Archipelago stated that those with a sense of humor had a greater constitution to bear the trials. I have not read this book but it struck me because I have read Fr. Walter Ciszek with God in Russia and I cannot imagine the sorrows.
 
00:40:16 Anthony: I guess St. Francis had this blessed, gladdening sorrow.  His fear or sorrow alternated with bliss, but although he was lighthearted, he was solid in God's reality.
 
00:43:41 Daniel Allen: Maybe it’s how it’s worded but how does fear of an “uncompassionate and inexorable judge” give way to love for that same uncompassionate judge?
 
00:45:22 carol: “Sadness purifies us. Man is truly man in sadness. In joy he is changed, he becomes someone else. In sadness he becomes that which he truly is. And this is the way, par excellence, that he approaches God…” Elder Epiphanios
 
00:50:28 Rachel: St Silouan
 
00:51:20 Rachel: This is what Christ told him when he had fallen into pride and was allowed to see his state.
 
00:54:51 Anthony: When I started finding catechetical materials to take in, I came across a popular internet Orthodox radio station.  One of the things they seemed to emphasize is that it is wrong to meditate on the passion of Christ - which is quite sad as well as triumphant.  It looks like that is incorrect and not the true way to orient our minds, but we should meditate on this?
 
00:59:35 Rebecca Thérèse: I find the poem Pastorcico (the little shepherd) by St John of the Cross very helpful in meditating on the Passion because it emphasises Christ's love in giving himself on the Cross for us. So to meditate on the Passion is to meditate on the great love of Christ for us.
 
01:01:33 Ambrose Little, OP: Perhaps there is something in this related to the notion of the love of the Law, that it is through the Law (and its judgment, as so, the Judge) that we see what is evil, truly repugnant to Life and Love (that is, the nature of God). And seeing that stark God-repelling reality allows us to more clearly see, by contrast, the Goodness and Love of God, and to desire Him all the more because of that seeing. The fear of God is the fear of sin and its consequences—the beginning of wisdom. Seeing what God hates and judges harshly against reveals to us the love of God, because He hates what harms us, what pulls us away from Him.
01:12:21 Daniel Allen: This makes sense. If you plead guilty you will skip past trying to prove your innocence and simply ask for mercy from the judge. But if you are busy trying to put up a defense you have no time to simply beg for mercy.
 
01:16:26 Henry Peresie: That happens often in Facebook.
 
01:22:48 CMoran: Thank you Father...great session!
 
01:22:54 Jeffrey Ott: Amen, thank you!
 
01:22:56 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:23:01 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:23:06 kevin: thank you
 
01:23:08 Deiren Masterson: God bless you Father - you are a gift.