Philokalia Ministries

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XXIII, Part II and XXIV, Part I

Tonight we read the final sections on the fathers’ reflection on the practice of fasting. Once again the focus is on decorum; how does one eat in the presence of others while not giving himself over to pride. It is ever so easy to think oneself the great ascetic and hold oneself above others within the community. Ego can even distort well-practiced discipline into something that sets oneself apart from others rather than leads one to show greater desire for God, virtue and mercy towards others. 
All of our practices, the fathers teach us, must be guided by spirit of gratitude. We give thanks for the food that we receive and that nourishes us and we avoid criticizing others for how much they eat. Self discipline is not a weapon to be wielded by the ego for its own pleasure. Our tendency is to devour our brothers’ flesh by our criticism, and as the psalmist tells us to “eat up God’s people as if eating our bread.”
A humble attitude must be fostered, and we must not be ill-mannered. For example, a senior monk within a monastery must not demand honor or reverence or put on airs before his juniors. He must not draw attention to Himself in any way that would diminish charity among the brothers. What is the value of toiling all day only to undermine oneself to satisfy petty pride?
Again, the fathers want us to understand that fasting and all of our disciplines are about love. We must not diminish the practice by becoming legalistic or moralistic in our view. Therefore, we are taught not to takes oaths about avoiding certain foods. In doing so we set aside the freedom that is ours. No food is reprehensible. We are merely to eat with restraint and gratitude. But if we take an oath and then break it by eating the particular food we fall into perjury. As Christ tells us, no food is unclean; rather it is what comes out of the heart that makes a person unclean or sinful.
A rather lengthy discussion ensued in regards to avoiding a kind of ghetto mentality in our Christian practice; setting ourselves apart from others rather than serving them in the love of Christ. It is a narrow line that we walk and demands that we understand that all is grace. Christ has taken on our poverty and emptied himself in order that we might know the fullness of life and love. Our exercise of the faith, that is, our asceticism, must be relational; it must be directed toward Christ and enable us to love as He loves. Asceticism is not an end in itself, nor do we live out our Christianity in isolation. We turn to Christ, we die to sin and self, in order to be raised to life in him. To avoid the kind of isolationism that we would see in the scribes and Pharisees, we must become Christ.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:09:37 Cindy Moran: The joys of home ownership 😜
 
00:11:29 Una: I'm a happy renter
 
00:12:37 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 168, #F
 
00:35:02 Erick Chastain: Once you pop you can't stop- pringles
 
00:35:21 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Once you pop you can..." with 😮
 
00:36:46 Adam Paige: Two recommendations on fasting and feasting.. Benedictine monk Adalbert de Vogue's book To Love Fasting is back in print in English (https://a.co/d/3hSwoIX), and I recently watched the film Babette's Feast for the first time - very moving !
 
00:38:09 Myles Davidson: A free PDF of To Love Fasting is available here:
https://archive.org/details/tolovefasting
 
00:40:39 Adam Paige: Reacted to "A free PDF of To Lov..." with ❤️‍🔥
 
00:46:33 Francisco Ingham: There’s a great Chesterton quote related to this point
 
00:46:43 Francisco Ingham: “Let us put a complex entrée into a simple old gentleman; let us not put a simple entrée into a complex old gentleman. So long as human society will leave my spiritual inside alone, I will allow it, with a comparative submission, to work its wild will with my physical interior. I will submit to cigars. I will meekly embrace a bottle of Burgundy. I will humble myself to a hansom cab. If only by this means I may preserve to myself the virginity of the spirit, which enjoys with astonishment and fear.”
 
00:54:11 Adam Paige: Reacted to "“Let us put a comple..." with 🍷
 
00:55:51 Ambrose Little: Can you comment on the seeming contradiction between Christ’s example of eating and drinking with sinners (and generally chastising Pharisees for being puritanical), and the counsel to avoid such and only surround oneself with those we deem holy and who think like we do.
 
01:05:17 Ambrose Little: It seems like there is real danger (that has actually been realized) in thinking and acting as if the church is only for the already perfect. But as Pope Francis has emphasized, the church is supposed to be a hospital for sinners. I just think the advice to avoid sinners and those who are not seeking God as we imagine we are can easily be internalized as exclusivity, isolationism,  and judgmentalism. It requires humility as a primary principle, to realize we are sinners, too.
 
01:14:29 Ambrose Little: Amen. Thank you!
 
01:14:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:54 santiagobua: Thank you !
 
01:15:36 ANDREW ADAMS: Thank you, Father!
 
01:15:47 Francisco Ingham: Thank you Father
 
01:15:52 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father
 
01:15:59 Erick Chastain: Thank you father!
 
01:16:05 Una: Thank you
 
01:16:08 santiagobua: Where can we find the Substack?
 
01:16:10 SYu’s iPhone: Thank you, Father.
 
01:16:43 ANDREW ADAMS: Replying to "Where can we find th..."
 
https://substack.com/@frcharbelabernethy
 
01:16:46 Myles Davidson: https://substack.com/@frcharbelabernethy
 
01:16:50 Adam Paige: Reacted to "https://substack.com..." with 👍
 
01:17:10 santiagobua: Reacted to "https://substack.com..." with 👍
 
01:17:17 Ambrose Little: Reacted to "https://substack.com…" with 👍
 
01:17:18 Erick Chastain: Just woke up earlier
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIX, and XXX, Part I

We are brought to the denouement of the Ladder in these final steps on Dispassion and the “Trinity of Virtues” - Faith, Hope and Love. The words of St. John ring forth as if from the mouth of a poet. It is only one who has experience of and has seen the beauty of Divine love who can then speak of the urgent longing that begins to take over the soul when it no longer is held back by the weight of sin or one’s ego.
The dispassionate man, St. John tells us, no longer lives himself, but Christ lives in him. He has eyes only for the beloved and living in constant union with him.  All becomes Grace; Christ’s virtue becomes our virtue, Christ’s strength becomes our strength, Christ’s love becomes our love. 
Understanding this we must not allow anything to hold us back. Above all we should desire to enter into the bridal chamber; for this is exactly what Christ has made possible for us. Our relationship with God is often described with nuptial imagery; we are destined to become one with the most holy Trinity. What excuse could we possibly put forward for not at least seeking to break through the wall of our sin by embracing the forgiveness that is so freely offered?
St. John’s discussion of dispassion leads us to the final step of the Ladder. The theological virtues, named so because they have God as their end, become St. John’s subject matter. These three are preeminent because they endure unto eternity. The greatest of them, love, allows no respite for the soul but drives her on with a kind of blessed madness. Overcome with an urgent longing for the Beloved it takes on a greater resemblance to God in so far as this is possible. The soul becomes inebriated - so often does it seek to satisfy its thirst for divine love. Having satisfied this desire the heart expands, taking on  distinctive properties where it becomes a fountain of faith, an abyss of patience and a sea of humility. What takes place then is extraordinary: love banishes every thought of evil or judgment. Only mercy, forgiveness and compassion remain.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:13:44 Myles Davidson: According to Wikipedia Scorcese is doing one on Moses the Black
 
00:14:08 Myles Davidson: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Scorsese_Presents:_The_Saints
 
00:18:40 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 243, #13
 
00:37:15 Anthony: Renzo Allegri write a book: "Padre Pio Man of Hope." Good book.
 
00:39:32 Anthony: And this is why legalism and scrupulousity is such a problem. They strangle wonder and longing.
 
00:41:29 Anthony: Franciscans are  like the east
 
00:56:20 Anthony: Eastern Star
 
00:56:26 Leilani Nemeroff: Eastern Star
 
00:57:29 David: A book that really lead me to the fathers and from mere belief to faith was "What Difference Does Jesus Make"- Frank Sheed. Really hard to find not sure why this is not more popular.
 
00:59:25 carol_000: What time zone did this meeting start at 7:30
 
00:59:34 Nypaver Clan: EST
 
00:59:34 David: EST
 
00:59:48 carol_000: Thanks
 
01:00:09 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Thanks" with 🥰
 
01:01:21 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: The kingdom must be preached/shared -  we are way too silent about sharing our faith...
 
01:02:42 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Guardini has a great book on prayer..
 
01:02:49 Jeff O.: Reacted to "Guardini has a great..." with 👍
 
01:04:42 carol_000: Calgary, Alberta Canada.  Mountain Standard Time. My first time here.
 
01:05:07 Nypaver Clan: Meditations Before Mass - Guardini
 
01:05:07 Myles Davidson: Welcome 🙂
 
01:06:19 carol_000: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Thanks.
 
01:07:33 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Hooray!  Glad you found us! 🙏🏼
 
01:07:36 Jeff O.: The madness of pride as opposed to the madness of love is an interesting juxtaposition. Two very distinct and different “pictures” of madness.
 
01:09:10 Cindy Moran: Reacted to The madness of pride... with "👍"
 
01:09:48 Cindy Moran: Me, too!!
 
01:09:53 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Welcome, Canada!🇨🇦
 
01:10:06 carol_000: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
I've been following Fr. Charbel for a while, but now I'm wondering which branch of Orthodoxy is this? Reference to author & "Mass" ?
 
01:10:59 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Byzantine
01:11:09 carol_000: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Thanks
 
01:12:54 Anna Lalonde: Thank you! My children and I are loving this.
 
01:13:03 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Ukrainian Greek
 
01:14:09 Jeff O.: That would be lovely!
 
01:14:26 carol_000: Replying to "Welcome 🙂"
 
Thanks, I was raised Ukr. Grk Orthodox but now go to OCA church in All English.
 
01:14:45 Kevin & Lilly: Yes!!
 
01:14:52 Rachel: and icon paintng
 
01:15:00 Jacqulyn: Let's do it!
 
01:15:34 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father
 
01:15:35 ANDREW ADAMS: Thank you, Father!
 
01:15:35 Anna Lalonde: Prayers for my healing. Please especially St Charbel help me!
 
01:15:38 Rachel: thank you!
 
01:15:39 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 😊
 
01:15:42 Jeff O.: Thank you! Great to be with you all!
 
01:15:44 David: Thank you father!
 
01:15:46 Dave Warner (AL): Thank you Father!
 
01:15:54 Edmund Dyjak: Thank You GOD Bless You
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XXIII, Part I

We have continued to make our way through the final few hypotheses about fasting and eating in general. What is gradually coming to light is that our relationship with Christ and our identity in Him is to form and fashion every aspect of our lives. This includes what we might consider the most mundane aspects of our life or what we take for granted, such as eating and common meals. 
What becomes perfectly clear in this hypothesis, however, is that there is a specific decorum that emerged in the practice of the fathers. The way that they looked at food and the way that they ate their common meals was all shaped by their greater commitment to the life of prayer and silence. The ascetical life shaped their actions and supported their pursuit of the ultimate goal. Thus eating, the quality of the food, the mannerisms at table and amount of food that other monks ate and the general behavior during meals all became important matters and subject to proper formation. 
The ideal was not to form a Christian gentleman, but rather to form a heart that was watchful at all times of the day and that was very much aware of the power of our most basic appetites. We see restraint being taught; that is, slowing oneself down at meals and not being driven by the pressure of hunger or the allure of delicious food. It is Christ the Bread of Life that one is always seeking and so the way that we approach our meals should be a reflection of how we approach the Lord in the Holy Mysteries. Our mindset, our sense of gratitude, the solemnity of our attitudes and behaviors are all reflection of our understanding of the connection with the Paschal Mystery. When we think of our own formation we must have this broad scope so that we do not treat our ascetic practices as ends in themselves. All that we do must be offered to God or it is wasted.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:17:20 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 165, #A
 
00:44:06 Una: LOL about the comment about men eating. And then they throw their silverware in the trash? Obviously, I've never been in a men's monastery. But how can we who are living in the world apply these standards to everyday dinners with family?
 
00:46:49 Una: I'm thinking of Thanksgiving Dinner where people gobble gobble gobble and aren't focused on God at all. Last year I had a hard time getting them to listen to the Prayer of St. Francis before the meal. Very secular family. How I personally may maintain my recollection yet still be social
 
00:47:50 Una: I find I can "go out" of myself so easily and get lost in socializing and talking (I'm an extravert) and then have difficulty becoming recollected again
 
01:03:42 Una: Is it true that the early Irish monasticism came from Egypt?
 
01:10:13 Una: There's a new book on this subject: Monastery and High Cross: The Forgotten Eastern Roots of Irish Christianity
 
01:10:20 Una: by Connie Marshner
 
01:10:34 Una: Sophia Institute Press
 
01:11:49 Steve: Good story
 
01:11:59 Una: Connie Marshner is a Melkite Green Catholic in Virginia
 
01:21:26 ANDREW ADAMS: Thank you, Father!
 
01:21:48 Troy Amaro: Thank you Father.
 
01:22:30 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you, sorry I was so late, our clocks went back an hour yesterday and I forgot about the time difference
 
01:24:18 ANDREW ADAMS: Where does one find the substack? I’m not knowledgeable on the whole social media scene.
 
01:25:19 Adam Paige: Where does one find the substack? I’m not knowledgeable on the whole social media scene.
https://substack.com/@frcharbelabernethy
 
01:25:44 ANDREW ADAMS: Replying to "Where does one find ..."
 
Thank you!
 
01:27:47 Bob Cihak, AZ: .. or https://frcharbelabernethy.substack.com/
 
01:28:16 Paul G.: Replying to ".. or https://frchar…"
+1
 
01:29:21 Maureen Cunningham: Thank  you
 
01:32:17 Maureen Cunningham: Wow
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIX, Part I

St. John understands that we are out of our depths whenever we try to capture with words what comes through experience. This is true in particular of the heights of prayer, contemplation, and with dispassion. John’s language is poetic and thus a reflection of his straining to present us with the end of the spiritual life and what the heart longs for the most.
In concluding his teachings on prayer, he warns us of certain pitfalls to avoid in order that our focus might remain upon Christ. Above all he does not want us to become discouraged by the attack of the evil one. Such a thing is to be expected. Prayer is so beautiful and transformative that the demons are going to do everything they can to disrupt it. Yet, John would have us understand that the demons are scourged by prayer and when we show fortitude they flee. Finally, he would have be confident in the practice of prayer. There is nothing that one can write in a book that is necessary when we have God himself as the Teacher of prayer. It is the Holy Spirit that searches the depths of God the guides us forward.
Dispassion is even more difficult to capture with mere words for it describes one who has made his flesh incorruptible and has subdued all the senses; keeping his soul before the face of the Lord and always straining towards him. One is not only detached from the things of this world but has a gathered an exhaustible store of virtue as a source of strength. They are driven no longer by fear, but now only love; love that cannot be understood by mere reason. The soul is drawn forward by an urgent longing that belongs only to those who are created in the image and likeness of God. Therefore, St. John sees dispassion as purity of heart; where a person has reached a level of existence where sin has no hold upon them and there is no longer even any awareness of the presence of demons. Such an individual is wholly united with God and always will be.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:24 Gregory Chura: Which step?
 
00:06:05 Bob Cihak, AZ: p. 240, #58
 
00:07:29 Myles Davidson: Can I ask what edition of The Ladder we are reading from?
 
00:08:08 Adam Paige: Paulist Press edition page 281 🙂
 
00:09:01 Adam Paige: The introduction is excellent too, although it doesn’t contain the Letter to the Shepherd at the end
 
00:11:21 Bob Cihak, AZ: p. 240, #58
 
00:15:46 Kevin & Lilly: Aren't we supposed to expose our wound (sin) in its entirety for Jesus to heal it (in the confessional)? Similar to removing the band-aid, even if it hurts us?
 
00:21:42 Cindy Moran: Some things you can not "unsee"
 
00:26:26 susan: I get attacked walking up to communion and then I feel
 
00:26:48 susan: like I have done something wrong
 
00:29:02 Anthony: I also think having undergone at least once a spiritual attack, a person anticipates it and therefore brings it to mind?
 
00:31:05 Christian Corulli: Love of God destroys all fear
 
00:56:07 Christian Corulli: This sounds like the 7th Mansion of St. Teresa, can we make that comparison? Do the Carmelites trace the same spiritual path as St. John Climacus?
 
01:08:10 David: Is there an element of experience or getting older in this step. My grandfather always used to say youth is a process of acquiring and drive and growing old is the challenge of learning to let go. Through suffering, experience I can see more an more elements of dispassion or not feeling as connected to what many seek in the world and am left with only what endures which is family and faith.
 
01:22:15 David: Saving us from ourselves
 
01:22:38 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Blessing to all
 
01:23:06 Gregory Chura: Thank you, everyone,
 
01:23:06 Tracey Fredman: Reacted to "Thank You Blessing t..." with ❤️
 
01:23:07 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father !!!
 
01:23:10 Anthony Kinyon (Αντώνιος Κινγιόν): Thank you Fr. Charbel.
 
01:23:10 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:23:10 David: Thank you father and God bless you and your mom
 
01:23:11 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:23:16 Cameron Jackson: Overwhelmed again. Thank you Fr.
 
01:24:13 Alexandra: Thank you Father. I'll pray for you
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XXII, Part III

It’s important for us as we read the fathers and consider the discipline that they embraced regarding our appetites and desires that we do not demonize these realities or fall into extreme practices. At the heart of the fathers’ lives and teachings is desire; allowing the love of God and gratitude for his gifts to guide and direct their understanding of life and perception of reality. 
It is true that the desert was every bit the laboratory; the fathers often pushed themselves in extreme ways in order that their appetites and their desires for satisfaction and pleasure would lose their grip upon them. They were often harsh with themselves in ways that seem abhorrent to modern sensibilities. 
Yet they realized that these realities are very powerful parts of our humanity. The body, for example, through the ascetic life can be a powerful aid in our sanctification. However, if we approach our appetites in an unmeasured fashion, or in a way that is simply focused upon the self, then that which is most beautiful can be corrupted.
Thus, our own embrace of the ascetic life should be rooted in desire; our sense of lack and incompleteness outside of God. Our truest identity is established and found only in Him. Such a vision must be fostered from the earliest years of our lives. For it is not something that one can give or share with another. It comes only through experience. One comes to love the disciplines of which the father speak (fasting, prayer, vigils etc.) because they are far more than mere disciplines. They open up the path for us to experience the invincible joy and peace and freedom of the Kingdom. “Taste and see the goodness of the Lord.”
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Text of chat during the group: 
00:15:57 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 161, G
 
00:16:11 Adam Paige: Reacted to "P. 161, G" with 👍
 
01:05:40 Bob Cihak, AZ: From Adam:
Adam Paige 5:14 PM
Should we avoid restaurants since they’re typically predicated on desirable food ? Or should we order a less appealing meal when we are at a restaurant ?
 
01:12:52 Cindy Moran: You aren't missing anything!
 
01:14:19 Adam Paige: Reacted to "You aren't missing a…" with 😂
 
01:19:42 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Father
 
01:19:55 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:59 ANDREW ADAMS: Thank you, Father!
 
01:20:11 Tracey Fredman: Glad you are feeling better, Fr. Charbel!
 
01:20:14 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 
01:20:21 Kevin Burke: Thank You Father!
 
01:20:39 Tracey Fredman: Liturgy of the Hours is one you mentioned one time. Is that a possibility for a topic?
 
01:20:47 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Liturgy of the Hours…" with ❤️
 
01:21:01 Cameron Jackson: Thank you Father
 
01:21:19 Myles Davidson: Your Substack is excellent Father
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVIII, Part VII

As St. John draws us more deeply into his understanding of prayer and the experience of intimacy with God, he begins to emphasize the importance of maintaining purity of heart and humility. Either through negligence or through demonic provocation, we can find ourselves being driven not by the Holy Spirit toward God but rather driven by the desires of the flesh. The vulnerability of prayer, opening our minds and our hearts to God, also carries with it the need to have established watchfulness of heart. If we have not we can indiscriminately open ourselves up to certain dangers. For example, we may allow our mind to wander during prayer in such a way that we turn away from God. It can even happen that in this turning away we are move towards the enemies of God. Like Judas we can share most intimately with the Lord at the table of the holy Eucharist and then immediately be driven out by an unholy spirit into the darkness. It is those who are closest to Christ who often betray him the most. 
We all take certain things for granted. This is true in our relationship with God. We can treat that relationship cheaply; enter into it with a kind of familiarity to the point that we lose sight of the preciousness of what God has made possible for us. Our attachment to the things of this world or to individuals can fill our minds and our hearts even during the time of prayer. Therefore, John wants us to have no illusions about what it is that we ask for and seek in prayer. Our greatest desire should be what leads us to God and what endures unto eternity. As Saint James tell us: “we ask, but we do not receive because we ask wrongly.” We seek only the satisfy our natural wants and desires.  As it has been said, “The fool’s portion is small in his eyes.” Often we do not see the beauty of what God offers us.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:12:58 Bob Cihak, AZ: P.239, #50
 
00:13:44 Tracey Fredman: Reacted to "P.239, #50" with 👍
 
00:14:28 Dave Warner (AL): Reacted to "P.239, #50" with 👍
 
00:51:38 Rachel: or to satisfy ego since it is difficult to see oneself as nothing and in such need.
 
00:59:38 David: Someone told me once - measure your thoughts and you measure what you treasure. Treasure only what is everlasting.
 
01:02:14 Laura: Reacted to "Someone told me once..." with 👍🏼
 
01:04:59 Rebecca Thérèse: It seems to me that it's easier to catch someone in infidelity these days because of socia media and smart devices etc than it was previously.
 
01:11:31 Anthony: I've wondered if we get monastic life and vocations imbalanced? I read that among Syrians, there was one "monastic" community composed of subsets of vowed religious, families and singles.  This makes for universality and diversity and maybe a healthier psychology for persons?
 
01:13:45 Rebecca Thérèse: Thomas Szasz the anti-psychiatry psychiatrist wrote a paper about how psychiatrists persuaded the Church that sex abusers were ill and could be treated and how this led to priests being "treated" and moved instead of being fired.
 
01:14:12 Una: Jon Hassler wrote North of Hope dealing with this situation of the priest who dealt with this issue
 
01:14:29 Una: Excellent novel
 
01:18:38 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...great to be back in class!!
 
01:18:40 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂
 
01:18:47 David: Thank you father. Glad your feeling better!
 
01:18:51 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:19:02 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:19:03 Tracey Fredman: Reacted to "Thank you father. Gl..." with ❤️
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XXII, Part II

It may seem surprising that the fathers spend so much time speaking about food and how we approach eating. Yet the needs of the flesh are very much a part of who we are as human beings. So how we eat and what we eat can affect what goes on internally. We can be subject to disorder or extremes in one fashion or another. 
What we see in the desert fathers and mothers is a love of fasting because they saw it as the insurer and foundation of the other virtues. In other words, when one can order an appetite and a desire towards what is good and specifically as tied to our hunger for God, then we are able to do so with other aspects of our humanity and our other appetites. Eating, being one of the most basic needs can lead us in one of two directions; either it is the gateway vice that opens us up to be more vulnerable to disordered appetites, or our restriction of our diet can turn us toward God who satisfies the deepest longings of the human heart.
The fathers examine the practice of eating from multiple perspectives. They had an acute sense of the subtlety with which the mind approaches such a practice. We can be hyper-focused upon the body and its needs. We can use illness as an excuse for slothfulness or to eat beyond our needs or what health demands. Likewise, we can become overly focused upon the quality of food and only want what is pleasing to the pallet or perfectly fresh. We lose sight of the fact that what we prize so much passes into the latrine. It may satisfy the pallet but it does not give rest to the soul.
The fathers also understood that we must give ourselves over to this practice without over-analyzing its value. Our tendency to pamper the body can make us and our consciences become callous and lead us down the path to hedonism. We lose sight of the fact that this appetite is incited by everything in the culture around us that has made food an idol. It has also made it a medicine in the sense that we turned to it to find solace and comfort. In a subtle way we are being taught to avoid affliction at any cost and to question the redeeming nature of the cross.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:10:54 Nick Bodmer: I had a question about the next work for the Wednesday group.  What is after the Ladder, and is there a recommend translation?
 
00:12:17 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 159, #B
 
00:12:40 Nick Bodmer: 👍
 
00:21:03 Bob Cihak, AZ: A good friend lost 20 pounds. His method: When I'm not hungry, I don't eat.
 
00:22:02 Myles Davidson: Do you have any advice for those of us who are very slim and with very little body fat but who want to increase our fasting practice? I’m finding it a real art-form and a balance that’s not easy to find.
 
00:25:01 Bob Cihak, AZ: Many find "Eat, Fast, Feast" a book by my friend, Jay Richards, very helpful. He looks at fasting for spiritual, fitness and dietary reasons; he says no one else had written such a book.
 
00:25:25 Forrest Cavalier: Hi Myles, I am low BMI myself. I discipline my fasting in order to not go below a target weight. For me 137 lbs. I do not eat breakfast. I do not eat snacks during Lent. I have to increase calories at some meals. Most of my fasting discipline is not calorie reduction, but not eating dairy or meat on Wednesday and Friday.
 
00:28:10 Nick Bodmer: This is why the medieval monks made beer 🤣
 
Maintains calories.
 
00:29:28 Myles Davidson: Reacted to "This is why the medi..." with 😃
 
00:36:23 Nikki: If someone is not lean after a decent time of fasting and self discipline with their eating, would that be an indicator they aren’t being disciplined enough to reach that deeper intimacy with the Lord?
 
00:39:40 Anthony: St Thomas Aquinas was so big they cut a hole in dining table fir him....so I've heard. Some people like Neapolitans can be big boned people.
 
00:41:58 Andrew Adams: cortisol
 
00:42:02 Nick Bodmer: Cortisol
 
00:42:51 Joseph: St. Athanasius described St. Anthony: “And they, when they saw him, wondered at the sight, for he had the same habit of body as before, and was neither fat, like a man without exercise, nor lean from fasting and striving with the demons, but he was just the same as they had known him before his retirement.”
 
00:46:45 Bob Cihak, AZ: Our culture now promotes paying MORE money for LESS nutritional value, counting calories as a nutritional value.
 
00:52:28 Anthony: The news scares about food also contribute to our derangement
 
01:00:20 Anthony: Bloomin onion
 
01:05:06 Anthony: The marketers sell us on the things that cause problems and then sell us on the "remedies".....which cause more problems.  This is prophecy of Amos territory.
 
01:09:52 Nick Bodmer: Health is a good, but when we make it an ultimate good, and end in itself, it becomes an idol.
 
01:11:16 Bob Cihak, AZ: Reacted to "Health is a good, bu..." with 👍
 
01:11:51 Bob Cihak, AZ: . As a recovering (retired) MD, I agree with Nick.
 
01:13:21 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:23 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVIII, Part VI

Above all St. John’s writing on prayer works to break through the myopic vision that we have of life, of prayer, and of God.  Like so many of the fathers, he will hammer away at anything which prevents us from experiencing the fullness of God’s love and mercy. Thus, he both rebukes and encourages. 
We began this evening with a warning about admitting fantasies into our mind and heart during prayer. The demonic provocation at such times will be to use religious ideas, visions, etc., to distract us from the beloved and the encounter with him in silence. However, John tells us, if we hold fast to this prayer we are given an invincible assurance; there is a loss of all doubt and the certainty of God’s love is all that remains. The encounter with God Himself is proof of the unprovable!
We must give great care to put on the mind of Christ. We must be merciful as our Heavenly Father is merciful. To allow ourselves even to think of justice is going to immediately pull us down. For there is no justice! What has been revealed to us is unconditional love, mercy, and compassion. To turn a harsh eye toward another is to turn our eyes away from God.
Furthermore, we must allow God in his providence to set both the time and measure of prayer. We cannot treat it as something that anything else in our life is equal to in importance. This is especially true in those blessed moments where God fills the heart with compunction and the eyes with tears that cleanse the soul. We must not break away or abandoned prayer until we see that by divine Providence both the fervor and tears have diminished. “For perhaps you will not have such a moment for the remission of your sins again in all your life.“ We must always choose the one thing necessary.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:15:36 Una: The Catholic psychologist Dr. Raymond Lloyd Richmond
 
00:15:53 Una: ChastitySF.com
 
00:31:09 Anthony: Why are Roman Catholics so fixated on justice? I've thought it's due to inheriting the legal notions of Roman imperial law and German folk law.  But we're so focused on law, that being a Roman Catholic is sometimes not appealing.  Thank God for persons like St Francis of Assisi.
 
00:33:15 Victor Haburchak: Americans are impacted by English Common Law. We’re more rigid than Italians it’s been said.
 
00:34:42 Anthony: I went to Italy. Naples and South. It's so different
 
00:34:56 Victor Haburchak: Reacted to "I went to Italy. Nap…" with 👍
 
00:38:00 Victor Haburchak: On the monastic rules for fasting my grandfather, a Ruthenian immigrant from Eastern Europe, said they were practically starving & yet there were constant calls to fast throughout the year while he was slaving in coal mins v
 
00:38:47 Victor Haburchak: Coal mines….
 
00:41:16 Victor Haburchak: He was a Greek-Catholic so experienced strictness of G-C priests.
 
01:05:38 Anthony: So that prayer also is as quick as breath
 
01:16:48 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:16:51 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:51 Myles Davidson: That was a great hour. Thankyou Fr ! God bless you!
 
01:16:53 David: Thanks Father!
 
01:16:55 Cindy Moran: Thank You Father!!!
 
01:16:57 Jeff O.: Thank you! Great to be with you all.
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XXI, and XXII, Part I

We continued this evening to delve more deeply into the fathers’ understanding of the practice of fasting. Once again we see that they learned from experience that it is better to eat once a day but not to the point of satiation. One must be measured and restrained in the practice, so is not to become weak and incapable of work or of fulfilling one’s prayer rule. 
We also began to see that there was variance in the practices embraced by various monks, both in terms of their diet and the amount they ate. The practice was not to pamper the body but also not to destroy it. The body is necessary in the spiritual battle. Thus one must be discerning in one’s spiritual practice and patient. 
We were also introduced this evening to the particular temptations that arise throughout the course of one’s spiritual life. Again, we must realize that we struggle not only with our own natural weaknesses and the weakness of our sin, but also with temptations and provocations that come to us from the Evil One. We are often tempted by what we see. We covet what appeals to the eyes and seems to promise enjoyment or satisfaction. We hear stories of the father’s catching themselves being tempted to break the rule of fasting. 
What is needed is humility. Fasting is a discipline and when we fail we are to humbly acknowledge it and confess it. We must never be tempted after having fallen to hide our failure or lie about it. It is then that we are truly in the grip of the father of lies and will be further led astray by even greater deception.
Finally, we were taught that there are certain passions that we must be willing to cut out of our life completely. There are certain things that have such a hold on our hearts and enslave our wills that there must be the courage and the willingness to remove it from our lives completely. We must always be willing to choose the better part and to sacrifice all for that pearl great price.
---
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:10:41 David Fraley: Hello everyone! Thank you!
 
00:11:08 David Fraley: Thank you!
 
00:11:29 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 154 A
 
00:16:00 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 154 A
 
00:21:40 Anthony: Yeah, I multiplied devotion. It wasn't so great for me.
 
00:28:34 Joseph Muir: What page are we on?
 
00:29:11 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 156 C
 
00:33:21 Anthony: That bread isn't going to rise well like french bread.  It's either flatbread or pancakes. That's a basic sacrifice.
 
00:33:48 Vanessa: Replying to "That bread isn't goi..."
 
no yeast.
 
00:38:04 Sandra Whatley: "Silence is a place where the serpent can not go. It is a place as toxic to him as his environment is to us"
Father 7/23
 
00:39:09 Sandra Whatley: This is what Father told me in prayer
 
00:45:30 Nikki: The desert fathers approach fasting in different ways. How do we find out what we should do personally regarding approaching a limitation of food (choices & amount) along with heightened self-discipline, when over time the difficulties of continuing that level of intensity may have one think with all seriousness that they should start eating more/fast less? Concerned perhaps they are not eating enough and maybe
their bodies showing signs of this.
 
00:54:26 Nikki: Thank you
 
00:54:46 Kevin Burke: https://archive.org/details/tolovefasting/mode/2up
 
00:55:19 Kevin Burke: On-line version of the Book To Love Fasting
 
00:58:39 Nypaver Clan: Would it have made more sense to leave it for someone else than to waste it?
 
01:06:48 Nypaver Clan: There’s a reason the computer is “Apple.”
 
01:07:18 Bob Cihak, AZ: Reacted to "There’s a reason the..." with 😯
 
01:07:20 Nypaver Clan: The symbol is very telling….
 
01:09:41 Sheila: A large amount of tv shows out there are straight up porn but it's easy to make excuses that it's ok to watch...but let's be real...is it? Single, in a relationship or married, the toll it takes on yourself or the person you care about is so subtle..but it erodes away at real intimacy.
 
01:11:07 Sheila: Truth.
 
01:12:14 Una: I used to write Christian romances (clean romances, no sex scenes) but i gave it up because I felt it did harm to people's imaginations and spiritual life, setting up unreality. I think the Desert Fathers would have something to say about this!
 
01:13:10 Una: Movement toward Reality. Well said!
 
01:14:53 Anthony: Isaac came to my home today!
 
01:15:25 David Fraley: Thanks, Father! Have a great night!
 
01:15:26 Sandra Whatley: Thank you so very much.
 
01:15:36 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:53 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVIII, Part V

What is prayer and, more importantly, what do we become by engaging in prayer? So often we take a reductive view of the realities in our life, including the reality of our relationship with God. We reduce our converse with God to a discipline or an afterthought or worse and obligation. And yet as we read the fathers, we begin to see with greater clarity that prayer involves a kind of mutual vulnerability. We stand before the Other, God, withholding nothing of ourselves from him. In this, we imitate Him who has revealed himself to us in the most vulnerable fashion. He has drawn back the veil and revealed his heart to us and the depth of his love and compassion. 
Such a vision of prayer precludes are treating it in a common fashion; approaching it like we would any other interaction. However, what we are drawn into from the moment of our baptism is the very life of God, a participation in the life of the most holy Trinity. Prayer, then, becomes an expression of identity, of who we are as human beings and what we’ve become in Christ. Seen in such a manner, an unquenchable thirst should arise within the human heart to remain in prayer and prolong it. One desires to linger long with the Beloved. It is to choose the better part. So much of what we learn, and our taught leads only to the fragmentation of the self. The frenetic pace of life and the desperate pursuit to satisfy expectations that we have for ourselves or that others place upon us distorts who we really are. We are sons and daughters of God, heir to the kingdom of heaven, and the Spirit that dwells within the heart alone gives us the capacity to express the love God Himself has for us.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:45 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 237, #34
 
00:38:13 Callie Eisenbrandt: Father how do we learn something everyday in prayer in times of spiritual dryness? Sometimes it feels like its difficult to see what you are to learn until you look back on prayers from the past but how do you do that on a daily basis?
 
00:39:51 Wayne: late what page are we on?
 
00:41:07 Bob Cihak, AZ: p. 238, #38 or so.
 
00:41:35 Wayne: thnx
 
00:42:41 Christian Corulli: I think it would ruin the prayer if we did understand the points of dryness
 
00:53:39 Victor: Parental bragging rights enhanced by need for non-ending FB posts. Good points. Let kids play. “Leisure, the basis of culture”.
 
00:53:44 Alan Henderson: Father, on this point about children, what are your thoughts about finding a balance between - letting children have the play time as you mention, and finding them hobbies/activities that they can enjoy (and spend time with friends).  I agree with you that this is a major concern in how we are shaping our kids.
 
00:55:50 Leilani Nemeroff: If I had it to do over, as a parent, I wouldn’t have felt obligated to run to so many activities.
 
00:56:06 Wayne: Reacted to "If I had it to do ov..." with 👍
 
00:58:07 Leilani Nemeroff: There needs to be time for more free play.
 
00:58:56 Victor: Playing cops & robbers as a kid helped me to warn community when gunman was outside our liturgy back in 70s. Also to help generate strategy when a priest & I were chased by robbers in Africa once.
 
00:59:55 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Playing cops & robbe..." with 😮
 
01:00:10 Ashley Kaschl: Reacted to "Playing cops & robbe…" with 😮
 
01:02:03 Ashley Kaschl: Father, I don’t want to totally change the topic away from
good leisure and play, which is so good, but I was thinking about what you said in regards to busying ourselves or adding to our lives when we don’t need to add, and it brought to mind two quotes:

the first is a monk’s reflection on his need to leave his cell for begging. He said, “Every time I leave my cell, I return less myself.” 

And the second is from St. Francis of Assisi, when he would daily pray, “who are You, Lord, and who am I?” 


I think work properly related to our state in life is meant to be shaped around our prayer time, not our prayer time shaped around our extracurricular activities. I know I fail in this all the time but I find that I have to often reorient myself when I approach prayer because I have to shed burdens I did not know I picked up to carry before I can be with the Lord in a deeper intimacy.
 
01:03:42 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Father, I don’t want..." with 🥰
 
01:05:47 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: I have come to realize that sane and holy life requires quiet time for prayer but also quiet time for psychological wholeness.  Time to sort things out...
 
01:13:07 susan: learned so much!!
 
01:13:13 Victor: Thanks, Father & everyone.
 
01:13:17 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:29 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XIX, and XX

We continued our reading of the Evergetinos this evening with hypotheses 19 and 20. Once again we find ourselves considering the fathers’ teaching on eating and our use of food. Part of the reason they spend so much time on this subject is because they understand the meaning that food has for us as human beings and that it often goes well beyond that of nourishment. We come into this world and our first and earliest experience is that of being suckled; fed at the breast of our mother and thereby comforted. On a psychological level, food can continue to have this meaning. That is not necessarily something bad. There is a form of communion that we have with each other when we have a common meal. Indeed, this is why Christ gives himself to us as Eucharist. However, in our sin, the desire for food can be driven more by the emotional needs that we have in our day-to-day struggles. The fathers understood that the psychological reality affects us spiritually. 
Over and over again, we can turn to the things of this world to satisfy the longing of the human heart that God alone can fill. Christ is the Bread of Life and he alone can nourish us upon his love. Thus the fathers, especially those who entered into the desert, became acutely aware of the need to be watchful of this bodily hunger. When we lose our watchfulness or when we relax our disciplines, once again we can move towards satisfying ourselves through the things of this world. 
Food can become an idol. The monks understood that even in our religiosity we can be tempted to celebrate feasts in such a way that we cast aside all that was gained through fasting. What worth is it to fast 40 days of Lent then only to turn around and eat excessively for 50 days until Pentecost?
The fathers also identified another danger. Our religious sensibilities and identity can be just strong enough that they lead us to want to maintain the illusion of holiness and discipline. The fathers warn us about the temptation to secret eating. Hiding the truth from others as well as from oneself only prevents repentance. In order to hold on to the illusion and false image of the self, we can destroy ourselves spiritually.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:16:18 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 150
 
00:16:49 Lilly: Reacted to "P. 150" with ❤️
 
00:35:32 Forrest Cavalier: That earlier story was Evergetinos 11 in Volume 2.
 
00:39:02 iPhone: The YouTube channel is Athonite Audio. Audio books from the monks on Mount Athos
 
00:50:20 Forrest Cavalier: To know, love, serve in this life, and to be with him in the next
 
00:55:45 Ambrose Little, OP: Only the flamin hot ones, tho
 
01:07:16 Rebecca Thérèse: Is the real issue that the monk out of pride allowed people to think he was better than he was.
 
01:09:46 Fr Marty, AZ, 480-292-3381: I too often judge myself based on some preconceived results or image of what I or someone else should look like. Whereas, it sounds like the fruit of the soil that are my circumstances and weakness and gifts. God told Paul, where you're weak I'm strong. God can hide me in his own way that bears fruits that aren't necessarily visible results.
 
01:12:43 Nypaver Clan: Thank you, Father!
 
01:12:51 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:13:22 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:30 Cameron Jackson: Thank you Father.
 
01:13:33 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father
 
01:13:34 Rebecca Thérèse: thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVIII, Part IV

The very words of St. John Climacus seem to carry us up to heights hitherto unknown and unexpected. The experience of this ascent takes place as we feel our hearts begin to burn for love of God and the desire for him in prayer. 
St. John quickly moves us away from looking at prayer as a mere discipline and rather our being drawn into the depths of Mystery, the very Mystery of the Triune God.  The act of praying is a blessing in and of itself. To enter into this converse with God is also to experience the action of the Spirit within our hearts, the groans of Love that are beyond words.  
In all of this, St. John reshapes are understanding of the nature of prayer. It is not a discipline but an expression of our true nature in Christ. We are to become prayer, consumed by love for the Lord; anxious to show that love and treat it cheaply. 
Faith, St. John tells us, gives wings to prayer. Through it we see with clarity our hearts’ desire. An urgent longing takes hold of the heart that seeks quick satisfaction; that is, seeks to take hold of the Beloved without delay.
---
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:08:23 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 237, #26
 
00:12:17 iPhone: Thank you, Bob
 
00:12:37 Myles Davidson: Hi Father. Which edition of Isaac the Syrian’s AH will you be using?
 
00:13:38 iPhone: Beautiful book
 
00:13:51 Bob Cihak, AZ: Previous posts don't show for newcomers, so I repeat: P. 237, #26
 
00:14:02 Bob Cihak, AZ: Yes! “The Ascetical Homilies of Saint Isaac the Syrian, revised 2nd Edition” published by Holy Transfiguration Monastery, https://www.bostonmonks.com/product_info.php/products_id/635 .
 
00:14:16 Cindy Moran: I just got mine in the mail---loving the glossary.
 
00:14:43 Cindy Moran: Excellent...yes!
 
00:26:15 Anthony: I think the focus on law and duty that we see in some Catholic subcultures damages our understanding of prayer in this mystical way. At least, I think it was not healthy for me, with efforts like "storm heaven with this novena."
 
00:27:53 Myles Davidson: Reacted to "Yes! “The Ascetical ..." with ❤️
 
00:30:43 Anthony: Another thing about legalism is that it chokes faith.
 
00:34:13 Anthony: Like how God said His name was blasphemy among the nation's by bad behavior of the Chosen people.
 
00:35:35 Kate : I have had to undo a lot of this strict legalistic teaching over the years.  Sometimes I fall back into it, and I think it is actually easier for my mind to grasp this legalism rather than open myself and surrender myself to the Love of God.  His Love is almost incomprehensible sometimes, but wonderfully so!
 
00:35:42 iPhone: Glad you mentioned corporal punishment. When I was five or six, I realized how unjust this violence was and I saw that the nun hit us hard enough to make us cry. In my desire for Justice, I resolved not to cry and I didn’t. After that I was marked as a problem child and never got a break. So, yeah, learning to trust is big
 
00:36:49 iPhone: The nuns meant our best, I’m sure. But something was really off with Irish Catholicism at that time (early 60s)
 
00:37:13 Anthony: Replying to "The nuns meant our b..." 
 
 It's Jansenism
 
00:38:19 iPhone: I think Jansenism is applicable but not the whole story
 
00:39:21 iPhone: Oh this is Una. Forget to put in my name
 
00:55:33 Cindy Moran: It's a sort of Divine healing radiation
 
01:04:21 Erick Chastain: Sorry about that got in car mode
 
01:04:27 iPhone: Ignatius and remote preparation
 
01:06:53 Jeff O.: So it all starts with obedience….is this the general
movement…recognizing that it’s not quite so linear? obedience —> humility —> discernment —> dispassion —> true prayer
 
01:12:22 Jacqulyn: Reacted to "Sorry about that got..." with 👍
 
01:13:34 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Blessing
 
01:13:50 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:57 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father! Will be in prayer for you!
 
01:13:58 Jacqulyn: God bless!
 
01:14:03 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂Have a good retreat!
 
01:14:05 Nypaver Clan: Is there a particular website we should check to get the next book?
 
01:14:06 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:14:10 Art iPhone: Thank you, Father!
 
01:14:22 Joseph: Thank you, Father.
 
01:14:40 Nypaver Clan: Is the next book cheaper than $70 anywhere?
 
01:14:59 Maureen Cunningham: On line
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XVIII, Part III

Synopsis of tonight’s group on the Evergetinos- Hypothesis 18 Sections H and I:
 
This evening we concluded hypothesis 18 with the clarity that only St. John Cassian can bring. Cassian, though as western monk, spent many years in Egypt among the desert fathers and was able to distill their thought with great clarity for the western mind as well as the western monk. He shows us what the practice, or as he says, the vast experience of the monks over the course of time offers us. They show us that we are to avoid extremes. Fasting is not to be extended over the course of many days because the immoderate practice of fasting leads to the immoderate break of the fast and over-eating. Fasting is to be embraced, not as an end in itself, but as a means to bringing about both internal and external stability to a confused and unruly life. There is only one hard and fast rule and that is not to eat to the point of satiation. In fact, we must understand the uniqueness of each individual in regard to their experience in the ascetic life and the strength of their constitution. Not everybody can restrain the amount of food they eat to the same extent. Nor can everyone live a strictly vegan diet.
 
Cassian also notes that illness does not come into conflict with purity of heart. It may demand that we lighten our discipline for the sake of the health of the body. But even here we should eat in moderation and whatever the illness demands without making ourselves slaves to the assaults of evil desires. “The moderate and logical use of food ensures the health of the body; it does not detract from holiness.” Once again the fathers prove themselves to be both spiritually and psychologically astute as well as having a clear understanding of the physiological needs that we have as human beings.
 
Fasting in many way is starting point for us and not only serves us in the struggle for purity of heart by humbling the mind and the body, but it also reveals to us that the spiritual life must involve the whole person. We begin with the basics and our most fundamental need – the need for sustenance. A confused mind is born out of disorder, and this brings confusion to the soul, and from that purity slowly disappears. Much of the turmoil that we experience in our life arises out of the loss of peace that comes from a disordered life. However, when this order emerges within us and we begin to taste something of the peace of Christ, then something is born within the human heart. The Fathers tells us that from the light of peace a pure wind blows through the mind. To the extent that the heart can draw near to wisdom, it receives grace from God. Thus fasting may not seem to be necessary or important in our generation, but for the fathers it lays the very foundation of a life that is caught up in Christ and transformed by his grace.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:09:53 Nicole Dillon: Hello everyone. Happy to be able to join tonite. Thank you 🙏🏼 🥰🕊️
 
00:10:46 Ambrose Little, OP: St. John’s Conferences were one of the few books
that St. Dominic kept and carried with him.
 
00:24:57 Wayne: Some may be Vegan?
 
00:25:26 Laura: Vegan - no animal products
 
00:25:34 Lilly (Toronto, CA): No animal products at all
 
00:25:50 Forrest Cavalier: There are also fruitarians.
 
00:25:57 Rebecca Thérèse: Vegans won't even eat honey
 
00:26:17 Lilly (Toronto, CA): I've been a nut for 12 years 😅
 
00:26:23 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Vegans won't even ea..." with 🙄
 
00:26:43 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "There are also fruit..." with 🙄
 
00:29:14 Anthony: When the Mongols became Christian,  they had a meat and milk diet.  They were advised by the "nestorian" bishop to abstain from fermented mare's milk.
 
00:36:04 Lilly (Toronto, CA): I've always wondered if God's plan for Adam and Eve was for humanity to be vegan? Did original sin bring about the killing of animals and need for such products?
 
00:36:50 Anthony: Reacted to I've always wondered... with "👍"
 
00:41:43 Nypaver Clan: Can a disordered life cause mental disorder or does the mental disorder usually come first, then the disordered life?
 
00:51:42 Wayne: Replying to "I've always wondered..."
 
I don't have the  scriptural verse in Genuis that suggest we should not be eating animal products
 
00:56:29 Rebecca Thérèse: When I worked in mental health over a decade ago, professionals completely adopted the secularist notions towards sexuality and sexual behaviour without even any understanding of different values in this area. For example, stating that a Muslim man would have hang ups around sex because of his religion. Also, a colleague was refused a job because in an interview he said he would advise a Muslim with same sex attraction to speak to a Muslim religious leader. He was told he failed the diversity question as this was the wrong answer since religious leaders are the most conservative of people. It's considered bad for mental health to observe traditional sexual morality.
 
00:58:36 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "When I worked in men..." with 😢
 
00:58:55 Lilly (Toronto, CA): Is there an actual scriptural verse in Genesis that can clarify my previous question?
 
00:59:25 Forrest Cavalier: Replying to "Is there an actual s..."
 
Gen 9:3
 
01:02:44 iPhone: I’ve been called a bigot for believing that homosexuality activity is a sin and that the attraction is disordered, although I do not reject or condemn this man
 
01:05:36 Wayne: Replying to "Is there an actual s..."
 
yes that's it
 
01:06:41 Wayne: Replying to "Is there an actual s..."
 
I checked the foot notes on this verse and did not get clarity on it
 
01:07:27 Nicole Dillon: Thank you Father!
 
01:07:53 Laura: Reacted to "Thank you Father!" with 👍🏼
 
01:08:05 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you, FatherI keep you in  prayer for your retreat Blessing
 
01:08:13 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:08:17 Forrest Cavalier: So grateful!
 
01:08:21 iPhone: Thank you, Father
 
01:08:29 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 
01:08:33 Cameron Jackson: Thank you.
 
01:08:38 iPhone: Bye bye
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVIII, Part III

Joy! Suddenly, as we read through the Ladder of Dive Ascent every cross, every struggle in the spiritual life, while still present, begins to fade into the background. The costs involved in this struggle pales in comparison to the blessings and the fruits that God bestows upon us, especially prayer .
St. John places before us the essentials of prayer - as well as what can undermine it. We continue to struggle to confine our thoughts and then to completely still the mind and the heart. When this takes place, prayer becomes perfection and rapture in the Lord. 
This joy, however, especially among the anchorites is marked by humility. One does not expose the deepest elements of the most intimate relationship indiscriminately with others. In any case, it would be impossible to do so. As we are drawn along in faith, as we begin to encounter and experience God as he is in himself, words fail us.
What we must do is hold on to what is precious. Imperfections and anxieties can pull us away from God and our trust in his love. Furthermore the evil one is ever set on disrupting that relationship. Plotting and conniving as he is, he will stir an emotion within our heart; or influence another to engage us in such a way so as to agitate or distract. But we must keep our eyes upon the Beloved. 
St. John asks, “For what have I in heaven? Nothing. And what have I desired on earth beside Thee? Nothing, but to cling continually to Thee in prayer without distraction.”  Hearing these words, one can never look upon prayer simply as an activity or discipline. It is life. It is love. We are to become prayer.
---
Text of chat during the group: 
00:06:52 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 235, # 19
 
00:11:46 Myles Davidson: Greetings from New Zealand! (my apologies for turning up at the end of the last session… got the time zone conversion wrong). Anyway, delighted to be here. These discussions have been an immeasurable blessing to this baby Catholic. Thanking you profusely Father, and God bless you and your ministry!!
 
00:20:15 Myles Davidson: Do you have any tips for developing watchfulness of thoughts. Is this just a constant practice of mindfulness of thought?
 
00:29:37 Kate : What about the publication of saints’ diaries or journals?  What would the Fathers say about this?
 
00:30:01 Anthony: Replying to "What about the publi..." 
 
 I love this question
 
00:30:36 iPhone: Can you explain vigils? Is it vespers and compline?
 
00:31:17 Rod Castillo: My Life in Christ by John of Kronstadt ????
 
00:32:42 Anthony: So the idea popular in "evangelicalism" (and now with Catholics and Orthodox) of a tell-all conversion story is not appropriate.
 
00:33:02 Jeff O.: Reacted to "So the idea popular ..." with 🎯
 
00:34:59 iPhone: This is a fascinating topic, this saying too much   Thank you
 
00:35:31 Rebecca Thérèse: Is there any evidence of changes in attitudes towards publishing personal spiritual journals since the advent of the printing press?
 
00:37:00 iPhone: Why is this tell-all trend happening? Because so many people have not read the Fathers?
 
00:37:23 iPhone: Blogs! Immodesty personified!
 
00:37:30 Myles Davidson: People aren’y going to confession perhaps?
 
00:56:33 Anthony: Wow.  So excessive chasing after goods and the obsession with trans- stuff us a war on prayer.
 
01:03:27 Rebecca Thérèse: There was a real antipathy towards ancestral religions by many of the founders of modern psychology and psychiatry including Freud. There are also nefarious financial and political interests in these areas
 
01:06:37 Bob Cihak, AZ: Too true. Too often, it's the easy way out, just prescribing drugs.
 
01:07:48 Nypaver Clan: An instructor I had at Duquesne U.  who was a therapist, often said that the majority of her clients would have best been served in the confessional.
 
01:13:01 Cameron Jackson: Thank you Father. A great blessing.
 
01:13:05 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you, Father! This is a Blessing!
 
01:13:42 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:43 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:45 David: Thank you father!
 
01:13:47 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:51 Jeff O.: Thank you! Great to be with you all.
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XVIII, Part II

No one is going to take up the practice of fasting or come to “love fasting” as we have often spoken of unless they are taught by those who have deep and long experience in the practice. As we have seen the desert was very much laboratory. Those who entered into it were driven by the desire for the Lord and to remove any impediment to that desire. 
Yet, we see in the writings of the Evergetinos a natural progression, an organic progression, in the practice. Their zeal for the Lord often led the monks to engage in the practice of fasting with great strictness and to radically humble the body. However, they quickly learned that to practice even that which is good in an imprudent and unmeasured fashion was dangerous. To fall into exhaustion from fasting too long could make it impossible for a person to remain awake to engage in the practice of prayer or, similarly, weaken their watchfulness of mind such that they become vulnerable to the provocation of sinful thoughts. 
The desert fathers also had to learn that fasting was but an implement. It is necessary for the cultivation of the heart, but it must be accompanied by constant prayer and bear the fruit of love for God and virtue. Therefore, the Evergetinos places us in a privileged position. We are able to sit at the feet of the great elders of old and to learn from the errors and the pitfalls that can cripple us in the spiritual life as well as to be inspired by the fathers’ great sanctity. The spiritual struggle is rarely neat and the path ahead is often hidden to us. The desert fathers are shining light in an age of spiritual darkness and lack of guidance. Thanks be to God for such a precious gift.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:30:18 Anthony: I feel targeted.... 😉
 
00:36:50 Una: Does that include Irish Coffees?
 
00:48:47 Anthony: It's a gift to be simple, it's a gift to be free
 
00:48:54 Forrest Cavalier: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simple_Gifts
 
00:49:21 Forrest Cavalier: Tis the gift to be simple, 'tis the gift to be free
'Tis the gift to come down where we ought to be,
And when we find ourselves in the place just right,
'Twill be in the valley of love and delight.
When true simplicity is gained,
To bow and to bend we shan’t be ashamed,
To turn, turn will be our delight,
Till by turning, turning we come 'round right.[5]
 
00:56:47 Anthony: Excessive sorrow also brings exhaustion.
 
01:07:30 Anthony: History also shows fixation on pornography is almost always present
 
01:17:26 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you
 
01:17:40 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:17:46 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:50 Kevin Burke: Thank you !
 
01:18:03 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVIII, Part II

There are some things that cannot be learned from books – prayer most of all! However, St. John, as so many of the Saints speaks to us from long experience as one who truly has seen Christ, knows Christ and has conversed with him deeply. Whatever might be lacking in his thought it still stokes the fire of desire within any heart that longs for God. 
The desert fathers understood that God looks upon us as his sons and daughters his children, and the simplest word or groan from the heart is sufficient to express our need and love. Above all, we are to have gratitude and a spirit of compunction. With these then we approach the Lord with the intentions of our hearts. 
We should not fear our own weakness or the multiplicity of our thoughts that seem to overwhelm us. St. John reminds us that He who “sets the bounds to the sea of the mind will visit us, and during our prayer will say to the waves thus far shall you come and no further.” 
Prayer should be the simplest of things, but also what we hold to be most precious. We should come to see it as necessary as breathing but even more essential. The fathers tell us that we are to become prayer - our life is to be a sacrifice of praise. We are to be the very reflection of Christ. The kingdom is now, heaven is now and dwells within us. May our foolish hearts take hold of the gift that the Beloved offers us so freely.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:01:29 Bob Cihak, AZ: p. 234, # 1.5
 
00:05:18 Bob Cihak, AZ: We were half way thru #1.
 
00:05:53 Gregory Chura: Which step?
 
00:06:03 Gregory Chura: Thank you!
 
00:39:40 Anthony: So how to ignore the rational and irrational mind when praying? Just pray and eventually it happens?  Because my mind gets in the way.  
 
00:40:42 susan: Jesus [rayer
 
00:45:37 David: Sometimes something tactile like a chotki, rosary or stone ( have one that fits my hand from a retreat center) can help one become grounded. Others a icon or image can help set the mind and still others a candle or breathing technique can quickly return us to a calm state.
 
00:51:37 Wayne: Doing some active physical activity can settle the mind down before prayer.
 
01:03:05 Jeff O.: proverbs 24
 
01:03:22 Jeff O.: verse 16
 
01:03:24 Nypaver Clan: Verse 16
 
01:14:56 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:14:59 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:15:02 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:05 David: Thanks Father!
 
01:15:06 Gregory Chura: Thank you, Father!
 
01:15:11 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XVIII, Part I

We picked up this evening with the beginning of hypothesis 18. For weeks now we have been reading about the essential practice of fasting. The cultivation of virtue and the overcoming of the passions is impossible without it. Making use of the body to strengthen the soul is a necessity. But we quickly realize from the stories that this practice can become imbalanced; monks could fall into extremes and be tempted to engage in disciplines in ways that feed the ego – ways that make them feel holy or religious. 
Yet the desert was a great teacher. The monks learned in this laboratory the subtle movements not only of the mind and the heart, but the way the demons tempt us to extremes. To fast for three or four days serves only to weaken the body and this can disrupt one’s spiritual practices as well as one make one ill. It can also, fill the heart with pride. In this, the gains made in the life of virtue can be lost in an instant. 
Therefore, the fathers begin to understand that fasting must be practiced with restraint, measure, and good wisdom. We must never lose sight of the fact that our fasting is tied to Christ and who he is for us. He is the beloved, the heavenly bridegroom, and our fasting and the hunger it produces must be tied in our minds and our hearts to our desire for Christ, the bread of life. He alone satisfies the deepest longings of the human heart. Therefore fasting is not meant to kill the body, but rather re-order our desires toward their true end. Fasting then is to be done with regularity, extending no more than one day. We begin simply by not eating to the point of satiation. We give the body what is necessary, but no more. In all of this we are taught that the royal path to purity of heart is fasting and that light burdens are also profitable.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:07:34 Una: Could someone tell me what book we're using?
 
00:08:20 Andrew Adams: Replying to "Could someone tell m..."
 
https://www.ctosonline.org/patristic/EvCT.html
 
00:08:44 Una: Thank you!
 
00:44:43 Anonymous Sinner: What page?
 
00:47:02 Una: I grew up in Ireland at the time when doctors were doctors and not pill pushers. Our Dr. O'Dolan's best health advice was to always leave the table a little hungry. He was a good Irish Catholic too. I've found following this advice more difficult that doing "heroic" fasts of ten days or so.
 
01:01:44 Anonymous Sinner: I thought that it was Mother Teresa who said this, about praying for 2 hours when one is busy?
 
01:07:41 Maureen Cunningham: Moderation in everything even in moderation
 
01:08:48 Anonymous Sinner: CS Lewis’s chapter on gluttony in the Screwtape Letters comes to mind
 
01:16:27 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you Blessing
 
01:16:37 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:16:39 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:53 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII, Part IX, and XXVIII, Part I

As St. John Climacus comes to the end of the step on stillness and segues into the step on prayer, it is as if he is beckoning us with every word to enter into silence and to give ourselves over to prayer; not as a discipline but rather as a response to the gift of God’s love. We are so often filled with a hunger that is inexplicable to us. We seek to nourish ourselves upon the things of this world indiscriminately - only to find them sadly insufficient. We pathetically move on to something else that captures our attention. The world constantly tells us that it has “some thing” that will fill that void within our hearts. 
Therefore, St. John begins to define for us the mother of virtues – prayer. Not once does John describe prayer as a discipline but rather lays out before us all that it promises. The world sees it perhaps as a waste of time or an escape from reality. However, John makes it clear that the union prayer establishes with God upholds the very fabric of the world and opens the door to reconciliation with God. It becomes the cure and the healing balm for the deepest sorrows of human existence. 
Those realities that we experience during our life that are most painful are healed by being drawn into the eternal life and love of God - a God who has taken every bit of this suffering upon himself and permeates it. Prayer is our greatest treasure! May God give us the grace in the coming weeks to see and understand this.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:15:43 Bob Cihak, AZ: P.232, #77
 
00:17:02 Bob Cihak, AZ: As best I know, the next book, we’ll be doing is “The Ascetical Homilies of Saint Isaac the Syrian, revised 2nd Edition” published by Holy Transfiguration Monastery, https://www.bostonmonks.com/product_info.php/products_id/635 .
 
00:17:13 Jeff O.: Reacted to "As best I know, the ..." with 👍
 
00:22:47 Jeff O.: I find that the 3 o’clock hour is the hour I most regularly awake to spiritual battle…fear, attacks in dreams, etc. There have been many nights I awake during that hour feeling an overwhelming need to pray and sings hymns… I have increasingly seen the value of praying at some time during that hour.
 
00:38:44 Anthony: This curiousity is a misdirected "eros"
 
00:39:42 Ambrose Little, OP: You triggered mine, too.
 
00:39:47 Ambrose Little, OP: Twice
 
00:39:53 Andrew Adams: Mine too!
 
00:40:57 Kathy Locher: How can you break its hold? Internet etc
 
00:42:37 Anthony: Makes us nervous and anxious too
 
00:59:42 Lori Hatala: there yourlies also
 
00:59:47 Rebecca Thérèse: Where your treasure is there will be your heart also
 
01:20:02 Anthony: If chronological time is a creature, prayer brings us to kairos time which like the shekinah or tabor light, is untreated. Thus things in chronological past can be healed.
 
01:23:09 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:23:10 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father!
 
01:23:11 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:23:12 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:23:32 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father!
 
01:23:35 Cameron Jackson: Thank you!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part VIII

One of the most wonderful things that someone said in the group tonight was: “I am amazed at how simple it all is!”  And they are absolutely right in their observation. All that the fathers tell us - about the struggle for purity of heart and overcoming the passions, seeking stillness and constancy in prayer - comes down to one simple reality. 
God is love and that all run but “one receives the prize without effort!” He who humbles himself will be exalted. The moment we turn the mind and the heart to God and - even prior to that - the mere existence of humility in our hearts leads God to lift us up to gaze upon him face-to-face. It is like a child who has no illusions about his self-worth or identity, but simply reaches out for the parent and is lifted up immediately in love!
It is this love that the hesychast seeks above all things; the eye of the heart is constantly turned toward and seeking the Belived. What is the one thing necessary that our Lord speaks about in the gospel? Mary sat at his feet being nourished upon his words of love and his presence. This is the better part. We so often complicate our lives and spend years and decades pursuing what the false self tells us that we need or where we will find dignity and the fullness of life. In the end, there is no ladder! There is only love and the urgent longing that makes us strive for it.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:22:52 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 230, #68
 
00:30:26 Anthony: There is a tension though, between a situation that is wrong which should be made right, and waiting in patience
 
00:33:32 Anthony: Ok, so like Abraham had a promise that took a long timevtivrealize
 
00:33:41 Anthony: Long time to realize
 
00:34:58 Anthony: Thank you
 
00:37:15 Fr Marty AZ 480-292-3381: be self-controlled and sober-minded for the sake of your prayers. 1Peter 4:7
 
00:39:41 Julie’s iPad: It’s hard when you’re accused of something you didn’t do or say not to defend yourself.
 
00:51:14 Anthony: Ego is the false self. Is Despondency a false remorse?
 
00:53:58 Nypaver Clan: Without effort?
 
00:55:09 Kate : I am really blown away by the simplicity of this.  How many times I have complicated the spiritual life!
 
00:58:02 David: I wasted years reading books and talking to people on discernment which always was a labyrinth of paths. On a retreat a old Jesuit Priest made it easy in 1 minute: Does this lead me closer to God or away from God. Our intellect often gets us lost and like a rocking chair giving us something to do but going nowhere.
 
00:59:41 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I wasted years readi..." with 🎯
 
01:02:25 Susanna Joy: There is a proverb in Islam: There are as many ways to God as there are breaths of His creatures.
 
01:02:34 Anthony: FYI it was college professors and lawyers who, from late scholasticism
through "reformation " and spirit of vatican 2 caused us so many problems. 
 
01:03:04 Susanna Joy: It is as simple as the next breath, to turn back to God.
 
01:12:57 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:40 Bob Cihak, AZ: The next book, we’ll be doing is “The Ascetical Homilies of Saint Isaac the Syrian, revised 2nd Edition” published by Holy Transfiguration Monastery, https://www.bostonmonks.com/product_info.php/products_id/635 .
 
01:14:24 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:14:25 David: Thank you Father David!
 
01:14:28 Jeff O.: Thank you!! Good to be with you all.
 
01:14:50 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XVII, Part I

The desert was a laboratory. The monks went into its depths precisely to push the limits of what they needed in order to sustain themselves; whether it be food, water or sleep. Therefore, we must not find ourselves put off by the stories that seem so extreme. Quite simply, they were extreme!
The desert being a laboratory, compelled the monks not only to evaluate their motives but also the restraint and measure that was necessary in order not to fall into extremes where they would hurt themselves physically or spiritually. Wisdom is hard won. The generations of monks who lived in the desert offer us a profoundly astute understanding of the human person, our needs, our motivations, and what strengthens or harm us in the spiritual life. 
They often learned through error. Sometimes their judgment or lack thereof was a source of profound humility. In the coming weeks, we will be presented with the greater wisdom and balance that began to emerge out of this lengthy experience.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:17:27 Jacqulyn: I'm from Oklahoma!
 
00:18:23 Anthony: Replying to "I'm from Oklahoma!" 
 
 Nice. I'm from Virginia
 
00:20:47 Jacqulyn: Reacted to "Nice. I'm from Virgi..." with 👍
 
01:16:46 Anthony: His weeping sounds like DaVinci who lamented not using God's gifts more, or like Cyrano de Bergerac who struggled to maintain honor.
 
01:17:11 Una McManus: What edition of the book are we using?
 
01:17:28 Una McManus: Can someone write it here? Thanks
 
01:17:42 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:18:57 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part VII

St. John draws us into the experience of stillness and its many fruits. It is a precious gift that comes to us by the grace of God and takes root in a heart prepared through years of asceticism and watchfulness. It is our waiting upon God. 
In many ways this sums up the vocation of the hermit/monk. But it also captures the essence of our life and the life of prayer. We are ever waiting upon God to act in our life and we seek to cultivate in our hearts a receptivity to his will and grace. This is the active life, the fulfillment of the vocation for the Hesychast and of all Christians. 
The temptations that come are always going to be things that draw one out of that stillness; loneliness, despondency, etc.  Whether monk or Christians in the world we must allow ourselves to remain within the crucible of stillness. When we feel lonely and isolated, when we are agitated, our tendency is to run to others or to things within the world. This crucible purifies the desire of our hearts and our faith. 
Are we able to give our will over to God? Can we trust that he will make of our lives that which endures to eternity? So often we are set upon fixing, undoing or changing the circumstances of our life that seem inconsistent with what is good or what will lead to a sense of fulfillment. However, when we long for God and when we turn to his love, we become free from being tossed about by the chaos of life. Our hearts find rest only in the Lord - He who is an eternal rock.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:03:46 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 229, #57
 
00:16:25 Ambrose Little, OP: Happy feast day, Fr. Charbel!
 
00:27:38 Erick Chastain: The rule of St Benedict even says that there is no eating outside of the communal mealtime. So those who follow the rule outside of the monastery can follow this too.
 
00:32:22 Anthony: Maybe it could be a person who entered this kind of life is not called to
it?
 
00:34:13 Art: My family has been out of the country for 2.5 weeks.  I’ve been trying to give myself a little taste of the solitary life from the little I know. I’m sure my attempt is laughable compared to monks, but I still found it hard!
 
00:34:14 Callie Eisenbrandt: Can this be related to like normal life? Separating yourself from the world work on your relationship with the Lord - It is difficult to find a "good" community with support - so how is one supposed to mimic this when they are in society
 
00:43:01 Una: Blessed name day, Fr. Charbel. Any books or sources of his teachings you can recommend?
 
00:45:11 Cindy Moran: This might seem nuts but I waited until God sent me a mate who loves Jesus more than me
 
00:45:51 Anthony: "Love is a Radiant Light" is, I believe,  a collection of St Charbel homilies
 
00:46:15 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "This might seem nuts..." with 🥰
 
00:47:15 Callie Eisenbrandt: Connect me Father! lol
 
00:49:11 Callie Eisenbrandt: haha thank you
 
00:51:00 Susanna Joy: A cruise / retreat would be good...count me in!
 
00:52:25 Anthony: In my experience, the torrents of unwelcome thoughts are a military maneuver to draw one's attention to the head and away from a still heart.
 
00:53:23 susan: for the sake of the 10 good men   God saved the city
 
00:54:22 Susanna Joy: Ok!
 
00:54:59 Susanna Joy: Mountains in Maine and prayerful company😊
 
00:55:08 Leilani Nemeroff: Agree about being trapped on a boat!
 
01:03:45 Susanna Joy: Crucible
 
01:12:44 Una: What chapter are we in?
 
01:13:10 Una: Thanks. I'm new
 
01:13:32 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Thanks. I'm new"
 
P. 230
 
01:13:44 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Thanks. I'm new"
 
#67
 
01:14:11 Nypaver Clan: Replying to "Thanks. I'm new"
 
😇
 
01:18:33 Nypaver Clan: God bless you on your Feast Day, Fr. Charbel!  🙏🏼
 
01:18:41 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:29 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:19:30 Jeff O.: Thank you Father, great to be with you all.
 
01:19:47 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father, wonderful session.
 
01:19:49 Ann’s iPad: God Bless you Father
 
01:19:56 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you! Happy name day!
 
01:20:03 Lilly (Toronto, CA): Book title?
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XVI, Part II

We picked up once again with the theme of “loving fasting.” The severity of the desert father’s practice of this discipline reveals that love. They discovered not only how essential the body is in the spiritual struggle to overcome attachment and the order of one’s desires towards God, but also that fasting brings a simplicity to one’s life.
We begin to realize that we need much less than we imagine. We are often tempted to think that we need to pamper the body so as not to become sick or weak. It is the regular practice of fasting, we must keep in mind, that teaches us to see the intimate connection between eating and Christ. He is the bread of life and also he who gives us living water to drink in abundance. Therefore, we are to eat in a thoughtful and contemplative fashion, and to make an explicit connection between eating and the Eucharist. In fact fasting and the Eucharist shape the way that we eat. We must attend to the body, but we must also allow the body to serve us spiritually. We discipline ourselves not to punish the body as something evil but to allow everything to be directed toward what satisfies the deepest longing of the human heart.
We are not promised happiness in this world, but rather the invincible, peace, joy, and love of the kingdom. Fasting is one element that helped the monks learn to hunger for what endures.
---
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:07:29 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 127, # 8
 
00:43:17 Bob Cihak, AZ: Is the Elder hastening his own death excessively?
 
00:48:25 Susanna Joy: When I was a girl, we fasted on bread and water on Fridays, but after awhile stopped bc virtue is harder to practice ...making it pointless if no charity is left
 
00:48:53 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "When I was a girl, w..." with 😩
 
00:51:15 Susanna Joy: Right! The regular habit is important and the combination with prayer
 
00:51:57 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Right! The regular h..." with 👍🏼
 
00:51:59 Maureen Cunningham: Holy Spirit will help
 
00:52:54 Forrest Cavalier: Is there a #16 that was skipped?
 
00:53:21 Cameron Jackson: Despondency. I can get how one can transcend Judas like despair. God is so good He can forgive all our sin but despair of life itself is another thing. I’m old, my money is running out, I can’t protect my family from ever present evil, etc. God doesn’t guarantee quality of life. How do you think this through? Life is suffering get used to it?!
 
00:56:40 Susanna Joy: Emerson
 
00:56:56 Susanna Joy: Most men lead lives of quiet desperation
 
00:58:33 David Fraley: I think that was Thoreau.
 
00:59:15 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "I think that was Tho..." with 👍🏼
 
01:01:28 Susanna Joy: Reacted to I think that was Tho... with "👍🏼"
 
01:08:10 Maureen Cunningham: How long did he live
 
01:14:54 Steve Yu: As a beginner, would one 16 hr fast a week be excessive?
 
01:15:00 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You , Blessing
 
01:15:31 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:15:35 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:35 Forrest Cavalier: Steve, start by skipping breakfast.
 
01:15:36 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father!
 
01:15:43 David Fraley: Thank you, Father.
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XV, Part IV and XVI, Part I

We continued our discussion of the fathers’ love for abstinence and fasting. While their feats seem amazing to us as well as how little food they needed to sustain themselves, the importance is what this love of these disciplines show us. They were not embraced simply as forms of discipline or endurance, but rather that which humbled the mind and the body. It is counterintuitive for all of those who live in times of great abundance to imagine that radically limiting both the amount and type of food that we eat could have such great significance for the spiritual life. At one point, the practices are compared to David slaying a lion in the protection of his flock. Fasting allows us to put our trust in God, and so becomes a weapon capable of slaying a far more fierce enemy. Similarly, David rushed out to do battle with Goliath with nothing but a sling and a few stones. Likewise, we rush out in battle, unencumbered by the things of this world caring with us the humble weapons of fasting and constant prayer.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:09:22 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 124, #5
 
00:12:09 David Fraley: Hello Father!
 
00:22:14 Maureen Cunningham: What  page
 
00:22:33 Lilly: Pg 125 #8
 
00:23:01 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
00:32:04 Adam Paige: gyrovagues
 
00:38:26 Bob Cihak, AZ: Waste not, Want not, Skinny not.
 
00:44:24 Adam Paige: "Prayer, mercy and fasting: these three are one, and they give life to each other. Fasting is the soul of prayer, almsgiving is the lifeblood of fasting. Let no one try to separate them; they cannot be separated." - St. Peter Chrysologus Sermo 43 (Office of Readings for Tuesday of the 3rd week of Lent)
 
00:47:54 Forrest Cavalier: In Hypothesis 16 there are stories of extreme fasting, some of which must be miraculous, but not without other imitations that are attested. There are several saints who lived multiple years only consuming Eucharist, including St. Catherine of Sienna and St. Joseph of Cupertino.
 
01:03:59 Rebecca Thérèse: Yes
 
01:14:53 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:57 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:15:33 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:15:55 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 
01:15:56 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 
01:16:01 Jennifer Ahearn: 🙏 thank you.
 
01:16:08 Mark: thank you father
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XV, Part III

The fathers often draw us along this mysterious path, the narrow path, that leads to the kingdom. They lead us, as it were, “where angels fear to tread.”  They show us in an unvarnished fashion how the path to Godly love and virtue passes through affliction. 
Yet, even that is too simplistic. It is the suffering heart, the heart crushed by prayer and the desire for God, that gives birth to virtue. One cannot have God sorrow and suffering if he does not first cherish the causes of these. 
It is here that we must pray for the illumination that comes through faith. For we are told fear of God and the reproof of one’s conscience give birth to this godly sorrow. Abstinence and vigil keep company with a suffering heart and strengthen it to remain upon this path. Gluttony in all of its forms gives rise to the bad blood of the passions, and drives out the influx of the Spirit. 
Thus, while we are young, we must learn to delight in what comes from the labor of compunction. If we do not, we will simply provoke confusion and callousness in the heart. We will be frustrated and lose our desire for God. Knowledge of God and the things of God do not reside in the hedonist; and the one who loves his body will not acquire the grace of God. 
There is a plethora of ways that we idolize the body and its needs. It is for this reason that we are given multiple stories of elders crushing the demons by their asceticism. They starve the demons by not allowing them to feed upon the disordered and the unholy desires that often dwell within our hearts. If a man spends his life in fasting, then his adversaries, the passions and the demons flee, enfeebled, from his soul.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:37:43 Kate : I think sometimes we can hesitate in the ascetical life due to an exaggerated fear of suffering.  I know I have felt this myself.  But when we begin to engage in ascetical practices there is a sweetness and joy and peace in making our way towards God.  It is not a sensible sweetness, but a deep interior sweetness.
 
00:38:51 Adam Paige: At church and Catholic home meetings, I'm constantly being offered food.. it's not always clear whether to accept hospitality or decline sometimes large amounts of food
 
00:44:25 Fr Marty, AZ, 480-292-3381: Besides wine, it sounds like that satiating our longing for God or restlessness to do God's will by overdoing anything: food, lust, entertainment, news, even complaining, can numb our sensitivity to not just the Holy Spirit's guidance, but even our ability to just be at rest with life we've been given and be
content during prayer.
 
00:44:45 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Besides wine, it sou..." with ❤️‍🔥
 
00:48:56 Forrest Cavalier: καὶ αὐτὸς. ποὺ ἀγαπᾷ τὸ σῶπα του
 
00:49:06 Forrest Cavalier: Agape love
 
00:53:21 Forrest Cavalier: It is the greek original of "he who loves his own body"
 
00:55:36 Anthony: I went to Italy and got some prayer cards from Naples and Calabria.  Some of them do not end prayer in "Amen" but "Cosi sià," which I take to mean "As He (the Lord) wills."
 
01:02:07 Fr Marty, AZ, 480-292-3381: Just as God wants us well fed in those things that keep us healthy, could it be that the devils have the strategy to starve us spiritually by glutting our appetites, and keep us from feeding on the Word of God or Body of Christ. It seems at times I've been starving on a full stomach. That even in great pleasure, I felt no love or joy..
 
01:05:52 Jennifer Ahearn: There is a term I just learned ‘simping’, in romantic relationships a male who is over attentive and submissive to a woman’s desire.  Only the blessings and God’s good pleasure to see his children fulfilled really satisfy the soul and strengthen the Sacrament.
 
01:06:14 Anthony: I'm preparing to move, and trying to follow St Charbel's advice, cutting out of my life books that I bought to be a somebody, a scholar, but really are so much extra weight - other than the one "jar" I should carry or am called to carry in life, for my vocation.
 
01:08:44 Ambrose Little, OP: Jim Gaffigan
 
01:08:51 Nypaver Clan: Jim Gaffigan?
 
01:09:12 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Jim Gaffigan" with 👍🏼
 
01:14:08 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 🙂Happy birthday🎂
 
01:14:14 Anthony: Auguri, Padre!
 
01:14:23 Adam Paige: Ad multos annos !
 
01:14:23 Steve Yu: Happy Birthday, Father!
 
01:14:24 Nypaver Clan: Birthday blessings
 
01:15:03 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father! Happy Birthday!
 
01:15:23 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father. Happy Birthday.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part VI

St. John Climacus once again gives us powerful images to help us understand the meaning of stillness and how it is to be protected. One such image is that of an eyelash that falls into the eye and creates irritation. The enemy of stillness is agitation; we are often driven to distraction by a concern for our physical and emotional well-being. Fear can create within us a kind of hypochondria. We become hypersensitive to our health and well-being. Unchecked, this fear can be become so excessive that it creates a massive neurosis that prevent us from trusting in the providence and promises of God. We no longer feel ourselves being drawn along by love or seeking to remain in that stillness in order that we might know intimacy with the beloved. Rather, we desperately push forward, driving ourselves to the point of exhaustion, seeking a worldly peace and security. 
However, in this we deprive ourselves of a childlike sense of wonder at the life and love the God has made possible for us. Therefore, as Christ tells us, we may not experience the kingdom even though it dwells within us because we are focused upon controlling our life and shaping our own identity. Once the simplicity is lost, it can lead to a kind of quiet desperation. Our hearts long for love from others and from God, but in the complexity that we have created and the thick hedge of responsibilities with which we surround ourselves, we lose faith and hope that such freedom can ever be ours again.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:03:18 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 228, #48
 
00:26:14 Anthony: Another issue is for one in involuntary solitude, having a desire for companionship goes out to fill the void
 
00:27:33 Anthony: This is a reason for excessive social media or tv or radio, and God's gifts are dissipated
 
00:30:57 Bob Cihak, AZ: The stutters are because you're reflecting as we go.
 
00:36:19 Anthony: Not to analyze the thoughts.  I've been surprised by horrid thoughts, and thereafter been so concerned about them, that concern brings them to mind.
 
00:47:15 Kate : It’s almost as if we don’t trust the grace of God.  We don’t trust the Providence of God and His Presence within the soul.
 
00:55:09 Susanna Joy: So true...believing the promise of God's everlasting goodness is key. Elizabeth said to Mary: Blessed is she who believed that the promise made by God would be fulfilled.
And it is true for all of us.
 
00:57:32 Lilly (Toronto, CA): Covid was a curse *and* a blessing, it brought Fr Abernethy to my life...I am so grateful 🙏
 
00:57:51 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "Covid was a curse *a..." with 🥰
 
00:57:57 Lilly (Toronto, CA): Reacted to "Covid was a curse *a…" with 🥰
 
00:58:40 Kevin Burke: Reacted to "Covid was a curse *a…" with 👌
 
01:03:55 Susanna Joy: Yes...wonder!
 
01:04:13 Greg C: It was a blessing to me as I began to read scripture much more deeply, and understand the Divine Liturgy with so much more love.
 
01:04:26 Susanna Joy: Reacted to It was a blessing to... with "❤️"
 
01:04:36 Susanna Joy: Reacted to Covid was a curse *a... with "❤️"
 
01:04:46 Greg C: Reacted to "Covid was a curse *a..." with ❤️
 
01:16:49 Susanna Joy: Jesus did say, unless you become like little children you cannot enter the kingdom of God.
 
01:19:21 Susanna Joy: Trust and Wonder.💗
 
01:19:58 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:20:08 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:08 Cindy Moran: My birthday is July 8...I will be thinking of you!
 
01:21:18 Sharon: Thank you!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XV, Part II

What is it that we are hungry for in this world? So many of the writings of the fathers can be reduced to this very question. What is the deepest desire of our hearts? What have we been created for and what satisfies the sense of incompleteness or the strange feeling of nostalgia within us? 
Because we have been created for God and find in Him our truest identity, we are going to experience ourselves as strangers in a strange world. We are made like everyone else and experience internal and external pressures to pursue what the world deems legitimate and of value. In the process, any thought of the future or the remembrance of God slips out of our minds. We become slaves not only to our bellies but to everything that we consume in an unthinking fashion. 
Abstemiousness and simplicity are not about lack but rather fullness. We must attend to the very real needs of the flesh but only as much as is required - and sometimes less. When we lose sight of God, our internal world is driven by anxiety and fear. We seek for security and to protect ourselves from want. What we find in the fathers, however, is not a starving of themselves, but rather the starving of the demons and what they nourish themselves upon. We engage in the ascetic life in order not to keep feeding the appetites and the passions that tie us to the world. 
This is no easy task. Rationalization and the illusion of joy and freedom keep us moving forward. However, these things (very much like rights and happiness) are very fragile. We think they are the norm but this is perhaps the great deception of our times. 
Our life has been given to us for repentance and we must not waste it. Life is a relationship; a constant turning towards God and who is constantly seeking us. Let us not grieve the Holy Spirit by seeking to quench our thirst for life and hunger for love other than in God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:11:09 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 118, para 2
 
00:17:20 Bob Cihak, AZ: Oops. P. 119, para 2
 
00:31:47 Cindy Moran: Usury
 
00:34:45 Cindy Moran: No cash allowed at Pirate game concessions
 
01:08:03 Jennifer Ahearn: Constant prayer, unceasing.  There is a Freedom for Excellence between deficit and excess
 
01:08:47 Jennifer Ahearn: FOMO😃
 
01:09:26 Jennifer Ahearn: Stay in the rhythm of The Church
 
01:10:56 Jennifer Ahearn: St. Philip Nero ‘if it is not leading to Christ, cut it out’.  Holy leisure is important.
 
01:11:24 Janine: You are 100% correct
 
01:12:01 Jennifer Ahearn: Neri
 
01:12:09 Paul G.: WE experience your teachings and get ntold blessings Father
 
01:12:24 Paul G.: Untold
 
01:12:39 Susanna Joy: Reacted to WE experience your t... with "❤️"
 
01:14:55 Lori Hatala: the things you share are shared with others and create a ripple effect of gratitude and thought provoking prayer.
 
01:15:00 Jennifer Ahearn: Constant prayer, unceasing.  There is a Freedom for Excellence between deficit and excess
 
01:16:40 Jennifer Ahearn: St Louis DeMontfort Consecration five years in a row in October changed my interior life and mind.
 
01:18:31 Forrest Cavalier: For me, reading https://archive.org/details/tolovefasting/ has been very eye opening that the practices noted in Evergetinos are not fantastical. He does write that those who live with others will need more nourishment. Monks less, Hermits even less.
 
01:19:51 Jennifer Ahearn: Yes!  Thank you so much, Fr. Charbel.  It is a constant reality ♥️🙏
 
01:20:13 Jennifer Ahearn: It is exciting ♥️🙏
 
01:21:14 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:16 Cameron Jackson: Thank you.
 
01:21:17 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:21:26 Kevin Burke: Thank You Father!
 
01:21:34 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 
01:22:22 Lorraine Green: !Thank you Fr., good luck with the move
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part V

There is a beautiful movement created in the heart by St. John’s writing; it is almost a dance. We move back-and-forth with St. John by simultaneously reflecting upon the beauty of silence and stillness and the intimacy that we experience with God through it - while also being shown what the loss of the silence does to us.
The silence of which St. John speaks is not just the absence of noise, but rather the presence of a love and life that transcends our understanding. It can only be experienced. Therefore, St. John holds out before us the intimacy for which our our hearts long and that can be found in the silence while also warning us of the dangers and the pitfalls that allow this great gift to slip through our fingers.
The more we become attentive to the interior life, the more we realize how easily we can be distracted; how our thoughts and feelings can be manipulated either by our own appetites or by demonic provocation. It has been said that “Hurry destroys both poets and Saints“. The frenetic activity that surrounds us agitates and fragments the mind and the heart. To live in such a state for a long period of time dulls one’s sensibilities not only to the finer things of life but to God himself. 
Thus, the preliminary task John tell us is disengagement from all affairs, whether reasonable or senseless. Both can be equally distracting to us. In fact, it’s often easier for us to recognize the inane things to which we direct our attention then it is to see how the responsibilities and demands that we have set for ourselves places us on a never-ending treadmill of activity of mind and body. 
And so let us simplify our lives. It does not take long for us to realize the gains of doing so. We begin to taste, perhaps for the first time, the sweetness of those things that endure.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:04:54 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 227, #41
 
00:37:54 David: OBS software?
 
00:40:41 Leilani Nemeroff: True, I stopped watching tv. It’s amazing how annoying it is when you’re exposed.
 
00:41:22 Cindy Moran: Most major movie trailers will have a cut every second.
 
00:43:15 Callie Eisenbrandt: Father- sometimes I feel guilty turning to the Jesus prayer when I'm feeling distracted or off track, like my mind isn't where it needs to be to be saying the prayer
 
00:44:16 Leilani Nemeroff: Yes, pronounced correctly!
 
00:44:26 Cindy Moran: The term for what you describe is called "jump cut"
 
00:44:41 Dave Warner (AL): Reacted to "The term for what yo..." with 👍
 
00:45:28 David: Something interest on OBS. We do educational conferences and if more than 15 seconds of silence passes we loose 15-20% of attendants. AHAD apparently has become a norm
 
00:45:32 Rebecca Thérèse: People are advised that their film clips should be no longer than 3 seconds otherwise people lose attention
 
00:50:11 Anthony: There's an Orthodox priest, Fr. Barnabas Powell, who says "you are not your thoughts." That really good when thoughts waylay a person like hoodlums.
 
00:50:38 David: I was taught to see it as waves coming in from the shore for the Jesus Prayer which really helps. It does have a soothing repetition that is similiar.
 
00:55:35 Maureen Cunningham: Human doing not being
 
00:55:37 Lori Hatala: Sometimes when saying the Jesus prayer I must say it slowly and loudly when having distracting thoughts until they subside.
 
00:57:31 Dave Warner (AL): Silence is also the domain of software programmers.
 
00:58:23 Anthony: In Lercara Friddi, Sicily the town was so silent in siesta that I could hear the pigeons cooing.
 
01:05:34 Jennifer Ahearn: Ineffable ‘internal journey’
 
01:07:34 David: God calls us by name the devil by our sin. We are not defined by our faults
 
01:08:43 Cindy Moran: I wrote in my Bible when I was 15 yrs old: "Even in my biggest mistake, I am not a mistake"
 
01:12:28 Kate : I find that the time I am most vulnerable to distraction is after receiving Holy Communion.  Sometimes the Jesus Prayer is the only thing I can grasp hold of, so as not to be swept away by the distractions.  It is quite a battle sometimes.
 
01:18:59 Rebecca Thérèse: Sometimes the parking lot is more conducive to prayer after communion than the church
 
01:19:09 Jacqulyn: Wow! 15 minutes... bring it on! :-)
 
01:19:23 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Blessing keep you in prayer Amen
 
01:19:37 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father!
 
01:19:38 Jennifer Ahearn: Thank you
 
01:19:38 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father very inspiring session!
 
01:19:41 David: Thank you father!
 
01:19:51 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you
 
01:19:51 Dave Warner (AL): Thank you Father - what a Blessing!
 
01:19:54 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XIV, and XV, Part I

Humility and affliction: Two words that often evoke within us intense fear and anxiety. We are formed by a kind of pathological self-love. The fathers understood our focus upon worldly things as a need to create a sense of security and identity. We desperately want to protect ourselves from hardship and from pain and so we surround ourselves as much as we can to distract ourselves from the reality of death or the presence of suffering in our lives and in the world.
 
It is not only external realities the drive us to this but also vainglory. In some sense our desperate need to protect our dignity and self-esteem can be greater than our bodily desires. We will fight desperately to keep ourselves from the experience of humiliation or to hold on to a position of emotional power in relationships. However, in all these things, we sacrifice true freedom, joy, and peace. For when we embrace our identity in Christ as sons and daughters of God, when we let go of our attachment to the things of this world, then we begin to experience a kind of invincible freedom and joy.
 
He who belongs to Christ has all; and whatever he loses within this world for the sake of Christ will be returned a hundredfold. What the fathers are trying to teach us is that while we suffer within this world we never suffer alone or in isolation. Our communion with Christ means that he is always present to us and that the crosses we bear only draw closer to him. The love of the kingdom is cruciform. Thus, to allow ourselves to be broken and poured out is to manifest that love in its perfection
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:08:55 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 115, "F"
 
00:10:08 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: Good evening everyone
 
00:11:53 Jessica Michel: Hello Father Charbel. Good Morning
 
01:10:05 Forrest Cavalier: I have read to 74 of “To Love Fasting” the point is very clear that gradually accepting discipline makes it easier to accept harder discipline. This can take years.
 
01:10:05 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father!
 
01:10:23 Forrest Cavalier: I meant page 74
 
01:14:40 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:15:10 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father Charbel.
 
01:15:20 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:27 Erick Chastain: thank you father charbel
 
01:15:27 Jessica Michel: Thank you
 
01:15:31 Cameron Jackson: Thank you.
 
01:15:33 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part IV

In pursuing life in Christ, the experience of reality is often turned on its head. Our perception of the world around us and the interior world is shaped and formed by so many forces and influences. In a counterintuitive fashion, we have to move in opposing directions to the things that satisfy our ego or the desires of the flesh. 
Needless to say this can be disconcerting. We may see ourselves as understanding the faith or as having grown in certain virtues only to have it dispersed in an instant by the light of God’s truth. Whether it is something small or great, we can see how far we are from the stillness of mind and body of which Saint John speaks. Indeed, St. John tells us that many of these things the common run of men will find quite alien to themselves.
We are often cast about on the sea of our emotions or blown like a reed in the wind. We struggle with a certain aberration of mind; that is, we are ever so inconstant and changeable in the way that we live our lives. If one does not acknowledge this and struggle throughout the years to purify the heart, then to enter into the life of solitude and stillness can only lead to derangement. 
If what guides us is not the humble love and desire to give ourselves over completely to Christ then we are going to be fragmented internally by the most fierce passions. Anger will increase and even the memories of past wounds within the mind can fuel our resentment and drive us to the brink of madness. The person who enters into stillness well is completely unruffled by the chaos that exist in our world and becomes abstracted from the things that take hold of other peoples imagination as having great value. For the hesychast, however, there is only Christ!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:06:08 Greg C: Father, is that still Step 27?  I missed last week.
 
00:06:16 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: page 226 paragraph 32
 
00:06:24 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: yes.  Step 27
 
00:06:33 Greg C: Thank you!
 
00:09:50 Bob Cihak, AZ: Will our next book be Ascetical Homilies of St. Isaac the Syrian, by Holy Transfiguration Monastery?
 
00:10:14 Adam Paige: Reacted to "                    …" with ☦️
 
00:25:08 Art: Where can a lay person obtain a basic rule to follow, to grow with, and progress in?
 
00:27:19 Adam Paige: https://store.melkite.org/product/publicans-prayer-book/
 
00:27:49 Art: Reacted to "https://store.melkit..." with 👍
 
00:40:04 Cindy Moran: also " to make sublime "
 
00:56:28 Fr Marty, AZ: Being with people who push my buttons, seems to me, to be one of God’s most common ways of showing me what He wants to heal in me. Metropolitan Vlachos, with his priests in mind, once wrote a book on the healing found in the Desert Fathers. He admitted that they had a good academic study of theology, but he lamented that they did not know how to lead their flocks into healing because they had not gone down the path to their own healing. His remark in the book was, “Theology…is the fruit of a man’s healing.”
 
01:01:20 Ren Witter: That day, I might have gotten a message from Fr. Charbel saying he was going into permanent seclusion 😂
 
01:01:57 Julie’s iPad: St Diadochos taught:  “ Just as, when the doors of the baths are left continually open,the heat inside is quickly driven out,so also the soul, when it wishes to say many things, even though everything that it says may be good, disperses its concentration through the door of the voice”.
 
01:12:45 David: 😀
 
01:13:00 Greg C: 😁
 
01:13:13 Fr Marty, AZ: :)
 
01:13:26 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...excellent session.
 
01:13:27 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:13:32 David: Thank you father!
 
01:13:33 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:13:40 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XIII, Part II

Only the most stalwart and patient of souls can follow along with this evening’s readings without being troubled. Once again it is repeated for us that our life is to be one of constant repentance; that is, turning toward God. Systematically the fathers break down every illusion that we might have about ourselves as having no need of such repentance. Even if we fulfill the work of the day, our response must be like the servants in the gospel: “we are unworthy and have only fulfilled what is our duty.” 
Our state of mind can only be that of gratitude for the gift of God’s mercy and grace. He has bestowed upon us an abundance of love despite the fact that we have often, as the scriptures tell us, treated him as “enemies”. Indeed our infidelity and the depths to which it reaches eludes are perception. 
Even our growth in virtue should instill within us a greater urgency for this repentance.  Growth shows previous inadequacy and negligence. We cannot be prideful or glorious about what we achieve; acknowledging that it is but a pale shadow of the love that God has bestowed upon us. 
Such an attitude also leads us to a deeper understanding of the need to embrace affliction. The gospel does not promise the security of this world or its comforts. In fact, just the opposite. To live for God, to embody the beatitudes is to find ourselves scorned and mocked by the world. The narrow way that leads to the kingdom passes inevitably through Calvary.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:06:45 Bob Cihak, AZ: P. 112, 3rd paragraph
 
00:25:55 Lilly: What page are we on?
 
00:26:11 Lilly: Thank you
 
00:58:49 Kate : Father,
I am thinking about the Sacrament of Penance.  My experience has been very legalistic and not really focused on this repentance, this turning towards of God that you are speaking about.  Do you have any recommendations on how to prepare for Confession that would be focused on this kind of repentance?
 
01:02:47 Lilly: I personally found the Eastern sacrament of penance humiliating-in a good way-as we are face to face with the priest, and depending on the father has us under his mantle and full body prostration
 
01:07:39 Forrest Cavalier: O Lord, I believe and profess that you are truly Christ, the Son of the living God, who came into the world to save sinners of whom I am the first.
 
Accept me today as a partaker of your mystical supper, O Son of God, for I will not reveal your mystery to your enemies, nor will I give you a kiss as did Judas, but like the thief I profess you:
 
          Remember me, O Lord, when you come in your kingdom.
          Remember me, O Master, when you come in your kingdom.
          Remember me, O Holy One, when you come in your kingdom.
 
01:07:50 Forrest Cavalier: May the partaking of your holy mysteries, O Lord, be not for my judgment or condemnation but for the healing of soul and body.  
 
O Lord, I also believe and profess that this, which I am about to receive, is truly your most precious body and your life-giving blood, which, I pray, make me worthy to receive for the remission of all my sins and for life everlasting.  Amen.
 
          O God, be merciful to me, a sinner.
          O God, cleanse me of my sins and have mercy on me.
          O Lord, forgive me for I have sinned without number.
 
01:08:25 Forrest Cavalier: From https://parma.org/prayer
 
01:15:32 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you Father Blessing
 
01:15:44 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father
 
01:15:48 Cameron Jackson: Thank you
 
01:16:02 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part III

What possibly could hesychasm or the life of hesychasts - those who live in perpetual stillness and prayer -  mean for those who living in the world; for all of those surrounded by a constant stream of noise and distraction?The answer is everything! Though few are called to this manner of life, all are destined to experience the fullness of its joy and sweetness in Christ in the kingdom. We have been made sons and daughters of God and the very Spirit of Love dwells within our hearts. 
What moves us to emulate the fathers in their discipline, to seek what they seek, must be the same desire. Our experience of Christ, our drawing close to him through prayer, the sacraments, and the scriptures must kindle within us an urgent longing for what He alone can provide. 
Those who love the things of the world do not see the pursuit of them as being extreme. Why is it when it comes to seeking the One who offers us perfect Life and Love that we become self-conscious; that we begin to worry about what others may think of us or how they might treat us? Why is this true even though Christ tells us that we should expect to be hated all by all because of His name? The Hesychast becomes the image of one who adds fire to fire. Having tasted the sweetness of Divine Love, he is willing to sell all to possess it. Gradually he becomes prayer and his life - a sacrifice of praise. In this he becomes like unto the angels.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:29:15 Michael Hinckley: what you are talking about reminds me of St Thomas' straw comment.
 
00:32:04 Nick Bodmer: I believe it was Sartre
 
00:32:20 Michael Hinckley: "other people" came from that play no exxt?
 
00:32:25 Michael Hinckley: exit
 
00:32:32 Nick Bodmer: Yes, No Exit
 
00:32:47 Susan M: YES IT WAS SARTRE
 
00:32:56 Michael Hinckley: On the feast of St. Nicholas [in 1273, Aquinas] was celebrating Mass when he received a revelation that so affected him that he wrote and dictated no more, leaving his great work the Summa Theologiae unfinished. To Brother Reginald’s (his secretary and friend) expostulations he replied, “The end of my labors has come. All that I have written appears to be as so much straw after the things that have been revealed to me.” When later asked by Reginald to return to writing, Aquinas said, “I can write no more. I have seen things that make my writings like straw.”
 
00:55:18 Rebecca Thérèse: It made a big difference to me when I was talking to a Catholic priest and I realised that he really believed what he was saying. That was one of the main things that informed my decision to become Catholic having previously been Anglican.
 
00:57:13 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "It made a big differ..." with 🥰
 
01:01:20 Michael Hinckley: need to drop This Holy Priest is living much of what is mentioned here. He is part time hermit and fun to watch https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLIcePO_eJb28EWIw68kBQMew0vMZydwj1
 
01:07:28 Kate : It seems like he is giving us an examination of conscience when he lists the different places on the ladder.
 
01:08:11 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "It seems like he is ..." with 👍🏼
 
01:11:41 Andres Oropeza: What if you suffer from despondency but the common life isn’t an
option and yet the battle rages around you, or even if you aren’t alone but the people with you can’t offer what’s needed? Should we not pursue stillness by cutting out distractions, focus on prayer and fasting etc. or temper it in some way?
 
01:19:58 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:20:05 Jeff O.: Thank you!! Great to be with you all.
 
01:20:09 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XIII, Part I

We picked up this evening with Hypothesis 13 on the subject of keeping Vigil and not giving oneself over to excessive sleep. However, as we immersed ourselves in the reading, we began to see the father guiding us into something much deeper.  The teaching on keeping vigil is a bridge to talking about Repentance. 
We were presented with the most beautiful understanding of the path the Christ guide us upon. There is a radical simplicity about it that is meant to cut through our tendency to turn the faith into something that is complex and impossible to understand. Repentance is not confined to particular times and deeds, but is put into practice to the extent that the commandments of Christ are fulfilled. The struggle for it is continuous until death. 
The kingdom of Heaven is at hand!  This is our path! It is the constant turning toward God that draws us forward, transforms us, and allows us to comprehend the things of the kingdom. This forsaking of self and sin is the oil of our lamps and each person will reveal who he is from this lamp. His own, not another’s!  It is filled and the light kindled by the practice of virtue. 
In fact, we are told that if we fail to live this and proclaim it to the world both in word and deed, we annul all that we do because we forget and do not take into account death. Our entire life is to be a striving to enter by the narrow gate, to walk the path of repentance - the dying to self and the rising to new life in Christ
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:07:23 Fr. Charbel Abernethy: Hypothesis XIII page 108
 
00:23:19 Lori Hatala: Like a soldier.
 
00:25:31 Adam Paige: To Love Fasting (pdf) https://archive.org/details/tolovefasting
 
00:26:22 Dave Warner (AL): Reacted to "To Love Fasting (pdf..." with 👍
 
00:30:55 Steve Yu: Reacted to "To Love Fasting (pdf…" with 👍
 
01:12:51 Lorraine Green: Thank you Fr.!
 
01:12:56 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father
 
01:13:02 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:04 Steve Yu: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:25 Jessica Michel: Thank you Father
 
01:13:46 Lori Hatala: or a date
 
01:14:11 Rebecca Thérèse: Can you set it up so you have a choice of oldest first or most recent first? YouTube channels have this option for example
 
01:14:30 Cameron Jackson: Thank you. 
Very grateful.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part II

It’s hard to imagine ourselves as being nourished upon stillness and silence. Yet, this is exactly what the fathers and St. John Climacus seek to teach us. Stillness allows us to have an experiential knowledge of intimacy with God - an encounter with Mystery.  When we have shut the door to the senses, when we stilled our mouth from constant chatter and when we have shut the gate of the heart to demonic powers, it is then that we become prayer and gaze upon the Lord face-to-face. Our petitions, our needs and sorrows are written with love and zeal. 
We are to become an earthly image of an angel, whose prayer has not only been freed from sloth and negligence, but even from a kind of self-consciousness. The heart is ever ready for the Lord and His approach; and even if the body should sleep, the heart is awake and awaiting the beloved. 
Therefore, stillness is not only about being quiet, but rather it is a path to intimacy. The greater one’s love grows, the more passionate one becomes in their desire for God - everything on the periphery fades away and we see only our Lord.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:09:13 Fr. Charbel: page 223 no 11
 
00:24:18 Kate : “What more do you want, 0 soul! And what else do you search for outside, when within yourself you possess your riches, delights, satisfactions, fullness, and kingdom - your Beloved whom you desire and seek? Be joyful and gladdened in your interior recollection with Him, for you have Him so close to you. Desire Him there, adore Him there. Do not go in pursuit of Him outside yourself. You will only become distracted and wearied thereby, and you shall not find Him, nor enjoy Him more securely, nor sooner, nor more intimately than by seeking Him within you.” St John of the Cross
 
00:30:42 Rebecca Thérèse: Can the Holy Spirit shine light on the soul directly, for example if there is no suitable spiritual director or if there are people actively trying to corrupt and mislead the soul?
 
00:39:08 Nypaver Clan: Is it healthy to have a spiritual director who becomes ones “best friend”?  Where are the boundaries to be set for a spiritual director?
 
00:41:54 Rachel: Yes, it jeopardizes their capacity to love, purely. As we cannot love purely with a gaze directed towards self or creatures
 
00:43:40 Rachel: it reduces the capacity to see God in the other and the only way a priest can help another or lay people help another is to first know God, to seek God and the ultimatele friendship in God, " I call you friends"
 
01:08:00 Fr Marty, AZ: I wanted to add to spiritual direction discussion. Everything that was said about spiritual directors is important. Boundaries and confidentiality are needful and we’re also meant to grow in detachment; that’s part of hesychasm. Nonetheless, this doesn’t mean without care and affection. I’ve been close to spiritual directors, especially after ten or fifteen years of direction. And I’ve also became good friends of their other spiritual children. In a detached way, we had joy, love, and openness, but still my spiritual directors were not friends.  And boundaries were still maintained. And when we’ve buried them, the other spiritual children fondly remembered their care for us. On the other hand, I once asked a friend who is an exceptional spiritual director to be mine but it didn’t work out.
 
01:10:09 Eric Ewanco: I observe that stillness and silence plays a central role in the desert fathers, but I don't recall it being discussed in Scripture. Is this based on experience and tradition, or is it rooted in something in Scripture?
 
01:13:31 Greg C: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:38 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:44 Jennifer Ahearn: Thank you.
 
01:13:48 Lori Hatala: Happy Birthday
 
01:14:27 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father.
 
01:14:35 Jeff O.: Thank you! Great to be with you all.
 
01:14:38 Nypaver Clan: A blessed birthday, Mrs. A.!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XII, Part I

We picked up this evening with Hypothesis 12. The subtitle is on avoiding idle talk. However, this does not do justice to what we are given in the text. It is revealed to us how we are to kindle within our hearts the fire of love for God that then gives rise to a holy sacrifice of praise. 
Thus, the greatest thing that we can give God is to emulate the angels who praise Him without ceasing. Our love for the Lord should give rise to an urgent longing within the heart to call out to Him constantly and without distraction. 
Likewise, when we pray in common, we are to be attentive to the fact that we are responsible for the attentiveness of those around us and seek to preserve their focus. We do not pray or chant in an individualistic fashion but again imitate the angels in crying out to the Lord with one voice of love. 
What a blessing monks are for the church. The fathers tell us that Christ perfects the praise of infants; that is, he prefects the prayer of the monk in his innocence and childlike simplicity. It is through this humble prayer and sacrifice of praise that the demons are conquered. What makes this even more powerful is that it is often done hidden from the eyes of the world. Such prayer is offered without pride or self-consciousness. Rather it rises unimpeded to the very throne of God on behalf of all.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:46:55 Forrest Cavalier: Since you mentioned the comment of the monk, I was thinking that every vocation is "impossible". Hence the need for grace.
 
01:06:33 Lorraine Green: Thank you!
 
01:07:05 Lisa Smith: Thank you Fr. And God bless you.🙏
 
01:07:26 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVII: On Stillness of Mind and Body, Part I

St. John Climacus brings us now to discuss the fruits of the ascetic life. We picked up this evening with Step 27 on “stillness of mind and body”. John is very hesitant to approach such a subject. He does not want to distract the warrior from the task at hand; that is, those who are engaged in the spiritual warfare against the passions and the provocations of the evil one.  He only relents because he understands how important it is to see the goal of the spiritual life so that it might increase our desire for God and our detachment from the things of the world. 
Holy stillness emerges when the Nous, the eye of the heart, has become impenetrable and undistracted by the noise of the world. The disordered passions have now become a purified and single passion or desire for God. The love of and immersion in silence deepens because it is there that God speaks a Word that is equal to Himself. The language of Love, beyond words, begins to well up from within - united to the Spirit that cries out with groans that are beyond our understanding. 
St. John acknowledges that many will not perceive or grasp the holy violence of the Hesychast; that is, the radical turning away from the things of the world in order to turn completely toward God. This turning toward God, however, does not limit our vision or comprehension as those who are worldly often believe. Rather, it opens us up to an experience of infinite mystery of God himself; everlasting Life and Love.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:16 FrDavid Abernethy: page 221
 
00:06:30 FrDavid Abernethy: Sept 27 On Holy Stillness
 
00:36:18 Anthony: How do we relate, then to people like I have met, pagan Hindus and a Muslim, who also appeared to me to have this spirit of peace?
 
00:41:16 Rachel: Yes!!
 
00:41:32 Rachel: Saint Charles de Foucald
 
00:41:55 Rachel: Algeria
 
00:42:05 Rachel: same as St. Charles De Foucald
 
00:43:55 David: O Gods and Men is the movie
 
00:44:25 David: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt1588337/
 
00:45:06 David: The original is French Des Hommes et des dieux
 
00:47:14 Jeff O.: When I was Nepal, the Christians would, instead of greeting with “namaste” greet with the phrase “J’amasee” - “I honor Christ (and his work) in you.” I thought that was a beautiful way to greet people with the honor and love of seeing Christ in the other…
 
00:49:17 Rachel: This happens in iconography as well/
 
00:49:31 Anthony: Reacted to This happens in icon... with "👍"
 
00:49:41 Rachel: Or I should say, sacred art as opposed to iconogrpahy
 
00:53:09 Rachel: I am not criticizing either but making a distinction when someone thinks that" abstraction" in iconography is simplified, yet, it is the overly realistic and naturalistic emphasis on every line that detracts from the mystery that is being revealed before us.
 
00:58:22 Rachel: Oh my goodness. That is so beautiful. Thank you for sharing.
 
01:00:03 Anthony: Reacted to When I was Nepal, th... with "👍"
 
01:01:09 Maureen Cunningham: Did Father Damion who lived among the leaders in Hawaii
 
01:01:27 Anthony: Replying to "I am not criticizing..." 
 
 Compare the "naive" ...
 
01:02:17 Maureen Cunningham: He would go on a boat to and yell his confessions. I was told
 
01:02:44 David: https://www.imdb.com/title/tt0165196/
 
01:11:26 David: Theology without practice is the theology of demons- Maximus the Confessor
 
01:14:34 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Father
 
01:15:02 David: Thank you father!
 
01:15:02 Jennifer Ahearn: Thank you
 
01:15:05 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:15:05 Jeff O.: thank you!
 
01:15:19 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank yu
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XI, Part III

As we conclude Hypothesis 11, we are given very solid food to nourish our understanding of the nature of prayer and our demeanor. How is it that we are called to worship God, to pray the psalms, and what is our demeanor to be following that worship? 
A kind of liturgical asceticism must guide and direct our prayer and piety. Even the way that we pray and celebrate the liturgy, and one might say especially here, must allow the grace of God to guide and direct us. As always, Christ is the standard and the model. It is his humility, silence, obedience to God that must form and shape the way that we approach the altar and the manner in which we listen to the word of God. 
We must pray in a manner fosters patience and that allows us to listen with the spirit of contrition. We gather before God not to alter our emotional state or to create an experience that simply elevates the mind. We come before God to offer him a sacrifice of praise and that sacrifice is the fullness of our self. We are to be completely given over to him in such way that we withhold nothing from Him and are capable of receiving everything He desires to give us. 
Very few in our day think of worship in this fashion. May God give us the grace to offer him all that we have and are; for in seeking what He desires, God bestows upon us more than the mind in the heart can imagine.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:21:49 susan: after MASS i have to go to my car to pray!
 
00:48:07 Carol Roper: it seems that the caution is against performing, vanity, pleasure seeking, even in liturgy. one's motivation must be examined carefully i imagine
 
00:52:59 Anthony: Let Us Build the City of God.....they still sing it.  Sigh.  Are you TRYING to get me to change rites?
 
01:02:16 Rebecca Thérèse: a bruised reed he will not break and a dimly burning wick he will not quench
 
01:02:17 Carol Roper: oppressed and afflicted, yet he opened not his mouth, like a lamb led to the shearers
 
01:04:52 Dave Warner (AL): A bruised reed He will not break - Isa 42:3
 
01:05:17 Rebecca Thérèse: Isaiah 42:3 Matthew 12:20
 
01:16:22 Lisa Smith: Thank you & God Bless you.
 
01:16:36 Cameron Jackson: Thank you
 
01:17:19 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:26 Dave Warner (AL): Thank you Father!
 
01:17:27 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part IX

We come to the end of Step 26 on Discernment and in doing so we begin to see, or at least get a glimpse of, its importance for the spiritual life. So often sin distorts are perception of reality. It prevents us from seeing with clarity both the dignity and the blessings that come from being a son or daughter of God, baptized into Christ - as well as preventing us from seeing the darkness of sin. 
Christ tells us in the gospel that when the eye has been darkened completely, how great is the darkness! When the eye of the heart, the eye of the soul is darkened by sin then all that we see is the world before us in its most basic form. We see it as an object of consumption or we covet the things that we do not possess. 
In this we can become more like beasts who walk on all fours with their eyes cast down to the earth. It is discernment that allows us to see the glory of God in Christ Jesus. In the end, discernment gives rise to the acquisition of love - that is to say, the perfect dwelling of God.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:13:56 David: Father Mike Schmidt and neuroplasticity as well say with defects to right out the story or triggers. What leads to what and one often fines one needs to focus on the triggers and write a different story.
 
00:16:18 David: Like a dog returning to vomit. Can't get that out of my head now
 
00:27:38 Wayne: Very timely as suicide is being offered as an option if one finds their suffering overwhelming.
 
00:29:07 David: In one of my darkest times and despair I realized I had belief but no faith
which is tied with hope. Now I just think what am I to learn from this situation and it will pass.
 
00:34:33 Anthony: There is a particularly horrible thought: curse God and die
 
00:35:00 Anthony: That cuts at rather suffering soul's very hope
 
00:48:47 Anthony: Father, remember cooking and baking are arts, to be done well...like the Cathdral of Monreale.  😉  but yeah, I get you. 😀
 
00:52:27 Maureen Cunningham: Christ dwell with in us when we gather we bring  the body of Christ together
 
00:52:48 David: I think it got worse after COVID few shake hands and it seems there is little small talk.
 
00:57:58 Anthony: I've studied heresies and heretics for years. I observe that along with with religious differences  - maybe preceding them - is a break in communion or a lack of peace: nationalism or personal trauma
 
01:10:51 Susanna Joy: My heart is still back at the dog and the priest...
 
01:10:57 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:11:00 Andrew Adams: Great class tonight! Thank you, Father!
 
01:11:02 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:11:46 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...excellent session!
 
01:11:48 David: God Bless thank you Father David!
 
01:11:49 Art: Thank you
 
01:11:50 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:11:58 Sheila Applegate: Thanks Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis XI, Part II

All that we do is to be touched by the grace of God, shaped by it, and perfected by it. This includes our virtues, and also the manner in which we pray. 
Psalmody has always been apart of the prayer tradition of the church and in particular of the monastics. The psalms capture within them both the adversities and the joys that we experience in this world. It is the most important thing that we can do as human beings; to seek to God and offer a sacrifice of praise. 
Therefore, the monks are very careful to allow their prayer to be guided by God. We can be willful even in the fashion that we pray and sing. This is also true in the times that we set for prayer for ourselves. For example, the monks prayed many times a day together; emphasizing that they are part of the body of Christ. We do not pray as individuals, but always aware of the radical communion that exists not only with God but with one another. 
Thus, we find among the fathers an emphasis upon praying and singing while remaining conscious of what is going on within their hearts. We do not want to fall into distraction or lead others into it. Simplicity and humility should be the mark of worship; that which guides us in order that what we sing and pray is reflective of the reality within our hearts and our desire for God. Once again, we are presented with a kind of liturgical asceticism. Liturgy shapes the interior life and the interior life shapes the way that we pray.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:42:45 Lori Hatala: I have heard psalms chanted in different melodies. Is the melody of the chant relevant?
 
00:54:21 Tracey Fredman: Agreed, even if you do not have the time for a whole weekend at a monastery, even a visit while monks are at prayer can be life-altering.
 
00:55:06 Tracey Fredman: It can alter our prayer life, is what I mean.
 
00:55:41 Susanna Joy: Beautifully said...discipline is a silent "word" back to God
 
01:11:07 Wayne: If you have the opportunity to attend Matins or Vespers in the Eastern churches, the changing can have a very positive affect on you.
 
01:13:40 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:48 Edgard Riba: Thank you!
 
01:13:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙏🙂
 
01:13:56 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part XIII

Every week it is as if we are diving into living waters that renew and refresh the soul. This is particularly true of step 26 on Discernment and St. John’s summary towards its conclusion. So often as is true with the Fathers, St. John makes use of concrete and colorful imagery to capture for us the nature of the spiritual life and in this case discernment. 
What one gathers in so many of the teachings is that Faith involves seeing; a pulling back of the veil that allows us to see with perfect clarity the love and the mercy of God. St. John describes the many things that hobble us in that regard: Avarice, pride, attachment to our appetites and desire for the things of this world. It also describes the things that sharpen that vision and open us up to receive the gift of faith. Our pursuit of the virtues, and of the truth in our life lays the foundation to receive the greater gift of eternal Truth. This kind of seeing is not passive but rather involves the whole self. The deepest part of ourselves, the Nous, must be purified by Grace and asceticism so no impediment prevents us from moving toward God. The Nous becomes the “helmsman” then to lead us through the rough waters of this world.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:12:54 FrDavid Abernethy: page 219 number 42
 
00:49:30 Lisa Smith: It reminds me of the verse where Christ asked if there would be faith in the end time.
 
00:51:43 Wayne: How do you respond to the remark I am spiritual but not religious?
 
00:58:48 Lisa Smith: Thoughts on church attendance? I'm struggling with this presently. I'm not Catholic, but I'm interested in this faith. Thank you Fr.
 
01:00:34 Lisa Smith: 🙏 Thank you
 
01:03:14 Cindy Moran: Teilhard de Chardin comes to my mind as an example.
 
01:03:40 Cindy Moran: Too complicated
 
01:15:07 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:10 sprou: did you see that a blind woman Dafne Gutierrez was healed by St
Charbel?
 
01:15:12 Lisa Smith: God bless you Fr. Thanks for sharing
 
01:15:51 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:02 Jeff O.: Thank you! Great to be with you all.
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis X, Part III and Hypothesis XI, Part I

The focus of the Evergetinos this evening was on praying the psalms. However, as always with the writings of the fathers, the focus isn’t simply on the external actions, but the meaning of them. How do we pray as members of the body of Christ? Is there a kind of liturgical asceticism that must match our bodily asceticism?  What is the measure of our prayer? In other words, as those who live in a spirit of repentance and seek purity of heart, how do these realities shape the way we pray. 
The fathers this understood very well our tendency to focus on externals and that we can fall back into a modern day Pharisaism. We can be satisfied with the appearance of religiosity while giving scant attention to what God has revealed to us and the life that he has called us to embrace. Whenever this happens, it not only weakens our capacity to bear witness to Christ but it can undermine the life of the Church as a whole. If our hearts are fragmented by our sin this will manifest itself or be mirrored in liturgy. And when this takes place the entire culture around us - as well as within the church - can collapse. 
It’s a sobering presentation, but something that afflicts the Church in every generation. If the Evil One is going to attack the Church, he is going to attack it at its heart; that is, how we pray.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:25:00 Kate : There’s also the Little Office of the Blessed Virgin Mary which is very suitable for the laity.
 
00:25:13 Vanessa: Reacted to "There’s also the Lit..." with ❤️
 
00:25:22 Adam Paige: Reacted to "There’s also the Lit..." with ❤️
 
00:39:40 iPad (2): That is a wonderful book and he also has a podcast series on the book
 
00:50:47 Rod Castillo: The Endarkenment
 
00:54:30 Bob Cihak: Reacted to "The Endarkenment" with 👍
 
00:57:03 Maureen Cunningham: Oh no
 
00:57:07 Vanessa: Lol
 
01:04:40 Kate : Our family has witnessed many a liturgical battle which seemed good and urgent at the time, only to realize that God has been lost in the battle.  The battle took center stage, and striving for holiness took back stage.
 
01:14:53 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you It is wonderful .
 
01:15:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:54 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father.
 
01:16:22 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:17:13 Maureen Cunningham: Wonderful choice I trust. The lord is leading you as the Captain of the ship in the studies
 
01:17:26 Vanessa: Reacted to "Wonderful choice I t..." with 👍
 
01:17:47 Maureen Cunningham: Where would we find the book
 
01:17:54 Lorraine Green: Thank you, Father, God bless!  The Divine Office talks sound very good too.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part XII

As St. John draws us forward with these simple sayings about discernment and its fruit, we begin to see the immeasurable beauty of the ascetic life and the action of God’s grace. The life that God calls us to is not one of frenetic activity but rather the cultivation of purity of heart and humility in order that He might act within us. We do not seek simply freedom from sin but rather the life of the kingdom. It is the love, the virtue, the goodness of Christ that transforms the world. It is our entrance into the Paschal Mystery, the dying and rising of the spiritual life (with and in Christ), that makes the love of the kingdom present to the world. 
The life of the hesychasts, the ascetics who set all aside for Christ, is at the very heart of the church. When we lose sight of their love and desire for God, the church grows cold.  It is in the spirituality of the desert that the church will find renewal; when the minds and the hearts of men and women are open to the beauty of the life that God has called us to by His Grace.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:37:24 Anthony: In a way, some of the response to church scandal has been like an ill- guided peasants crusade.
 
00:39:35 Anthony: The peasants crusade led to harm for thr peasants
 
00:54:23 sprou: does solitude equal spiritual warfare?
 
00:55:33 David: I liked what Bishop Barron said about love being willing the good of the other. (St. John Paul) but first one needs to know what the good is and what is truth.
 
00:56:03 Vanessa: Reacted to "I liked what Bishop ..." with 👍
 
00:56:58 Jeff O.: I’ve often wondered about the connection between the cultivation of
hesychia and Paul’s admonition to stand in Ephesians 6…it seems there’s some sort of relationship there as it relates to warfare
 
00:57:01 David: This was in response to a lot of virtue signaling and some of the strange things in our culture.
 
01:04:43 Kate : A priest told me that hesychia is a form of quietism.  His comment confused me, and I did not know how to reply.
 
01:06:47 Anthony: Uh oh, Palmas vs Barlaam again..... 😉
 
01:08:39 David: In Latin America it is common with quasi liberation theology priest and lay
people to call them navel gazers but this is just seeing the outside aspect not understanding what is being developed. I always call the fathers the intranauts boldly going to the root of our condition.
 
01:13:18 David: Holiness attracts and people seek what they feel and see in joy and peace of others. N
 
01:13:32 Vanessa: Reacted to "Holiness attracts an..." with ❤️
 
01:13:51 Vanessa: Really enjoying class tonight. Lots of good discussion.
 
01:14:25 Kate : Father, prior to listening to these classes and discovering the Fathers, my ladder was propped against the wrong wall for years…as you stated earlier.  These classes and the Fathers have so transformed my interior life.   I have only begun to understand the love of God.
 
01:15:04 Nick Bodmer: Jesus even rebuked Martha because she was discontent that Mary was not being "worldly enough" in her eyes.  The spiritual life was established even while Jesus was still with us.
 
01:21:40 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:51 cmoran: Thank you, Father!
 
01:21:53 Lisa Smith: Thank you God bless you
 
01:22:29 Andrew Adams: Thank you, Father! Praying for you!
 
01:22:33 Jeff O.: Thank you! Blessing to be with you all.
 
01:22:41 David: Thank you father will pray for you!
 
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part XI

We continued with St. John’s summary of discernment and its particular fruit in the spiritual life. However, it does not read like a summary. Each saying opens us up to a divine reality and a participation in the life of Christ that comes to us by grace and the ascetic life. One cannot help but be captivated by the beauty of what St. John describes. It becomes evident that what we are being drawn into is the very beauty of Christ and that of the kingdom. Grace has the capacity to transform even the darkest of things within us and to illuminate the mind and the heart to see clearly what has eternal value. With the reading of each saying one begins to experience a holy desire growing within the heart. Thanks be to God!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:34 FrDavid Abernethy: page 217 page 14
 
00:25:57 Anthony: He says this while I'm making dinner....
 
00:31:19 David: Despair is suffering without meaning- Victor Frankl
 
00:49:34 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "Κλίμαξ αγίου Ιωάννου.LadderClimatuspdf" with ❤️
 
00:49:43 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "TheLadderofDivineAscent.pdf" with 👍
 
00:50:29 Lisa Smith: Reacted to "TheLadderofDivineAscent.pdf" with 🙏
 
00:57:24 David: The gate also opens like Grace and one needs to be drawn to the opening in the fence.
 
01:02:59 Anthony: If our hearts condemn us, God is greater than our hearts....
 
01:20:11 David: They are finding so much in neuroplasticity that the fathers described ages ago. One the pathways are established it becomes a cycle. Lots of talk about "rewiring the mind". I think fasting might actually help with rewiring because you are not rewarding a undesired behavior.
 
01:20:36 Rachel: That was in relation to the other discussion
 
01:21:56 David: No money in fasting
 
01:22:10 Rebecca Thérèse: Fasting literally rewires the brain because the body starts to generate new neurons after 48 hours of fasting.
 
01:22:24 Vanessa: Reacted to "Fasting literally re..." with 👍
 
01:22:30 David: Autophagy as well
 
01:23:28 Rebecca Thérèse: Reacted to "Autophagy as well" with 👍
 
01:25:14 Rebecca Thérèse: Autophagy is where the cells start to digest damaged parts of the body and damage interior to cells
 
01:26:04 Bob Cihak: Autophagy is also known as apoptosis. I call it cellular recycling.
 
01:26:32 Rebecca Thérèse: Fasting stimulates growth hormone which os useful in repairing damage and is also useful if you're a body builder
 
01:26:49 Susanna Joy: Love this clas🙏🏻💖
 
01:26:59 Lisa Smith: Too Fast. Thank you Fr
 
01:27:41 Sophia: God bless you fr.Abernethy!
 
01:27:42 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.
 
01:27:42 Art: Thank you Father!
 
01:27:43 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:27:43 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:27:43 David: Thank you father !
 
01:27:51 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis X, Part II

We continued our discussion of prayer and the things that often become an obstacle to it. Much of the discussion this evening focused upon the things that make us lazy or weary in prayer or lead us to drowsiness.
One of the important things that the fathers teach us is that sleep is an appetite that is to be ordered like any other appetite. Our life has been given to us for repentance; that is, to turn toward God and to seek to love him with all of our heart. It is this reality that should shape the way that we look at prayer, the way that we discipline ourselves - and yes - even how we sleep.
 
Rising at night is one of the most wonderful times for prayer for a number of reasons. The mind and the body are humbled. The thoughts are often not moving so rapidly nor the world around us and its noises. Praying at night provides us with an opportunity to enter into deep silence, so as to listen to God and the word he wishes to utter in the depths of our hearts.
 
Therefore, there are times when we will have to force ourselves in order to strengthen our will to not only bring ourselves to prayer but to remain there. Whenever we experience drowsiness, we must resist it firmly. Often we will give up a discipline when we face difficulty. It is our love for the Lord, however, that must send us out at night seeking He alone who can satisfy the longings of our heart.
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:02:04 FrDavid Abernethy: we can hear you
 
00:02:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 89
 
00:21:49 Anthony: I did that. I'd go back. It drove me nuts, playing on scrupulous feelings
 
00:49:25 Ann Thelen: Quick question regarding food/fasting...how do we deal with the temptation to vanity when we are attempting to fast? We know fasting has wonderful health benefits. One of those benefits is that we look better and more healthy which can feed into vanity.
 
01:04:22 Anthony: Menaion?
 
01:17:14 Lisa Smith: Thank you & God bless
 
01:17:56 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:17:57 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:18:04 Nicole Dillon: Thank you ☺️
 
01:18:08 Troy Amaro: Thank You Father. Praying for you.
 
01:18:19 Ann Thelen: Thank you.
 
01:18:26 Cindy Moran: Thanks
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part X

As we come toward the end of Step 26 on Discernment, St. John begins to offer us a summary of all that we have considered in the previous pages. In doing this, he alters his typical way of writing. One may speculate that he does this because of the importance of the virtue of discernment; both in fostering it and in protecting it.  Using brief sayings, very much like those found in the Philokalia, St. John begins to lay out for us the path to perfecting this virtue as well as to speak of the fruits of it in our lives. 
Our capacity to see spiritual realities in an unimpeded fashion allows us to be attentive to all of the vices as well as the remedies that the fathers set before us for overcoming them. In summarizing the step in this fashion, St. John presents us with the truth very much in the way that we receive it from the gospel. It overturns the worldly way of viewing things. It allows us to experience the discomfort of having our sensibilities challenged in regards to our patterns of thought and our most basic desires. It compels us to ask ourselves, “For whom  do I live? Who do I love above all things?”
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:46 FrDavid Abernethy: page 215
 
00:02:51 FrDavid Abernethy: number 85
 
00:03:29 FrDavid Abernethy: number 185
 
00:08:47 Tracey Fredman: Thank you, Fr. David for referencing the book "Toward God" by Michael Casey. It's amazing!
 
00:08:57 FrDavid Abernethy: great!!
 
00:09:11 FrDavid Abernethy: he’s a wonderful writer
 
00:09:40 Kate : I am reading it too!  It is wonderful.   Like nothing I have read before.
 
00:09:41 FrDavid Abernethy: his book on lectio divina called Sacred reading is great too
 
00:26:15 Anthony: Do you have any comments on discerning the origin of thoughts without playing with the thoughts?
 
00:43:12 Anthony: That makes sense since Eros is a seeking, inquisitive movement.
 
00:51:38 David Swiderski: Especially prayer with gratitude.
 
00:52:19 Andy Nguyen: Replying to "Especially prayer wi..." 
 
 Yup
 
00:52:21 Wayne: Reacted to "Especially prayer wi..." with 👍
 
00:58:03 Lisa Smith: I just read this today.
 
01:01:41 Andy Nguyen: Social media in general is an addiction
 
01:02:00 Rod Castillo: I go on to Facebook every day to see what you
have posted, Father
 
01:02:36 Lee Graham: I go to X
 
01:03:05 Susanna Joy: Reacted to I go on to Facebook ... with "❤️"
 
01:03:35 Lisa Smith: Yeah, there was a time I would turn the internet off totally. It was easier to pray more fully then. I struggle with that these days.
 
01:03:44 Susanna Joy: Replying to "I go on to Facebook ..." 
 
 I do too...you often...
 
01:04:26 Lisa Smith: But on the flip side I discovered Eastern Christianity online.
 
01:04:40 Art iPhone: Reacted to "But on the flip side…" with 👌
 
01:04:46 Art iPhone: Reacted to "I go on to Facebook …" with 👌
 
01:05:45 Art iPhone: Your posts Have real value Father.
 
01:05:49 BRIAN L: Your posting of On the Passion of the Saviour became part of my daily Lenten prayer so thank you 😃
 
01:09:17 David Swiderski: I have read this before with the Fathers I think Issac and I don't understand the relation between deer and snakes. Deer seem like fragile creatures and I grew up always being close to them. Destroyers of roses and alfalfa yes.
 
01:11:14 Jeffrey Fitzgerald: Father, what is the next book after Climacus?
 
01:11:24 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Prayers, Father!
 
01:11:38 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂. Have a good retreat🙏
 
01:11:39 Jeff O.: Many blessings on your time there!!
 
01:11:49 Lori Hatala: and i will be guilty of jealousy
 
01:11:53 Susanna Joy: Praying for you.🙏🏻
 
01:11:55 Wayne: Replying to "Father, what is the ..."
 
good question
 
01:11:56 Art iPhone: Prayers!!
 
01:12:35 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father! Have a blessed retreat!!
 
01:12:37 David Swiderski: Safe travels and God Bless you father!
 
01:12:39 Jeff O.: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis IX, Part II and Hypothesis X, Part I

Breaking the night for prayer!!  The very idea either never comes into the mind of modern Christians or it sends a shudder through the heart. The idea of limiting something like sleep for the sake of prayer, of humbling the mind and body in such a way on purpose and regularly seems to express a type of insanity. Would I not make myself sick or incapable of working the next day if such a practice were embraced in modern times.
Yet, it is a constant practice throughout the spiritual tradition; to sanctify time and foster an urgent longing within the heart for God that causes the soul to rise, even in the night, to seek him. Admittedly, this may require that we simplify our lives. There is already a frenetic pace in our day-to-day lives; a busyness that is almost suffocating. Such makes the idea of adding night prayer to that seem impossible and even frightening.
One can only come to know the fruit of this through experience. In the stillness of the night, impediments that often plague us throughout the course of the day fall away. Creation itself grows quiet and with it the human heart. Such a heart filled with urgent longing for the Lord will rise eagerly and with joy to taste the sweetness of his presence!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:59:01 Anthony: Perhaps a principle issue I'd reconciling the mind / interior thoughts with the heart / the noetic sentiment of affection for one's true calling.
 
01:02:04 Kate : Do the Fathers differentiate between vocal prayer and mental prayer, or is that a Western distinction?  Is there a recommendation to the kind of
prayer that would take place during a night vigil?
 
01:02:34 Lisa Smith: I find the setting has a huge impact on prayer/ like a noisy city compared to the quiet woods. I find it easiest to pray in a rural solitary place. With minimal distractions
 
01:03:31 Ann Thelen: what is the best way to discern if waking in the night to prayer is something we are called to? or are we all called to this? Maybe I am overthinking this.
 
01:06:22 Ann Thelen: fear of failure in this resolve seems to be the thing that immediately presents itself when thinking about rising in the night for prayer.
 
01:08:42 Lisa Smith: Catherine Daughtery wrote a series called Poustina. I've been meaning to read that.
 
01:10:38 Wayne: Replying to "Catherine Daughtery ..."
 
I do have a copy of this book
 
01:10:58 Lisa Smith: Replying to "Catherine Daughtery ..."
 
🙏
 
01:10:59 Ambrose Little: I wouldn’t suggest that’s a healthy model! 😄
 
01:11:07 Rebecca Thérèse: Before the modern era it was common for the night to be divided into "two sleeps". It was really the industrial revolution that ended this practice.
 
01:11:50 Ambrose Little: Replying to "I wouldn’t suggest t..."
 
Saying that as one who’s helped his wife stay sane through 7 kiddos. It’s not a time we want to extend or further.
 
01:14:47 Anthony: Another ill effect of the "reformation," particularly the English variety.
 
01:16:37 Anthony: Yes
 
01:17:15 Ann Thelen: I appreciate the analogy of nursing the baby. We have five children and the youngest is 7 now. My excuse has been that I will be tired if i get in the night to pray. That analogy shed light on my excuse. It actually spoke to my heart saying "Ann, you've done this before. Don't be afraid of it"
 
01:20:00 Maureen Cunningham: Susan Wesley would put an apron over her head she 12 children everyone new she was in prayer
 
01:23:31 Lisa Smith: Thank you Fr. God bless you.🙏
 
01:23:32 Maureen Cunningham: Blessing Father
 
01:24:09 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:24:10 Ann Thelen: Thank you
 
01:24:11 Dave Warner (AL): Thank you Father!
 
01:24:20 Steve Yu: Thanks, Father!
 
01:24:22 Maureen Cunningham: You are to kind of
 
01:24:25 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:24:43 Leilani Nemeroff: Thanks
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part IX

With each passing week, as we read St. John’s thoughts on discernment, we begin to see how it touches every aspect of our life. So often we confuse this gift with intellectually analyzing the circumstances around us or internal experiences and feelings or our perception of others’ actions. 
Yet discernment is not rooted in our private judgment. Rather, it arises out of union and communion with He who is Truth and Love. We engage in the ascetic life and seek purity of heart in order that we comprehend the truth unimpeded, to see things as God sees them and to see and respond to what he wants us to perceive.
Anything less than this leaves us completely vulnerable. St. John says, “let us watch and see which demon uplift us, which cast us down, which harden, which comfort, which darken, which pretend to communicate enlightenment to us, which make us slothful, which make us cunning, which make us sad, and which cheerful.”  It is only in Christ that we have the capacity to see these things. Strength and virtue of any kind comes not from climbing up a ladder of virtue on our own, but rather having Christ live within us. His virtue must become our virtue and his strength must becomes our strength. This is a difficult thing because it means letting go completely of the illusion that we can see the truth of the spiritual realities outside of our relationship with Him. It means being humble.
---
00:02:32 FrDavid Abernethy: page 214 number 172
 
00:26:36 David Swiderski: I struggled with discernment most of my life and got far too intellectual analyizing everything. A  wise friend made a comment that helped me- you only need to think of two things- does this lead us closer to God or away from God.
 
00:27:10 Lisa Smith: Reacted to "I struggled with dis..." with 👍
 
00:30:31 David Swiderski: My grandfather always said wisdom is absorbed slowly over time while being intellectual is something to grasp.
 
00:32:37 Jeff O.: julian of norwich seems to say the same thing about affliction going so far as to say to actually pray for it as it is one of the greatest graces of God.
 
00:36:27 Lisa Smith: Sufficient is the evil of today, Is that what Christ said?
 
01:02:47 Johnny Ross: God forgives seven times seventy-so long as the will is there
 
01:03:12 Vanessa: Reacted to "God forgives seven t..." with ❤️
 
01:12:15 Kate : At what point and in what circumstances can we make a judgement about a situation?
 
01:14:50 David Swiderski: Everytime I see arguments on how to make the sign of the cross or taking communion in the hand or on the tongue I feel like both sides want to be right rather than acknowledge each is seeking to get close to God.
 
01:16:11 David Swiderski: The focus falls to Pride as you mentioned before.
 
01:19:11 Tracey Fredman: Most recently, Romans 15:1-6 has been quite helpful for me - it's not about pleasing myself, but for building up others and letting go of what I think they should do: St. Paul wrote "... let each of us please our neighbor for the good , for building up. For Christ did not please himself …"
 
01:23:55 Rebecca Thérèse: God is often presented to us by people who want to control us.
 
01:24:06 Ambrose Little: Avoid “Catholic” Twitter/X. Social media in general.
 
01:24:27 sheri: Thanks Father.  Gotta go...
 
01:24:52 Kevin Burke: Thank You Father!
 
01:25:30 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:25:36 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:25:36 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:25:43 David Swiderski: Thank you!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis VIII, Part II and Hypothesis IX, Part I

The fathers continue to speak to us about service and work and the disposition that we are to have in doing it. Our understanding must move from a functional understanding of labor; engaging in it in a way that is determined by private judgment or by the desire for worldly things. 
Everything that we do must be tied to our service of the providence of God. In other words, we are responding to the call of Love. The way that the Christian works and responds to the needs of others (as well as the one’s own needs) is tied to our relationship with the Lord. We are given the task of being the guardian of souls; our own and others’. We are to attend to our own needs, trusting that God will provide us with what is needed. We are to serve others without making excuses for our avoidance or negligence in doing so. 
We are to seek first the kingdom of heaven. This is what shapes everything for us. We always return to the nest of prayer, there to be nourished upon the love and the grace of God. And it is only from that nest that we step out in response to His call to love and serve others. 
So often we fill our life with needless tasks; more often than not to give us a sense of security and safety. Yet to do so draws us away from He who is the Lord of love and the Governor of history; the One who provides for every one of our needs.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:10:07 Ann Thelen: hello everyone. I've been listening to these podcasts for the last year or so. tonight is the first time i've been able to jump in live due to Easter Break. No children's activities. Happy and grateful to be joining you.
 
00:10:25 Adam Paige: Reacted to "hello everyone. I've..." with 👍
 
00:10:32 Ambrose Little: Southerner joining early…
 
00:10:37 FrDavid Abernethy: Reacted to "hello everyone. I've..." with 👍
 
00:10:41 Lori Hatala: Reacted to "hello everyone. I've..." with 👍
 
00:18:13 Dave Warner (AL): Reacted to "hello everyone. I've..." with 👍
 
00:22:01 Steve Yu: Social media has enhanced the spirit of rudeness. I think it has to do with interacting with others in a non physical manner.  We gain a certain “freedom” from politeness and respect, in my opinion.
 
00:22:15 David C: Reacted to "Social media has enh..." with 👍
 
00:23:54 Carol Roper: Reacted to "hello everyone. I've..." with 👍
 
00:24:23 Steve Yu: Cultural difference?
 
00:40:24 Nypaver Clan: Do you think St. Philip got that imagery from St. Isaac?
 
00:47:28 Susanna Joy: On the previous section: The bird has to hurry back to the nest because the egg needs warmth or the baby bird is hungry and waiting...what stuck with me from the nido image is taking what gleaned from the world and hurty back to care for this tender growing "baby" life within the love Divine...the goodness received from the sheltering nest of the hand of God...
 
00:51:34 David C: Reacted to "On the previous sect..." with 👍
 
00:55:23 Erick Chastain: where are we in the evergetinos?
 
00:55:41 Nypaver Clan: Top of 85
 
01:04:49 Ann Thelen: Is there a book or something of the sorts that gives a good recommendation for what the structure of what our daily prayer life should look like as someone who is married or taking care of family. Specifically, the amount of time spent in prayer that should be non negotiable.
 
01:10:48 Ann Thelen: haha
 
01:12:47 sharonfisher: Thank you — I needed this instruction and I need to heed it.
 
01:13:06 Lori Hatala: Reacted to "Thank you — I needed..." with ❤️
 
01:13:16 Kevin Burke: Me too.. “Prayer is a relationship”
 
 
01:13:46 Ann Thelen: Thank you. Thats very helpful
 
01:16:02 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father, very profound teaching tonight…
 
01:16:02 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!!
 
01:16:04 Susanna Joy: When my son was small I was at a retreat, and some were going to devotions while those of us with small ones to the children out on a hike. A community member remarked to me, too bad you cant be in worship...It occured to me that my life with my child is a devotion...
 
01:16:06 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:15 Troy Amaro: Thank You
 
01:16:20 Erick Chastain: have a good night father
 
01:16:31 Lisa Smith: God bless
 
01:16:33 David C: Thank you God Bless all
 
01:16:40 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part XIII

Discernment, St. John tells us, arises out of humility. It also allows us to see the value of humility in the spiritual life. It is the virtue above all virtues, that we must cling to in the spiritual battle. The enemy will seek to confuse us in one way or another; by flattery or by seemingly knowing our thoughts and placing ideas before us which then make us fear their control over us. However, discernment and humility, both protect our capacity to live in He who is the truth. 
It also allows us to see the truth about ourselves as human beings and our dignity. We are not created with the passions. They rise out of our sin and the distortion of the desire that God has placed in us naturally. It is desire that makes us long for him and the life of virtue and it is anger that allows us to fight the good fight of faith and strike down the evil one and the temptations that are placed before us.  
We also find, over the course of time, that discernment allows us to let go of our judgment and what gives us security in the spiritual life and to trust wholly in God. Therefore, when life seems to crumble around us and all seems to be wrapped in darkness, discernment allows us to step forward with trust in God and his love. While it keeps us from acting in rash way it also protects us from false prudence that hides cowardice and lack of courage. 
What we begin to see is that any struggle in the spiritual life to overcome the passions, any sacrifice that we make to follow the Lord, promises what is beyond imagination. Even to lose all in this world is to lose nothing if we have Christ.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:06:22 Rachel: Hello everyone
 
00:11:11 Rachel: lol
 
00:12:42 Rachel: No one will take me😭 I guess trying to convince people what sinners they are and so need to go to the Holy Annointing as well as drive me was not a good stategy
 
00:13:28 Rachel: I have been but I went to Mass at noon, and others have other obligations
 
00:13:42 Rachel: When Rory gets home, Ill try to convince him. LOL
 
00:14:08 Rachel: He will gladly go. He loves the Byzantine Liturgies
 
00:17:48 Ambrose Little: I resemble that.
 
00:31:21 David: Virtue is nothing without the trial of temptation, for there is no conflict without an enemy, no victory without strife.-St. Leo the Great
 
00:33:09 David C: Reacted to "Virtue is nothing wi..." with ❤️
 
00:34:12 mhinckley: incisive anger: I always struggle with being just with it
 
00:34:36 David C: Reacted to "incisive anger: I al..." with 👍
 
00:34:39 mhinckley: not to mention charitable
 
00:40:01 mhinckley: I have always appreciated the use of "thorn" with sin. You never intentionally grasp for a thorn, only things that thorns surround.
 
00:40:51 David C: Reacted to "I have always apprec..." with 👍
 
00:42:58 Rachel: no. he is frozen
 
00:43:03 Lisa Smith: Same here.
 
00:43:04 Bob Cihak: Me too.
 
00:43:08 David C: Yeah he was frozen on my screen as well
 
00:43:29 Rachel: I only have Rens screen
 
00:43:38 Bob Cihak: Rising from the Frozen!
 
00:43:43 sprou: Reacted to "Rising from the Froz..." with 👍
 
00:43:46 David C: Reacted to "Rising from the Froz..." with 👍
 
00:47:29 David: I always try to remember what Mother Teresa said - I am a little pencil in the hand of God. At least when good flows through me however I often need frequent sharpening and a good eraser when I write :)
 
00:48:11 David C: Reacted to "I always try to reme..." with 👍
 
00:49:53 mhinckley: Reacted to "I always try to reme..." with 👍
 
00:53:40 Bob Cihak: What about St. Paul? "You have fought the good fight."
 
00:57:29 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Examples??
 
00:59:26 David: Would this be something like instead of dwelling on a temptation and agonizing vs. simply casting the thought from our minds in the beginning?
 
01:00:26 David: Evargius a good example
 
01:15:38 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:13 Bob Cihak: Blessings to you, Fr.
 
01:16:20 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:21 David: Thank your Father!
 
01:16:24 Rachel: thank y ou
 
01:16:25 Jeff O.: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:25 mhinckley: buona pasqua tutti!
 
01:16:31 Semai: Oh i joined late 😭
 
01:16:38 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Blessed Easter!
 
01:16:41 Mitch: Thanks!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis VIII, Part I

What a beautiful group! Beauty, however, is not only found in the things that are attractive or appeal to our sensibilities. What is beautiful is found in the truth – the truth that speaks to the depths of our hearts and our religiosity. Once again, the fathers speak to us and present to us the gospel in unvarnished fashion. 
 
What is the disposition that we are to have in our service of God and others? If we give ourselves over to task with obedience, then we can be assured that God will provide all the grace that is necessary. If we do these tasks poorly, if we make mistakes, these do not diminish the value of our work. What gives shape to the work is the love and the humility of Christ. 
 
There are so many things that rush to our minds as to why we cannot bear something or why we cannot do a certain work. However, the fathers show us that so often such things are excuses; that is, plausible lies. They are reasonable because they are rooted in the reality of our own weaknesses. They are lies because they do not take into account the grace and the mercy of God. So often when we take up a task we engage in the labor abstracted from Christ. However, if we simply offer that labor to Christ, if we take it up by his grace and for his glory, then it has more value than we could ever imagine.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:03:54 FrDavid Abernethy: page 78
 
00:04:01 FrDavid Abernethy: New Hypothesis Tonight
 
00:06:45 Arthur Danzi: Hi Fr David
 
00:07:01 Arthur Danzi: I’m fine, how are you?
 
00:07:06 Arthur Danzi: My internet connection is poor…
 
00:29:12 Rachel: yes
 
00:40:27 sharonfisher: Thank you for the comment that even the monks struggle. My priest, after 2.5 or 3 years, revealed that he, too, sometimes struggles to keep the prayer rule. It was helpful to me to hear that.
 
00:54:21 Rachel: This is a magnificent passage. It needs to be read very slowly. Finding humility, doorkeeper, etc. This is so rich and multilayered. One can only understand through experience I am sure.
 
00:55:08 Rachel: No,but I think it needs to be unpacked
 
00:55:17 sharonfisher: 😂
 
00:55:29 Tracey Fredman: Experiential understanding is really hard to go through, though. This discussion is really helpful to me this evening.
 
00:55:49 Rachel: There is more to it..when one finds humility, one finds Christ, but what happens when we become the doorkeeper, or christ becomes the doorkeeper of our heart?
 
00:58:16 Rachel: He speaks about finding salvation by finding humility. Either way, we learn by experience whether we want to or not. But we may not experience what Our Lord desires that we experience. We may go kicking and screaming instead of finding the humility that the desert fathers speak of. He desire that we experience Himself
 
00:58:21 Liz D: It is consoling that you have shared this Father, about persecition with the Church, thank you. It can difficult to trust people in the Church when one experienced being persecured from within the Church. Also, to remember to go to Christ first-because sometimes I realize I go to God last for some areas of my life. As if in some things I subconsciously believe I am expected (by God) to go it alone--only turning to Jesus for help when things become nearly unbearable
 
00:58:39 sharonfisher: Reacted to "He speaks about find..." with ❤️
 
00:59:56 sharonfisher: Reacted to "It is consoling that..." with ❤️
 
01:00:06 Keith Abraham: Reacted to "It is consoling that…" with ❤️
 
01:00:56 Rachel: Oh we can trust them alright! trust them to be very human like ourselves lol
 
01:01:31 Lisa Smith: My favorite verse is where Christ speaks of faith as a grain of mustard seed.
 
01:01:56 Rachel: I'm too melancholic for my own good, sorry i will be quiet again.
 
01:02:13 Rachel: lol
 
01:04:11 Lisa Smith: lol Amen on the doorkeeper, Fr
 
01:04:23 Adam Paige: Saint Brother André was a porter
 
01:05:11 Lisa Smith: not for the socially anxious.
 
01:07:23 Steve Yu: I love the parable of the mustard seed because Jesus starts by comparing the Kingdom to someone who plants such a seed in a garden. The problem with that is someone would have to be crazy to do that. They grow enormous and quite ugly in my opinion. It would ruin a garden.  
 
Isn’t that reflective of the spiritual life? We search for the beautiful garden not realizing that the ugly or inconvenient event may have Christ hidden within. I *think* this is attributable to humility. Christ has us see Him where we least expect Him.
 
01:09:07 Andrew Adams: Reacted to "I love the parable o..." with ❤️
 
01:12:48 Keith Abraham: “Domesticating” Christianity is one of the worst things we can do.
 
01:12:49 Steve Yu: That went by fast
 
01:12:56 Rebecca Thérèse: thank you🙂
 
01:13:37 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:42 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!!
 
01:13:43 Dave Warner (AL): Thank you
 
01:13:49 Troy Amaro: Thank You
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part XII

Discernment is so much more than our analyzing the realities and circumstances around us by the use of intellect and reason. These faculties, as wonderful as they are, have inherent limitations. They are not infinite, nor can they speak of God as he is in himself. 
What God begins to show us in the spiritual life is that the more that we enter his love and truth, the more we are drawn into a mystery that is beyond us. Faith is described by many of the Saints as a “dark obscure knowing”. It is God‘s light, his divine light, that pierces through the darkness, and reveals to us the beauty of his love. It reveals (draws back the veil) and shows us that this love is worth everything to pursue and attain. “Love never ends”, the scriptures tell us. Discernment opens the door to that reality and allows us to step towards the beloved who desires to give us all. Our destiny is to move from glory to glory in the never-ending love of God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:07:32 FrDavid Abernethy: page 209 para 139
 
00:40:44 Daniel Allen: Is the inverse then true?
 
00:42:28 Amale: What can the demons see or not see within us?
 
00:46:21 Rachel: The Elder would also know that in turn.. they could merit by true charity towards each other
 
00:47:33 Rachel: Where despite the feelings of animosity that arose, the monks would then more purely offer charity in the only way they can due to their limited capacity to love purely without unholy attachments
 
00:47:55 Maureen Cunningham: Father can demons reproduce? i was just wonderfing
 
00:48:00 Maureen Cunningham: Wondering
 
00:48:49 Kate : Can the demons hear our confessions to a priest within the context of the sacrament?
 
00:49:19 Maureen Cunningham: Best News
 
00:49:25 Jeff O.: Cassian seems to say in his conferences that they cannot reproduce
 
00:50:23 Amale: Do any souls who go to hell end up becoming demons?
00:51:10 Vanessa: Replying to "Do any souls who go ..."
 
I thought demons were the 1/3 of heavenly beings who went with Lucifer.
 
00:51:17 Jeff O.: He talks about it in the eighth conference on the principalities
 
00:51:24 David: In organization studies clicks can start which can create toxic results for teams.
 
00:51:53 Rachel: It is like the story of the Desert Father who, as soon as he instructed his Spiritual son would quickly leave him
 
00:52:39 David: We becomes us and them
 
00:52:51 Rachel: I suppose that was not for the community but purity of heart
 
01:00:58 David: I have heard a critism of the western church that we try to explain everything while the east embraces mysteries to be contemplated more. When I was younger I wanted the answers the older I get the more I love contemplating mysteries more.
 
01:01:15 Vanessa: Reacted to "I have heard a criti..." with ❤️
 
01:01:28 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I have heard a criti..." with 👍
 
01:01:57 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "I have heard a criti..." with ❤️
 
01:04:08 Daniel Allen: That’s an interesting comment (re poetry), because oftentimes poetry can calm my thoughts, and give me a jumping off point for prayer
 
01:04:42 Vanessa: Replying to "That’s an interestin..."
 
Psalms
 
01:05:30 David: The Syrian fathers write most things through poetry as well.
 
01:05:55 Cindy Moran: This relates to the need for formative spirituality.
 
01:06:20 Rachel: Gregory Narek
 
01:06:30 Daniel Allen: Reacted to "Gregory Narek" with ❤️
 
01:06:35 Rachel: Pope Francis
 
01:11:25 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you ☺️
 
01:11:40 Rachel: yes
 
01:11:41 Cindy Moran: Yes
 
01:11:46 Jacqulyn Dudasko: Thank you!
 
01:12:24 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:12:27 Rachel: thank you
 
01:12:29 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:12:29 Cindy Moran: Thank you
 
01:12:31 Arthur Danzi: Thank you Father
 
01:12:32 David: Thank you father! May God bless you
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis VI, Part II and Hypothesis VII

We are drawn ever deeper into the subtle manifestations of Avarice and how the demons make use of this passion to draw us into other sins. Indeed, it is a fearsome vice. The evil one can convince us that our identity is dependent on our having a certain objects or money and the security that it seems to offer us. Once we have given ourselves over to this thought, it gradually oppresses the mind and heart of the individual. Our incapacity to discern the truth of avarice’s grip upon us, we lose the ability can see what has enduring value. 
Such oppression undermines our commitment to God, others, and the pursuit of the path of sanctification he has set us upon. Suddenly we can no longer see what is good about a godly life and fidelity. We begin to see the weaknesses of others and the failure of a community to reach the ideal. We become hyper-critical. This the Evil One uses psychologically to make our exit from our vocation more acceptable to the mind. He first makes us despise what we once loved. What we once entered into with zeal, we now turn away from with cowardice. 
When given over to avarice we find ourselves falling under the control of the demons who continue to torment us; making us more vulnerable to the darkness of other passions. In this particular vice, we see the truth that “sin is its own punishment”. The more we grasp for the things of this world, the more we descend into darkness and ingratitude.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:12:18 FrDavid Abernethy: page 69
 
00:12:30 FrDavid Abernethy: midway down the page. second para
 
00:13:05 Keith Abraham: Thank you very much!
 
00:23:09 Anthony: This sounds like what happened in the hundred years prior to the reformation.  The vices preceded an explosion leaving the Church and the religious life.
 
00:46:23 Alexandra: Can avarice be wanting to have control. Control of Knowing everyone's business?
 
00:50:10 Anthony: This story is funny. Dragons are associated with the avaricious guarding of gold.  The serpent is like a mirror for his avaricious
state.
 
01:24:31 Rachel: No career changes according to one's whims
 
01:30:40 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:30:42 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you 😊
 
01:30:44 Rachel: Thank you Father and everyone
 
01:30:51 Dave Warner (AL): Thank you!
 
01:30:57 Lisa Smith: Thank you Fr
 
01:30:57 Troy Amaro: Thank You
 
01:31:12 Kevin Burke: Thank you !
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part XI

This evening we continued our discussion of discernment;in particular, developing an awareness of the action of the demons and their attempts to lead us astray. However, John also seeks to make us aware of the fact that it is not only the demons that we have to be aware of but our human nature in its fallen state. We are often weak of will and changeable in our mind. We are filled with contradictions and will often choose that which offers nothing over the love and the mercy of God. We have within certain destructive tendencies that are beyond reason. St. John would not have us over analyze these things but be aware of them so to avoid them and turn more radically toward God when we see them arise within our hearts.
What is most striking in this section of the Ladder is that divine light shines through John‘s own words. The open up reality for us and we see on the horizon our dignity and destiny in Christ so brilliantly that one can only gasp. It creates within the heart an urgent longing to run to the Beloved. It reveals in a fraction of the moment the entire meaning of the ascetical life. It is not about self-perfection or endurance, but rather about Love. It is about acknowledging that what has been fashioned from clay has now been placed and seated upon the very throne of God. Joy!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:03:27 Carolus: Good evening Father.
 
00:03:34 FrDavid Abernethy: good evening
 
00:13:08 Genesius B: Father Michael of the Eparchy of Parma can only grow a goatee
 
00:13:36 Genesius B: we still love him though
 
00:19:18 David: Is this related to as one gets closer to God sometimes the attacks of the demons become stronger and often in different ways?
 
00:23:46 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: this translations says "greedy and grubby flesh" not corpulence
 
00:28:18 Genesius B: How can such inquisitiveness lead us to pride? Surely trying to understand Divine Providence can only reveal our own wretchedness? Is it that merely trying to understand is itself beyond us and thus an act of hubris?
 
00:28:25 Genesius B: and self assetion?
 
00:34:30 Genesius B: then when gifts are given should we seek to hide them, lest we become prideful in them. I see this in many saints but how does this not violate the Divine command to not hide our light?
 
00:35:58 Carolus B: Replying to "then when gifts are ..."
 
Or to not burry our talents.
 
00:55:58 Kate : St. Elizabeth of the Trinity, a French Carmelite saint, wrote, “Let yourself be loved by God.”  I often ponder this quote.  Why do I run from this love?  We do I not allow myself to be loved by God?
 
00:59:50 Ren Witter: I don’t think, though, that we run from the love of God when it feels like love. I can’t even imagine doing that, honestly.  I think we run from what we are taught is the mysterious love of God, because more often than not it feels like something terrifying, or threatening, or even wounding.
 
01:00:05 Ren Witter: We are told to trust that these things are manifestations of the love of God.
 
01:02:02 Daniel Allen: Christ says, “everyone when he is fully taught will be like his teacher.” Imitating Christ, and the saints in deed teaches us little by little until we our not like our fallen selves but like Christ.
 
01:03:41 David: When I used to teach catechism I heard many comments when discussing the saints saying they are not like that or it is not reachable from teens and even my sons. It seems helpful to discuss the whole lives of the saints like the difficulties and sinful past of St. Ignatius. Most writings seem to focus on them being perfect and so special rather than the journey.
 
01:06:55 Rebecca Thérèse: I find that reading what the saints wrote themselves is very helpful because they're very honest about their struggles and that makes them more relatable to me.
 
01:08:28 Rachel: Yes, this is true.We are all starving. For Christ.
 
01:12:55 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: One's image of God is so important - a distorted one gets in the way of living faith truly. This needs to be examined and renovated many times in one's life. Important to see self in God not outside of Trinity/grace.
 
01:14:30 Andrew Adams: Reacted to " One's image of God ..." with ❤️
 
01:16:11 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:11 Cindy Moran: Excellent session...thank you Father!
 
01:16:12 Jeff O.: Thank you Father!! Good to be with you all.
 
01:16:13 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:13 David: Thank you Father David!
 
01:16:14 sue and mark: good night
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis IV, Part III

We take up this evening a new hypothesis (VI) dealing with the ownership of property. At the heart of it, however, is the temptation to avarice and the impact that it has upon the spiritual life and upon our commitments to God and others. 
 
The monks relinquishment of property, their embrace of a life of poverty and simplicity, highlights for us the subtle temptations that are involved in our attachment to the things of the world. Where lust and gluttony perhaps fail to satisfy - avarice often step in to test us. It can become something insatiable. The more we amass the more we desire. 
 
Our attachment to things can begin on a very small level. Yet unchecked, it can affect the way that we enter into our relationship with God. We slowly begin to seek our security and identity in things. This, in turn, can make us ever so vulnerable to the demons attack against our commitments. The possession of things can make it seem more plausible to change and alter our life; to pursue another path of salvation, for ourselves, that does not require hardship or that offers more satisfaction. It gives room for our internal instability to drive us away from what challenges us internally to overcome the ego. What begins with a small attachment eventually can develop to the point where a demon tells us that “if stay where we are we the place our salvation in jeopardy. It is better to take what we have, and to create something better in our own judgment.”  In this, we often place our own judgment above God’s. It creates an atmosphere of infidelity and strips us of long-suffering.
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:11:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 64
 
00:23:46 Eric Ewanco: 2nd maccabees
 
00:28:24 Eric Ewanco: Replying to "2nd maccabees"
 
12:39-45
 
00:41:56 Michael Hinckley: I know I’m that way about books. Desire for more
 
00:42:38 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "I know I’m that way ..." with ❤️
 
00:48:28 Eric Ewanco: Replying to "I know I’m that way ..."
 
There is a Japanese term, "tsundoku" (積ん読). This word describes the habit of acquiring books and letting them pile up, without reading them.
 
00:52:21 John I.: Replying to "I know I’m that way ..."
 
I used to think that reading a lot of good Catholic books would make me very virtuous....
 
00:54:39 Eric Ewanco: I can see those worries about the future being very real
 
00:56:33 Lori Hatala: I have always feared thinking "I deserve".  I probably would not like getting what I deserve.
 
00:57:13 Kate : As an aside, we have a daughter who is a Carmelite nun.  When she received the holy habit, all of her hair was cut off.  We were given this hair to keep as a momento.  She had a beautiful head of hair, but she gave it up with great joy.  And now, I think there is more beauty in her Carmelite veil and all it signifies than in her hair.
 
00:57:21 Tracey Fredman: There's an emotional type of attachment to un-needful things - why is that? Not necessarily security - things like … I don't know, teacups - are hard to part with for some people. I'm very much aware of this in myself and I trying to declutter - it's really hard.
 
00:58:34 Vanessa: Reacted to "As an aside, we have..." with ❤️
 
00:58:51 Jacqulyn: Reacted to As an aside, we have... with "❤️"
 
01:00:42 Eric Ewanco: There is a tradition, I think in the Romanian churches maybe, at the wedding of the priest saying "You are now each other's crosses"
 
01:27:51 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you,🙂 sorry I was late. I'm in the UK and forgot about daylight saving time.
 
01:28:32 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:28:38 Sophia: 🙏
 
01:28:45 Kenneth: thank you Father
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part X

As we read St. John Climacus, we begin to see discernment as rooted in our relationship with God; a relationship that is founded upon the revelation of God‘s love and the desire that it stirs within the human heart to respond in kind. If we love God, then it is not going to seem to be a burden to us to take every thought captive and bring it before God for his blessing or judgment. Nor is waiting upon the Lord going to be a point of frustration. 
Rather, when we love God, we understand that he is going to desire what is best for us. This desire leads him to test our intentions so as to purify them. What God looks for is humility and a spirit of repentance. Faced with our own weakness, and the darkness that sin brings into our life and into the world, we must cling to God and allow him to guide us with his light.  Often only one step ahead is illuminated for us. We must be at peace with this if we have faith in him and trust in his love. 
Part of what this requires from us is an honest heart; one that avoids distractions and holds fast to innocence. Often our sensibilities can become hardened through our experience of the world, and we lose the capacity not only to be vulnerable to others but to God himself. It has been said that “haste destroys the poet and the saint”.  In the face of the frenetic pace of the world, let us hold on to simplicity and silence in order that we might hear the Beloved when he speaks to us.
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:08:06 FrDavid Abernethy: page 206 number 114
 
00:16:33 Susanna Joy: It can be years and years...
 
00:16:56 Susanna Joy: ...one must have the patience of Job.
 
00:27:28 Susanna Joy: I have a friend who says, "Set all your thoughts, words, and actions as flowers at the feet of the Lord."  Then whatever the result, the intention is right.
 
00:28:10 Paul G.: Reacted to "I have a friend who …" with ❤️
 
00:30:37 Rebecca Thérèse: Therese thought of herself as a plaything of the infant Jesus so sometimes he would discard her in order to play with something else.
 
00:32:09 Genesius B.: Would it be imprudent to treat everything as beyond us, or perhaps prudent so we might never overreach?
 
00:33:35 Susanna Joy: Replying to "Would it be impruden..." 
 
 There is the riddle ...
 
00:34:50 Susanna Joy: Replying to "Would it be impruden..." 
 
 ...we must do our be...
 
00:42:31 sharonfisher: But how do we deal with the ‘warped souls’ in life as we encounter them and recognize them as too familiar to our circumstances? It seems scary.
 
00:43:00 Kate : Father, Could you offer any guidance on finding the balance between overreaching in the spiritual life versus not pushing oneself enough?  I find it very hard to get the right balance.  It is a long, hard struggle.
 
00:46:23 Anthony: 1. Thanks for explaining the unforgivable sin. 
2. No need to fall I to scrupulousity over this sin because concern about it indicates one has not confused good and evil.
3. I like a sentiment by St Paisios you shared on Facebook about keeping a calm soul so the devils can't cast their lines in our soul.
 
00:51:18 Susanna Joy: Replying to "1. Thanks for explai..." 
 
 That is such a great...
 
00:52:20 Susanna Joy: Replying to "1. Thanks for explai..." 
 
 Fish are tempted to ...
 
00:52:30 Susanna Joy: Reacted to 1. Thanks for explai... with "❤️"
 
00:53:10 Carolus B: Replying to "1. Thanks for explai..."
 
Should we avoid holding personal goals, instead endeavoring to only hold the single goal which is the desire of God, regardless of how we feel about the outcome?
 
00:53:52 Anthony: Hahaha. Yes he might
 
00:54:07 Paul G.: Reacted to "Hahaha. Yes he might" with 😇
 
00:54:16 sharonfisher: This is an aside that you may or may not want to read re: what we deign to touch or interact with. I was crossing, on foot, an intersection to the metro station and my luggage got all sideways. This homeless-type fellow ran out and collected my stuff for me and handed it to me on the other side. I gathered a few dollars to give him. I didn’t realize what I was doing when I went to grab the bag handles, but he did — he asked, pointedly, if I was afraid to touch his hand. Apparently, I had avoided contact with him, even after his assistance. I’m ashamed to this day. And I have another story equally shameful. Won’t bore you with it. Point, I think, is to be aware of our own actions, and how others perceive them.
 
00:55:14 Genesius B.: how do we discern when one malevolently disputes with us, vs one who disputes due to a misplaced but genuine and fervent care for the soul?
 
00:55:20 Carolus B: Should we avoid holding personal goals, instead endeavoring to only hold the single goal which is the desire of God, regardless of how we feel about the outcome?
 
01:07:33 Rebecca Thérèse: People admire athletes who train physically from dawn to dusk but if people want to "train" spiritually people think they're mentally disturbed!
 
01:07:37 sharonfisher: Not sure if Eastern Church recognizes Alfred and Briget and other English saints prior to Great Schism (other than Patrick, perhaps)?
 
01:07:38 David: I always loved a tradition in northern spain. They celebrate "Tu Santo" or saints day which often is more important or more celebrated than a birthday. These celebration's always explain about the life of the saint.
 
01:08:24 Art iPhone: Looking forward to the Frances Cabrini movie coming soon.
 
01:08:33 sharonfisher: Reacted to "People admire athlet..." with ❤️
 
01:09:03 Cindy Moran: Teresa of Avila & her young brother tried to run away from home to become martyrs.
 
01:09:13 sharonfisher: Reacted to "Looking forward to t..." with ❤️
 
01:09:18 Joseph Chiappetta: Reacted to "Teresa of Avila & he..." with ❤️
 
01:10:16 Carolus B: Replying to "Teresa of Avila & he..."
 
When asked by her parents why she ran away she answered: "I want to see God, and you have to die first."
 
01:10:38 Anthony: The serious troubles caused by religious nuts make us wary of asceticism
 
01:11:03 sharonfisher: Fasting could bring one to extremes.
 
01:11:04 Ren Witter: When I was little I heard the story of a martyr who died being boiled in oil. I used to pray that that would be the one way I wouldn’t be martyred.
 
01:11:07 Genesius B.: can we go back to 124 briefly
 
01:11:15 Rebecca Thérèse: A lot of trouble is caused by atheists!
 
01:11:43 Kate : Who was it who said “I could be a martyr if they kill me real quick?”
 
01:11:58 Anthony: Replying to "Who was it who said ..." 
 
 St Thomas more?
 
01:12:00 Genesius B.: Replying to "can we go back to 12..."
 
how do we ensure our kids have an appropriate upbringing which would best instill these virtues beyond the mere basics
 
01:14:22 Genesius B.: Replying to "can we go back to 12..."
 
i.e. how do we instill a proper spirit of mortification and humility in our children?
 
01:14:43 Alice Hirsch: By saying the 12 year St. Bridget prayers, a person can become martyr like.  The promise is stated as follows:  “The soul who prays them will be accepted among the Martyrs, as though he had spilled his blood for his faith.”
 
01:14:58 Genesius B.: Replying to "can we go back to 12..."
 
w/o simultaneously being too harsh
 
01:15:11 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:13 Lee Graham: This was a most informative and spiritually strengthening teaching. So glad I attended even though I was not well. Thank you and bless you.
 
01:15:21 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "By saying the 12 yea..." with 🥰
 
01:15:45 Lori Hatala: feel better Lee
 
01:16:20 sue and mark: Reacted to "feel better Lee" with 🙏
 
01:16:25 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:28 David: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:28 sue and mark: Reacted to "This was a most info..." with 🙏
 
01:16:28 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:16:31 sharonfisher: And with your spirt!!
 
01:16:31 Genesius B.: Thank you father
 
01:16:33 sue and mark: good night
 
01:16:38 Kevin Burke: Thanks you Father!
 
01:16:41 Cindy Moran: Thanks Father's
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis IV, Part II and Hypothesis V

Sometimes in the simplest teachings is found the greatest wisdom. Such is true in tonight‘s readings from The Evergetinos. The focus is on work, how we engage in it and also how we engage others with whom we work.
 
What becomes evident is that the Christian works in a distinctive fashion. Above all charity is to guide the manner in which we work, our diligence, and also the way we treat others. Whether they are good workers or not, we do not compare ourselves to them or the quality of our labor. Nor do we hold up the weakness or defects of people for others to see and so diminish their character.
 
It is for this reason that our spiritual work must always take precedence over and shape the work that we do within the world. We take up all things from the hand of God. And in doing, so we keep before our eyes the dignity of the other. There is nothing that we could produce within this world and nothing that we could accomplish that has more value than our own soul or that of others. Love and humility in all things!
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:06:16 Tracey Fredman: I've been thinking a lot about the question "How is your prayer life?" - what would be a proper response?
 
00:09:48 sharonfisher: I would respond that it’s in fits and starts — frequent during the day but not very structured. I need to do better.
 
00:25:39 Steve Yu: Is the Constitutions of the Holy Apostles another title for the Didache?
 
00:28:46 Anthony: I think the Constitutions are on librivox app
 
00:28:54 Steve Yu: Reacted to "I think the Constitu…" with 👍
 
00:29:00 Steve Yu: Replying to "I think the Constitu…"
Thanks!
 
00:29:03 Adam Paige: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostolic_Constitutions
 
00:29:09 Steve Yu: Reacted to "https://en.m.wikiped…" with 👍
 
00:29:10 Anthony: Also latin and slavonic
 
00:29:33 Steve Yu: Replying to "https://en.m.wikiped…"
Thanks!
 
00:30:07 Kevin Burke: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1493752200?psc=1&ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details
 
00:36:50 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Thanks!" with 👍
 
00:37:26 Rachel: Whoah
 
00:37:49 Steve Yu: Reacted to "https://www.amazon.c…" with 👍
 
00:38:01 Steve Yu: Replying to "https://www.amazon.c…"
Thanks much!
 
00:39:00 Rachel: So, I would have trouble having a poker face in that situation. I love the grace I have seen in others who handle these things, even great things in stride. The humility it takes to cover anothers faults and mistakes
 
00:46:22 Rachel: I do lol
 
00:52:28 Anthony: These men have complete freedom but choose to discipline their lives for the vision of something better than a "Batchelor life."
 
00:52:45 Vanessa: Reacted to "These men have compl..." with 👍
 
01:00:55 Anthony: An interesting book: "Catholicism, Protestantism and Capitalism" by Amintore Fanfani
 
01:01:29 Rachel: Some nuns who gave a talk to a prayer group a talk spoke about guarding oneself from touching in a layperson's life as well. It seems strange on the surface to the world. There are naturally affectionate people who want always to hug others. As an introvert I have admires the way in which the nuns held themselves. When we are not intruding on another's space, in charity or not, it is a way in which we can respect the image of God in the other. In the context of the talk, which was given about friendships and the life of prayer, I could see how there are many behaviors that on the surface seem charitable but are subtly self serving. 
The actions lack true humility and charity.
 
01:04:10 Liz D: Are there any prerequisites to praying the Prayer of the Heart, also known as the "Jesus Prayer.” mentioned as a way to pray in the morning? Also, can we pray this way during work times? I  read an admonition from one of the Fathers that it can be ill-advised to pray this prayer if one is not ready for it. Perhaps it had to do with certain breathing while praying. I’m sorry I don’t recall the exact quote or admonition. How may I discern if ready to try this prayer as a non-monastic Catholic? I’d like to pray the "Jesus Prayer" in the morning as discussed in the previous hypothesis discussion.  I apologize if this question is from the prior chapters or was covered previously.
 
01:12:35 Liz D: Thank you, Father.
 
01:12:45 Rebecca Thérèse: Such a priest probably doesn't understand it or finds it offensive and doesn't want his parishioners asking him awkward questions or judging him harshly
 
01:12:47 FrDavid Abernethy: Reacted to "These men have compl..." with 👍
 
01:13:41 Rachel: My comment was Irrelevant, we had moved on  =)
 
01:14:47 Maureen Cunningham: Thank. You
 
01:14:49 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:52 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:15:07 sue and mark: good night
 
01:15:36 Rachel: Thank you
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part IX

Discernment, as we have said, is the fruit of humility. Having removed the impediment of pride and having purified the heart of the passions, one comes to comprehend the things of the kingdom and the will of God. St. John gives us one example after another of how discernment helps us to perceive the things that lead us to God and that teach us to embrace that which endures.
 
As one progresses in the spiritual life, however, discernment is not simply the ability to know God‘s will, but rather also the ability to fulfill it in the way that God desires. In this, a soul can begin to trust in the action of the Spirit within the mind and heart. Therefore, although spiritual guides may be lacking one is not abandoned by God. Rather, God makes all things work for the good of those who love him.
 
In fact, the more one lays side ones will and turns to God in prayer and fasting, the more one lets go of the need to be driven by creativity, productivity, and one’s own intentions as a whole. The deeper the communion becomes with God, the more one finds joy in being drawn along whatever path He desires.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:08:12 FrDavid Abernethy: page 204 number 105
 
00:46:02 Rebecca Thérèse: I think Teresa preferred the priest to be learned rather than just intelligent because she thought that even holy priests could be misled. A learned priest wuld be better able to communicate the infallible teaching of the Church, in her view.
 
00:50:33 Michael Hinckley: Re: lack of elders… we miss not having enough monks & nuns available in communities.
 
01:00:37 Susanna Joy: This is so similar to a practice I learned from muslim friends, where one fasts and prays 3 days begore taking decision, that God may clarify what action one should take...The fast is called istakharra...means the right path. :)
 
01:03:21 Susanna Joy: It is so good to rest in God's wisdom before taking action.
 
01:06:32 Michael Hinckley: Modernity and technology have much to blame since many things can be created ex nihilo. Tempts thinking “ye shall be like Gods"
 
01:10:48 Anthony: Yes
 
01:10:50 Rachel: Id love to see that
 
01:11:38 David: I volunteered for catechism but was surprised there was no assignment with a spiritual director and it seemed to become more of a quasi entraining push by those who were the directors by the parish. The focus was keeping the kids coming back and making faith "fun". It seemed so different from my experience here an in Spain.
 
01:13:42 Susanna Joy: https://youtu.be/LOcCXt1n-fI?si=EGIJbH3UquEgdU0C
 
01:13:43 Michael Hinckley: Replying to "I volunteered for ca..."
 
Precisely the problem.
 
01:14:40 Susanna Joy: Here is a beautiful song for you all. "Who puts his trust in God most Just"
 
01:14:41 Anthony: Pierogi making brings my parish together
 
01:14:58 Michael Hinckley: TLM communities also see the young coming b/c of lack of “fun” things
 
01:15:08 Ambrose Little: I’m not “young” and feel more or less that way.
 
01:15:25 Adam Paige: You’re young at heart, Ambrose !
 
01:15:31 Ambrose Little: Reacted to "You’re young at hear..." with 😅
 
01:15:35 Jeff O.: Reacted to "You’re young at hear..." with 😆
 
01:15:46 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I’m not “young” and ..." with 👍
 
01:16:08 Susanna Joy: Reacted to Pierogi making bring... with "❤️"
 
01:16:17 Michael Hinckley: Gnocchi are pierogis
 
01:16:20 Rachel: haha I need to go to PA
 
01:16:54 Rachel: Can activism be another way of intellectualizing the faith?
 
01:17:08 Susanna Joy: Thank you so much, Father. God bless you.🙏🏻💗
 
01:17:09 Anthony: Reacted to Gnocchi are pierogis with "😂"
 
01:17:13 Rebecca Thérèse: thank you🙂
 
01:17:50 Sophia: Thank you so much fr.Abernethy. God bless you!
 
01:17:51 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:17:55 Jeff O.: Amen, thank you!
 
01:17:56 David: Thank you father!
 
01:18:01 Rachel: Thank you Father Thank you evryone
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis III, Part IV and Hypothesis IV, Part I

Everything about what it is to be a human being should be touched and shaped by the grace of God. Our identity and purpose comes through Christ. When we lose sight of this, a kind of disorder and imbalance enters into the way that we work, the kind of work that we take up, and the time that we spend engaged in it.
This evening we were given one story after another about the nature of the work the desert monks did. Their focus was on manual labor that allowed them to be attentive to God while engaged in it. They also worked enough to provide for themselves modestly but always with an eye towards the needs of others. We do not work for ourselves. Nor do we work and labor to the extent that it reveals we want to reach a point where we will no longer have to bear that burden. Work prevents us from falling into idleness, but also allows us to provide for others in their needs.
When Christ is absent from this part of our life, then “our toil shall be great, our path unsteady, our grief inconsolable, and our lives care-worn.” The one who is focused upon Christ and seeks him first will labor temperately and freely. In the absence of Christ, however, one is driven by agitation and fear.
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:21:26 Amale Obeid: How do hermits balance the solitude with the duty to serve others?
 
00:28:13 Anthony: We Americans have the farce of the Puritan work ethic, though. We are people, not human resources.  That is a point of resistance for me.
 
00:37:50 Rebecca Thérèse: A siev is a strainer
 
00:38:02 Rebecca Thérèse: sieve
 
00:39:25 Anthony: As a matter of historical note, in the middle ages, cloth was the first commodity, and a source of wealth.  Weavers were treated poorly, like the way treat robots.  The heresy of Waldensianism spread among weavers, perhaps during to their social condition.
 
00:42:07 Lilly: Saint Francis of Assisi, comes to mind. He left his dad's linen business to live a monastic life :)
 
00:43:19 Anthony: Reacted to Saint Francis of Ass... with "👍"
 
00:59:29 Amale Obeid: How much work is “enough” to not be slothful or idle? Secular life does not let you step down or slow down. It feels more and more like it’s an all or nothing choice
 
01:09:33 Anthony: On the neglect of the most important things when work is too long or too heavy: St John Bosco & St Frances Cabrini looked after children whose families were forced to work to the neglect of children....and the boys themselves who worked so much but neglected their souls.
 
01:10:54 Vanessa: Reacted to "On the neglect of th..." with 👍
 
01:11:17 Anthony: Thank God Pope Francis preaches on the evil of usury /
debt culture.
 
01:15:53 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You  Father David
 
01:15:56 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:37 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:43 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:16:47 Nick Bodmer: Thanks!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part VIII

In St. John’s discussion of discernment, he reveals to us the beauty of a human being transformed by the grace of God and living in communion with Christ by removing every impediment within the heart and by constantly crying out to him in prayer. At the very center of this reality is the “eye of the soul”. It is extremely beautiful, St. John explains, and next to the angels it surpasses all things. The angels constantly gaze upon God and the purified eye of the soul, the nous, allows us to contemplate the beauty of God‘s love.
There is also a freedom that comes to the soul through this purification. Our capacity to discern spiritual realities enables us to engage in the warfare with the demons more diligently and to avoid the pitfalls that are set for us. Furthermore, it allows us to understand that there is no such thing as a small sin. If neglected, it can consume the entire person. Likewise, there is no part of our life that we are to take for granted. The eye of the soul allows us to see that each moment is an opportunity for us to respond to God and to others with love; an opportunity embraced or lost. Thus, it is a very high view of the human person that is set before us; a view that allows us to understand the radical communion that exists between each of us and to see our destiny in Christ. Beautiful indeed!
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:29:50 sprou: virtue beyond our ability?
 
00:50:31 Nypaver Clan: “Familiarity breeds contempt.” My Mom used to say this if we spent too much time with friends.
 
00:50:54 Vanessa: Replying to "“Familiarity breeds ..."
 
My mom used to say that too lol
 
00:52:59 Anthony: St Paul, 1 Cor 7 (?) Talks about spouses separating for a bit.
 
00:53:38 Marypaz Mencos: I’ve been listening to your podcasts for a year, this is the first time I’m able to be in real time with y’all. It’s so good to put faces to all of your voices. 
God bless you Father, this podcasts have been a blessing to my spiritual life.
 
00:54:08 Vanessa: Reacted to "I’ve been listening ..." with ❤️
 
00:55:16 Amale Obeid: Replying to "St Paul, 1 Cor 7 (?)..."
 
“Let there be spaces in your togetherness, And let the winds of the heavens dance between you.” Gibran Khalil Gibran (Lebanese poet)
 
00:56:14 Susan M: Reacted to "I’ve been listening ..." with ❤️
 
01:05:40 Vanessa: Enjoying this very much tonight.
 
01:07:43 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Yet St. Basil came back from the desert saying the complete Gospel calls us to include service of others in one's authentic spiritual life...
 
01:13:27 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Sacrificial intercessory prayer for others is also service of the Body of Christ
 
01:13:52 Amale Obeid: Reacted to "Sacrificial interces..." with ❤️
 
01:18:37 Anthony: That kind of sounds superstitious, like an augury.
 
01:19:27 Anthony: Morning offering....yes. but there's repentance to a bad start and a possible bad end to a good start.
 
01:26:08 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you Father from Maureen & Kenneth
 
01:26:11 Arthur Danzi: That was wonderful. Thank you, Father!
 
01:26:14 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:26:18 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:26:21 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:26:21 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:26:24 David: Thanks Father!
 
01:26:34 Alexandra K: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis III, Part III

We continued our discussion from The Evergetinos on idleness. What begins to emerge from the wisdom of the fathers is that everything that is part of our life as human beings is filled with meaning and touched by grace. God has ordained that we provide for ourselves by the work of our hands. Furthermore, by this very same work, we are attentive to the needs of others. Work allows us to show charity to others in their needs. Avoiding idleness not only allows us to engage in fruitful labor but helps us to remain focused in our thoughts and avoid temptation. 
The fathers also understood that when our work is taken up as from the hand of God, as an act of obedient love, we give ourselves over to it with zeal and attention. We are prevented from falling into laziness. Such an understanding also allows us to engage in work in such a way that others see what motivates us. The intentions of the heart are often revealed in the simple way that we engage in our day-to-day labors. When we love, we take up that work diligently and joyfully.  We do not complain or fall into resentment. Nor do we compare our work with others. When we take up our work from God, it frees us from the pitfalls that often plague us on a daily basis. A balance emerges in our life. When our identity is rooted in God then we take up our labor from him and knowing that it is completed by his grace. Work is not what gives meaning to our life. It is love in our hearts that shapes that work.
---
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:15:59 Suzanne: Father, I'm just popping in to let you know I am going offline for Lent. I'll see you after Easter.
 
00:16:20 FrDavid Abernethy: Replying to "Father, I'm just pop..."
 
ok.  God bless
 
00:16:21 Suzanne: Thank you!!!
 
00:16:44 FrDavid Abernethy: page 52 top paragraph
 
00:21:32 Amale Obeid: The toil when working with the mind seems paradoxically heavier than the toil of working with the hands. How might we think about the difference between working the corporate grind versus what the monks consider work?
 
00:34:45 Louise: A beautiful book about being with God inwardly and with the world outwardly is The Practice of the Presence of God by Brother Lawrence.
 
00:35:48 Maureen Cunningham: Yes a wonderful book
 
00:35:50 Anthony: Read it. Supposedly it was a Carthusian work. Very good.
 
00:56:26 Alexandra K: This is the issue I have while working remote. I really really really don't like it. Need to remember that I should work for God.
 
00:57:41 Amale Obeid: Reacted to "A beautiful book abo..." with ❤️
 
01:16:20 Maureen Cunningham: Do you think they were so hard on Monks because they understood Spiritual Warfare
 
01:19:44 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:49 Maureen Cunningham: thank you many Blessings
 
01:19:53 Amale Obeid: Thank you
 
01:20:29 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:20:36 Sophia: Thank you, Fr
 
01:20:38 Alexandra K: Thank you for doing this Father! I'll pray for you
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part VII

As we have discussed, the fruit of humility is discernment. But what is that? Is it simply private judgment, a human wisdom that has deepened over the course of the years? 
St. John gradually begins to reveal to us that it is a freedom that emerges from the removal of the impediments of our passions. A sole passion, the desire for God, begins to direct and guide our lives as well as reveal to us the truth about our actions and the realities around us. 
Yet, it is humility that must continue to guide and direct this gift of discernment. It is to see things as God sees them only because we are allowing ourselves to trust in His providence in the warp and woof of day-to-day life. Whether we are embattled or at peace, whether we are called to be obedient or to guide others, we must rely upon the grace of God. It is His love, the love of He who is the truth that allows us to comprehend the realities of this world and the world come. Thus, St. John shows us, we can never think of ourselves or the gifts that we experience abstracted from a deep intimacy with the Lord. It is only in Him and through Him that we can live the life to which he has called us and through Him that we who were blind can see!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:18:44 Arthur Danzi: I'm sorry, what chapter are we reading?
 
00:19:53 Barbara: lost sound
 
00:19:59 Rebecca Thérèse: no audio
 
00:30:48 Anthony: Maybe another example is the miser who wears shabby clothes, just to save money?
 
00:45:18 Cindy Moran: Would oriental catholics call this yin-yang?
 
00:55:50 Cindy Moran: Replying to "Would oriental catho..." 
 
 ...
01:03:06 Anthony: Another thing to be careful of is to try observing what is a true state of affairs but to stop short of having unholy judgment or even feelings or inclination to hound something bad out or to resent something.
 
01:08:23 Carol Roper: Beware the leaven of the pharisees
 
01:09:21 David Swiderski: I used to waste a lot of time thinking and rethinking about decisions and people. Even doing this I often made bad decisions and was taken advantage by or attacked by people. I now simply concentrate on - does this lead me closer to God or further away from God. I also pay attention to the mood, other things around me much more.
 
01:11:42 Cindy Moran: Would oriental catholics call this yin-yang? My ? maybe not seen?? My relatives say that all religion is the same...
 
01:13:03 sam: I think he (John Climacus) also says elsewhere that vainglory has no birthdate but with pride is the mother of all vices. Humility he also says is one of the destroyers of its fruit and source.
 
01:16:05 Cindy Moran: It's  always a struggle for me . They are new age.
 
01:18:12 sam: Could we say that the all religions are equal idea is from a vainglorious attempt to please everyone and avoid real arguments about ascetical struggle?
 
01:20:41 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:10 Maureen Cunningham: Blessing
 
01:21:20 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father
 
01:21:27 David Swiderski: Thank you Father!!!
 
01:21:29 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:21:29 Jeff O.: Thank you Father!
 
01:21:34 Art iPhone: Thank you Father!
 
01:21:36 Arthur Danzi: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis III, Part II

What a blessing it is to read slowly. It allows insights to unfold before our minds and imaginations that we often would not be attentive to due to our typical need to rush. Hurry, most often, comes from the evil one who seeks to undermine our peace. It is lingering over the thoughts of the fathers on idleness that we begin to understand that what they are talking about is not simply avoiding laziness and sloth. They are revealing to us that keeping our focus upon God in mind and body, that is with the whole self, we grow in our capacity to love God and others. 
Virtue forms within the soul from engaging in our tasks with love and humility. Our willingness to take up that which is simple and perhaps menial in the eyes of the world and to do so with love is what is seen by God. Pushing a broom, if done with love, draws us to the very heart of God. Whereas imbalance in our labor, whether it is driving ourselves harshly or laziness, makes us lose sight of the glory of God in all things. May we listen well as we sit at the feet of the fathers, so that we might live our lives and engage in our work with minds and hearts fixed on God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:41:21 Rachel: I think it important to be clear that panic attacks when endured with patience, can be meritorious. Putting ones trust in God when flooded with waves of panic. The peace of Christ is a gift of God and I wonder, little by little one will find the peace of Christ within the storm. Patience, will teach one to see. Trust in God, He will reveal Himself in these moments
 
00:41:56 Steve Yu: Reacted to "I think it important…" with 👍
 
00:44:59 Susanna Joy: Wow...look at you know, though!!!
 
00:45:36 Susanna Joy: You totally overcame and are presenting CONSTANTLY! 🙏🏻🌟AMDG...
 
00:52:08 Susanna Joy: Our work becomes the altarspace...
 
01:05:26 Suzanne: This is a really good class tonight.
 
01:06:13 Paul G.: Replying to "This is a really goo…"
+1
 
01:06:19 Andrew Adams: Reacted to "This is a really goo..." with 👍
 
01:06:34 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "This is a really goo…" with ❤️
 
01:07:36 Sharon Fisher: Agreed - I love the asides to discuss practical application!
 
01:11:57 Vanessa: Same with Jacinta and Francisco Marto (Lady of Fatima)
 
01:12:10 Rebecca Thérèse: Therese's mother died when she was only five and she spent her whole life grief-stricken
 
01:15:30 Suzanne: Great points.
 
01:16:32 Vanessa: Reacted to "This is a really goo..." with ❤️
 
01:17:01 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:10 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:17:18 Suzanne: Ash Wednesday!
 
01:17:43 Suzanne: God bless all and God prosper our Lent!
 
01:18:12 Sharon Fisher: Many thanks!
 
01:18:18 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:18:19 Sophia: Thank you so much, fr.Abernethy. God bless you!
 
01:19:07 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Therese's mother die…" with 😞
 
01:21:29 Arthur Danzi: Thank you Father!
 
01:21:31 Steve Yu: I was having similar thoughts before joining tonight! I
felt too tired but I’m so glad I was able to make it! Thank God!
 
01:21:42 Vanessa: These classes are the highlight of my week🙂  Thank you
 
01:21:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank youfor persevering
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part VI

Where are we in the spiritual battle? Do we understand the virtues that are generally most necessary in the pursuit of virtue? So often in our day, we approach the spiritual life in a piecemeal fashion, gleaning from the writing of saints things that speak to our own particular sensibilities. But are any of these things going to help us address the dominant passions that we struggle with? 
We cannot be lazy in the labors of the spiritual life. We are blessed to be able to sit at the feet of the great elders and those who speak from experience. And yet, as with so many things in our day, we would have things come in our own time and in the way that we desire. Christianity overturns our perception of reality. What it means to love, what is truth, all comes into view only through the person of Christ. The shape of the Christian life is cruciform – always involving a dying to self and sin, and rising to new life in Christ. We must cast off the old man in order to put on the mind of Christ. Lacking discernment we may find ourselves being guided by the demons and settling into mediocrity or the embrace of selfishness and sin that merely is an aping of virtue.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:14 David Swiderski: Father do you know any good books on vigils?
00:15:56 Sharon Fisher: Would it be instructions for a home vigil service?
 
00:17:50 Anthony: For the bibliography, cookbooks are important such as
"From a Monastery Kitchen" by Bro. Victor-Antoine d'Avila-Latourrette.
 
00:19:52 Eric Ewanco: With Great Lent on our heels, do you have suggestions for overcoming gluttony and sustaining our fasts?
 
00:29:26 Andrew Adams: How does one practice the life of obedience as a layperson?
 
00:30:23 Suzanne: Isaac the Syrian is great on not putting the cart of contemplation before the horse of purification.
 
00:32:54 Maureen Cunningham: The  Monks on Mt Athose are very healthy a Doctor did a study.
 
00:35:24 Suzanne: Greek food ain't no penace for me! 😄
 
00:35:38 Vanessa: Reacted to "Greek food ain't no ..." with 😂
 
00:39:16 Anthony: Our hypochondria is driven by our societal messaging; our avarice is driven by our capitalist presuppositions wealth, usury, over-emphasis on private property.
 
00:42:54 Maureen Cunningham: I was told that Christ suffers in the broken .
 
00:43:30 Anthony: And it's hard to go against presuppositions because it feels like you're doing something wrong.
 
00:47:02 Suzanne: I quit a part time job because of the filthy language and sick behavior of my fellow employees. I did it to protect my soul.
 
00:54:04 Jeff O.: I’m reminded of a quote from a Benedictine book - “Personal Prayer” - “Our hope is at its greatest when we have absolutely no other means to provide for ourselves than to beg God for help.” When our hope is rooted deeply in our full understanding of our poverty it’s at its strongest/fullest
 
00:54:20 David Swiderski: I have found hardship to be helpful in gaining detachment from many things and faults. A saint used to say-gold is purifiied in the crucible of life.
 
00:54:21 Lee Graham: What does “recklessly despised their torture”?
 
00:55:27 Eric Ewanco: My translation @Lee Graham has "It was this marvelous grace that enabled the souls of the martyrs to rise superior to their torments."
 
00:56:29 Vanessa: St. Teresa of Calcutta always said we have to see Christ himself in the poor, broken, and suffering.  Re-aligns our focus to see the humanity in them.
 
01:07:40 sprou: is that the language of silence?
 
01:09:26 Eric Ewanco: Is ignoring the demons an option open to
everyone, or does this indicate that one is in a better spiritual position so to speak if one can do this?
 
01:11:19 Adam Paige: One of the tools of good works in the rule of Saint Benedict is “To dash at once against Christ the evil thoughts which rise in one’s heart.”
 
01:11:26 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:11:30 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethey!
 
01:11:42 Suzanne: God bless you all!
 
01:11:46 Lorraine Green: God bless, thank you
 
01:12:19 Barbara: Blessed Great Fast!!
 
01:12:22 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:12:23 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:12:24 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:12:36 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis II, Part VII and Hypothesis III, Part I

We turn now in the Evergetinos to consider the “avoidance of idleness”. With this, of course, we are compelled to consider the nature of work, and its connection to the spiritual life and our sanctification. 
Avoiding idleness is not simply keeping busy - much less busyness. It is something that allows us to prevent the mind and the heart from wandering from He who is the source of life, God. We are not angels.  We are called to provide for ourselves and also to provide for the poor. And so it is by the labor of our hands that we not only keep ourselves from becoming distracted - but enable ourselves not to become a burden to others and also to offer charity to those in need. 
Furthermore, keeping oneself from idleness also allows for the formation of virtues; obedience, self-control, ordering of the appetites, humility, etc. What is being presented to us, then, is connected to the overall portrait of what it is to be a human being; one whose life is directed completely toward God. The love that we have received and bear within us transforms everything about what it is to be a human being; to suffer, to love, and to work. It is our identity as Christians that must shape our perception of reality.
Text of chat during the group:
00:29:31 Michael Hinckley: Anthony's comment, or rebuke, hits the vainglory
 
00:35:03 Andrew Adams: What was the name of that commentary on St. Mark again?
 
00:38:32 Adam Paige: Fire of Mercy, Heart of the Word, the four-volume “Meditations on the Gospel According to St. Matthew” by Erasmo Leiva-Merikakis.
 
00:38:34 FrDavid Abernethy: Erasmo Merikakis
 
00:45:57 Michael Hinckley: can't over busyness, lack of focus be acedia
 
01:05:34 Rebecca Thérèse: The devil makes work for idle hands
 
01:14:51 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:26 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:15:53 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:06 Rachel: Thank you!!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part V

Extraordinary and beautiful! We are currently reading Step 26 from The Ladder on discernment. As St. John begins to unpack things for us, that is, what discernment allows us to perceive about our intentions, our dispositions, how virtue and vice often get mixed together, why prayers sometimes go unanswered, and why demons often will cease their attack for a period of time - - St John also shows us the beauty and the mystery of the human person in relationship to God and as created by God. 
God‘s loving care for us, when seen with the clarity of the fathers’ wisdom and experience is enough to make one weep for joy. And this joy fosters a desire for God that, if inflamed, can not only purify us of the passions but transform us in such a fashion that we are drawn into the life of the very Holy Trinity. May God grant us this desire!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:09:49 Carol Roper: St. Anne's?
 
00:31:05 Cindy Moran: I remember a few times the night before a huge exam I slept w the school book under my pillow LOL
 
00:43:18 maureencunningham: What is the time frame , if one thinks of this as a long journey or one could be discourage
 
00:48:24 Kate : There are some spiritual writings that take the form of a colloquy…Fr. Gaston Courtois, for example.  How does this fit with the dark knowing of faith, that you mentioned?  The writers seem to have such a tangible intimacy with Our Lord.
 
00:56:29 Susanna Joy: When the Lord Speaks to Your Heart: Daily Devotions (English and French Edition) https://a.co/d/4ZRzjVi
 
00:56:46 Vanessa: Replying to "When the Lord Speaks..."
 
Thank you:)
 
00:57:02 Susanna Joy: Divine Intimacy https://a.co/d/2WqoJ5e
 
00:57:43 Susanna Joy: The links are Amazon links to the books mentioned
 
01:00:46 Cindy Moran: Are the other 4 kinds of dispassion in this chapter?
 
01:01:18 Jacqulyn: An excerpt from Pauline Books... https://paulinestore.com/media/productattach/1/7/172412-compressed.pdf
 
01:02:05 Susanna Joy: Reacted to An excerpt from Paul... with "👍"
 
01:04:51 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "An excerpt from Paul..." with 🥰
 
01:06:09 Rachel: yes
 
01:09:24 Michael Hinckley: Leave Christ for Christ... is the Filippo Neri?
 
01:09:35 Michael Hinckley: that ...
 
01:10:04 Adam Paige: Reacted to "that ..." with 👍
 
01:11:58 Rachel: Our Lord was did not have passions
 
01:14:18 David Swiderski: I have been reviewing some courses for work on Emotional Intelligence and it is interesting some of the information on nueroplastisity. I keep thinking how this research could learn so much from the desert fathers. In nueroplasticity they often talk about the trigger leading to emotion leading to and action and reptitivity creating behavior.
 
01:14:50 Adam Paige: Reacted to "I have been reviewin..." with ❤️
 
01:20:22 Suzanne: Thank you!
 
01:21:57 Art: Reacted to "I have been reviewin..." with 👍
 
01:22:37 Suzanne: To Rachel, passions in the Roman Church are not disordered in themselves, but part of human nature. Our Lord had no disorder in His Body and Soul. But He had human nature.
 
01:23:06 Lorraine Green: God bless you, thank you Father
 
01:23:24 maureencunningham: Thank You Father Dave , My husband said thank you too.
 
01:23:44 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:23:45 Louise: Thanks, Fr.  Abernethy!
 
01:23:47 Cindy Moran: Excellent session... thank you Father
 
01:23:52 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:23:53 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:24:01 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 
01:24:08 Rachel: LOL thank you
 
01:24:09 Kevin Burke: Thanks you!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis II, Part VI

After listening to a multitude of stories from the Evergetinos about responding to insults from others, the only response that one seems to be able to offer is a sigh; not a sigh expressing disbelief but rather wonder. This is the love and the grace that God offers to us at every single moment of our life. A synergy exists between our will (as simple as uttering a “yes” within our hearts to God), and the outpouring of His grace and compassion. Suddenly the unthinkable comes into view through our faith. We see, through experience, the Godly love that is not only offered to us but within us. 
One of the things that we often say to ourselves when we sin or when we respond to another who is wounded us is: “I’m only human!”  However, these are not just fanciful stories in the Evergetinos but rather signs of what God is capable of doing within the human heart and what he has made us by his grace. Through humbling ourselves, acknowledging the poverty of our sin, we are lifted up to love and show compassion to others as we have received from the Lord. 
The Desert Fathers are living icons of the gospel. They reveal to us this love, not primarily through their writings but rather through their lives. We in turn come to understand this not through reading but rather through experience. May God in his mercy draw us into his love and allow us to see him face-to-face!
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:10:43 FrDavid Abernethy: page 37 number 4
 
00:44:10 Nypaver Clan: Screwtape Letters
 
00:44:49 Lee Graham: Sounds like CS Lewis’s “Screw Tape Letters”
 
00:54:03 Louise: How about psychopaths, praying for those damaging psychopaths? They seem pseudo-humans, that is, humans only in form but not in soul. They seem to be a window of the devils. I cannot pray for them. Am I wrong?
 
00:57:06 Rachel: When we sin, are we even being ehat it truly menas to be human? Even the "small" sins?
 
00:57:55 Sharon Fisher: So we pray that the Holy Spirit reaches them? That may be all I can muster in some cases. Is it enough?
 
00:58:31 Rachel: That is a beautiful prayer.
 
00:59:28 Lee Graham: Let there be peace on earth and let it begin with me.
 
01:00:05 Lori Hatala: Reacted to "Let there be peace o..." with ❤️
 
01:00:39 Vanessa: Reacted to "Let there be peace o..." with ❤️
 
01:01:57 Rachel: Imagine a masterpiece that has been defaced. Yet, by grace, God can restore His image in the sinner.
 
01:02:30 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "Let there be peace o..." with ❤️
 
01:03:38 Tracey Fredman: Jesus asks people in the gospels - he asked Solomon in a dream - and I believe he asks us, "What do you want me to do for you?" We can ask for grace to be able to pray for those who difficult for us to pray for.
 
01:04:19 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "Jesus asks people in..." with ❤️
 
01:04:24 Vanessa: Reacted to "Jesus asks people in..." with ❤️
 
01:06:56 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Let there be peace o…" with ❤️
 
01:07:20 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Imagine a masterpiec…" with ☦️
 
01:07:31 Rachel: Wow.  How beautiful.
 
01:08:50 Amale Obeid: How do you overcome the fear of needing to work for money to survive when you’re otherwise completely ready to sell everything and follow God and devote your life day in and day out to Him? To honoring him, praising him, praying, reading about him, etc… It has
become hard to live in both worlds.
 
01:15:24 Rachel: I wish I could go! God bless you all
 
01:15:37 Steve Yu: Replying to "I wish I could go! G…"
Same here!
 
01:16:23 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:24 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:16:27 Lorraine Green: Thank you very much!
 
01:16:28 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:16:29 Suzanne: God bless everyone!
 
01:16:30 Adam Paige: Thank you Father !
 
01:16:38 Lee Graham: Brilliant, thank you!!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part IV

When reading The Ladder of Divine Ascent, we begin to see that discernment is quite different from what we imagine. It is not simply the use of our reason and judgment to look at the realities around us, to dissect them, and so understand them. Discernment, as described by the fathers, is rooted in the virtue of humility. It is only when we live in He who is Truth that we come to understand the truth about ourselves, the world, and the kingdom. 
St. John in particular gives us a multiple examples of how discernment reveals to us the specific qualities of vices, how they manifest themselves and how they are to be remedied. It is curious that we often use our intellectual abilities to avoid reality or to create a certain perception of reality in our minds. It is only humility that allows us to be vulnerable; to expose the deepest part of ourselves to the light of truth. It is this vulnerability and our trust in God and his love that allows us not only to see the truth but to experience the light of it as a healing balm.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:07:17 Sr. Simeon: I hate camera!
 
00:07:35 Eric Ewanco: Reacted to "I hate camera!" with 😂
 
00:08:23 Adam Paige: Reacted to "I hate camera!" with 📷
 
00:15:31 Adam Paige: Paragraph 43 - How should one admonish a brother given to talkativeness ?
 
00:21:25 Barbara: Gabriel Bunge?
 
00:21:32 Jeff O.: Reacted to "Gabriel Bunge?" with 👍
 
00:24:36 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Gabriel Bunge?" with 👍
 
00:24:47 Adam Paige: Gabriel Bunge?
Yup ! https://a.co/d/8t9PLU5
 
00:26:48 Barbara: This translations says "malice" in place of guile.
 
00:32:55 Anthony: I believe this humility is a reason the Sunday after publican and Pharisee is fast free....so as not to be proud in fasting.
 
00:43:46 Suzanne: My dilemma has to do with fiducia supplicans.
 
00:48:53 Suzanne: Much to consider. Thank you!
 
00:51:26 Barbara: Replying to "I believe this humil..."
 
Actually, in the Eastern Christian tradition, the week after the Gospel of the Publican and Pharisee is a week without fasting so we cannot be proud about our fasting.
 
00:52:02 Louise: In a psychology experiment, participants had to do nothing for 15 minutes. However, they could prick themselves to create pain if they wanted. One-third of women pricked themselves versus two-thirds of men. These people preferred physical pain to the pain induced by silence.
 
00:59:58 Celine Fournier: How does one take on an affliction.
 
01:00:34 Anthony: Perhaps we attribute afflictions to sin as a way of justifying why we will never have afflictions....I'm not a sinner, etc.
 
01:00:57 Celine Fournier: Yes
 
01:04:43 Adam Paige: Replying to "In a psychology expe..."
 
In a psychology experiment, participants had to do nothing for 15 minutes. However, they could prick themselves to create pain if they wanted. One-third of women pricked themselves versus two-thirds of men. These people preferred physical pain to the pain induced by silence.
https://dtg.sites.fas.harvard.edu/WILSON%20ET%20AL%202014.pdf
 
01:05:56 Louise: When I gave courses to professionals across the US, I told participants that there are two main taboos in psychotherapy: love and suffering. Participants remained silent as though they knew that they DO avoid experiencing love or suffering while providing psychotherapy. Amazing and sad!
 
01:08:09 Kate : There’s a growing area of health and medicine that focuses on longevity and slowing the aging process.  While this may seem good on the surface, I wonder if this is not good for the soul.
 
01:11:53 Suzanne: Thank you!
 
01:12:14 Lorraine Green: God bless you, thank you
 
01:12:19 Sharon Fisher: Thank you all!
 
01:12:24 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:12:25 Louise: Thanks, Fr.!
 
01:12:25 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:12:31 Jeff O.: Amen! Thank you!
 
01:12:32 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis II, Part V

Humility and selfless-love often bears no resemblance to what we hold in our minds as their meaning. It is only seeing these things through the grace that God gives us and what has been revealed to us in Christ that we begin to understand that Christ took upon himself all that is human and its burden. He is Humility. He entered into the depths of our hell and the hell of our sin not only the free us from death, but that we might not experience these things in isolation. In the darkest things of this world there is always the presence of He who is light. When this world offers us no consolation, it is Christ who embraces us. 
Humility, then, becomes our willingness to let go of the self and the self-image that we have created in our own minds and that has been distorted by our sin. It means to live in the truth of Christ who is self-emptying love. This will forever be a stumbling block in this world and to the human mind. Only faith can allow us to see the presence of Christ in our midst. Furthermore, it is only this selfless love of Christ within us the can bring healing and hope to others. When faith is reduced to an ideology or philosophy it becomes impotent. We must be willing to go, as it were, where angels fear to tread. We must be willing to enter into the depths of the sorrow of the world. Yet . . . we cannot do this so long as we cling to some worldly image of ourselves or perfection. We must die to self and sin and live fully to Christ. The cure for the human condition is and ever shall be crucified and humble love.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:32:47 Michael Hinckley: to your earlier point, my guess is that saints the see being like Christ as an easy equation (1+1) , we see it as algorithms
 
00:46:03 TFredman: Personal experience with a Trappist monk who was very discerning - and helped to heal many souls, through simply sharing God's love repeatedly, consistently for many years - until the persons began to really believe the honesty in the gift of being loved - life-changing -
 
00:47:14 TFredman: Tracey
 
00:50:58 Susanna Joy: Being the presence of Christ's love over time by itself has the power to heal...yes...well said
 
00:52:56 Susanna Joy: Where 2 or 3 are gathered...there am I in your midst.  Christ's presence itself...
 
00:53:27 Sharon Fisher: This discussion reminds me off a woman who was taken hostage by a gunman — she retrieved her bible and spoke to him. (Baptist, I think, but still . . . ) If folks are interested, here’s the story:  https://www.baptistpress.com/resource-library/news/hostage-reads-purpose-driven-life-to-alleged-atlanta-killer/
 
00:54:07 Anthony: Replying to "This discussion remi..." 
 
 I believe I heard th...
 
00:55:26 Michael Hinckley: Didn't Francis say preach the gospel, use words if you have to
 
00:55:33 Anthony: That's a Spanish and Neapolitan type of image
 
01:05:23 Anthony: The multiplicity of my thoughts are showing me the necessity of praying - simple, like Jesus prayer - so as not to be exposed so much and dwell so much on thoughts.
 
01:06:04 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "The multiplicity of ..." with 👍
 
01:06:32 Vanessa: Reacted to "The multiplicity of ..." with 👍
 
01:08:25 Sharon Fisher: Is there a difference between when God confronts us with situations intended to humble us vs. situations when others exhibit their own free will, and we are unlucky recipients/bystanders?
 
01:13:28 Rebecca Thérèse: Jesus said that it is necessary that stumbling blocks come but woe to those from whom they come.
 
01:13:30 Susanna Joy: Thank you so much for leading this class, Father...your comments have been very helpful.
 
01:14:22 Lorraine Green: God bless you, thank you
 
01:14:26 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You I am always Blessed from all your teachings
 
01:14:32 Sharon Fisher: 😃
 
01:16:02 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "Jesus said that it i..." with ❤️
 
01:16:21 Michael Hinckley: what's your wife's name soI can pray for her?
 
01:16:25 TFredman: God bless you, Steve, and your wife.
 
01:16:46 Steve Yu: Replying to "what's your wife's n…"
Hi Michael, her name is Ivette Valenzuela-Yu
01:17:14 Michael Hinckley: Replying to "what's your wife's n..."
 
santa pace for her
 
01:17:30 Steve Yu: Reacted to "santa pace for her" with ❤️
 
01:17:46 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "santa pace for her" with ❤️
 
01:18:03 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father..
 
01:18:05 Andrew Adams: Thanks Father and thanks everyone for sharing!
 
01:18:09 mflory: Thank you, Father!
 
01:18:15 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part III

Sometimes we are unaware of the treasure that we possess in and through the gift of faith; and also in the living witness and writing of the Saints. As St. John speaks of discernment this treasure is magnified for us and we begin to see how precious their teachings are and the life that God has called us to embrace. Our ability to see the preciousness of these gifts allows us to enter into the life with heartfelt perception. We cannot live with one foot in the world and one foot in the kingdom. Our minds and our hearts must belong to God and we must seek Him above all things.
In great detail, St. John begins to speak to us about the gift of discernment. It is especially important and valuable for  those who have the care of souls. To be a skilled physician one must have the experience necessary to apply the appropriate medicine and that which will be healing. It is also for this reason that monastic life has been so important for the life of the church. “Angels are a light for monks, and the monastic life is a light for all men.”  They show us how important it is to learn divine truth by toil and sweat. We must give our hearts over to the ascetic life and not squander the treasure. 
How quickly one begins to see that we would be wandering blindly without the guidance of the spiritual fathers. Let show our gratitude by our imitation of their zeal.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:14:31 FrDavid Abernethy: page 194 number 23
 
00:33:20 David Swiderski: The devil speaks with a scratching, loud and gnarling voice and calls you by your sin. God calls you by name and his voice like a whisper on the wind. Only with peace and quite can we hear the whisper. - Not who wrote this but heard this from a priest in Spain on a retreat in the Pyrennes.
 
00:43:43 Sharon Fisher: Fr, please repeat the title of the second book you ref’d? I have the Eastern Monasticism and Future of the Church, but couldn’t write fast enough to get the next one. Thank you!
 
00:44:30 Anthony: That prejudice for the active life goes back to the "reformation" - I think as a way to justify the reformation.   It saw a revival in "josephism" of the 1700s and 1800s
 
01:05:38 David Swiderski: Where would resentment be placed I have seen despondency and also pride in being a victim.
 
01:06:58 Sharon Fisher: Just fyi to participants: The level of detail we get w/ Fr. David in discussions about the Fathers’ writings is not found in very many places. I’ll put a plug in for a guided book study on You Tube: St Silouan the Athonite Guided Book Study with Isaac Lampart, written by Archimandrite Sophrony.  The videos are hosted by Annunciation Greek Orthodox Church Lancaster, PA. It’s very good; but it’s hard to find the actual book. It took me a few months of monitoring used book sites to get a copy.
 
01:07:01 mhinckley: that;s virtue signaling, no. Just the other side of the vaingflory coin, no?
 
01:08:04 mhinckley: despondency and also pride in being a victim.
01:10:16 Sean: Replying to "Just fyi to particip..."
 
I really long for this sort of content now but it's non existent AFIK😢
 
01:12:40 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You many Blessing
 
01:12:44 Jeff O.: thank you!
 
01:13:16 Lorraine Green: Thank you, wonderful retreat!
 
01:13:23 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:27 Rachel: Thank you.
 
01:13:27 mflory: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:29 Louise: Ha ve good retreat, Fr. !
 
01:13:33 David Swiderski: Thank you father! Have a great retreat!
 
01:13:35 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...we'll be praying for you
 
01:13:35 Art: Thank you safe travels
 
01:13:38 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!! Thank you!
 
01:13:38 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:41 sue and mark: yjank you God bless good retreat
 
01:13:42 Kevin Burke: Thanks
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis II, Part IV

Where is true freedom to be found? How do we recognize it within the human person? The fathers of The Evergetinos reveal it to us in a powerful fashion by speaking to us once again about humility and the manner in which we respond both to insults and to praise. 
Freedom comes from clearly seeing where true dignity and identity is found in ourselves and in others. We evaluate ourselves and others often by accidental qualities and external behaviors. As Christians, however, faith is meant to illuminate what we have become in Christ. We are called to something far greater than natural virtue. Grace builds on nature. Even the greatest kindness we could show another person or forbearance in the face of slight or insult is hardly recognizable and comparison to what our response must be in Christ. 
With the incarnation life has forever changed as well as our understanding of love and mercy. We cannot allow ourselves the too easy freedom of loving or hating others merely because of what they do or say to us. The only way that we are allowed to respond to another is to love them. 
This cannot be an abstract notion for us. We should believe it so deeply, embody it so fully, that “Contrarily, as though they entailed fearful death, the destruction of your soul, and eternal damnation, completely turn away from and despise all love of power and glory, and the desire for the various laudations of men“. I don’t think there is a stronger way of stating this!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:45:29 Ambrose Little, OP: Powerful stuff!
 
00:45:51 Amale Obeid: I’m newly relearning the Christian faith so I apologize if this is off track but it seems to me that the every reaction that is caused between the world or another person and myself is what I take to the vertical of the cross - between me and God. The horizontal between me and others is for their service only.
 
00:49:49 Vanessa: Goes back to love God and love thy neighbor (that includes love our enemies).
 
00:57:42 Sean: Is no. 6 against nature, I mean man is hierchical by nature, like troops of
apes
 
01:14:25 Rebecca Thérèse: It seems like sound advice to me and could protect people from abuse by narcissists who try to make others dependent on them for self-esteem. Also cults try to recruit people by love-bombing. Humility and level-headedness can protect from these things.
 
01:14:30 Amale Obeid: How do we actually practice this? Other than slowing down time so much to allow space for a slower reaction? Or do we ask God for this grace to recognize it immediately in the moment?
 
01:16:31 Rachel: I am thinking of how really truly seeing the other, and ourselves as living icons, realizing our dignity helps in a way to reign in inflated egos as we realize how it is a pure gift of God, It reigns in the anger that can rise up in reaction to mistreatment by the humbling reality of Whose image we are all made. Also, I wonder, how we approach God, and the Saints, if how we see God, the way we pray, the experience of our life in God affects how we react to praise or insult
 
01:18:27 Vanessa: Replying to "I am thinking of how..."
 
St. Francis of Assisi talks about how we can go beyond what is natural (feelings towards others) through love of God. A mark of holiness.
 
01:19:07 Rachel: Reacted to "St. Francis of Assis..." with 😇
 
01:19:33 Vanessa: Reacted to "Yes, that balance is..." with 👍
 
01:23:34 Rachel: Replying to "I am thinking of how..."
 
I erased it as you already said what I typed
 
01:24:03 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂Have a good retreat!
 
01:24:14 Rachel: Replying to "I am thinking of how..."
 
😇
 
01:24:14 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:24:19 Susanna Joy: Thank you so much, Father. Blessings on your retreat. You will be in my prayers.
 
01:24:56 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:24:58 mflory: Thank you, Father!
 
01:25:00 Rachel: Replying to "I am thinking of how..."
 
Thank you!
 
01:25:09 Louise: Have a great retreat !
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part II

A glimmer of light begins to shine through the writing of St. John in regards to the perfection of virtue. John starts by putting before us list of those things that we should focus upon as beginners in the spiritual life or those who have reached an intermediate level. He also puts before us the resolution of those who are advanced; that is, the virtues that one possesses at this level and that they must protect. John is trying to paint with broad strokes the image of life in Christ. As one begins to share in that reality more deeply Christ image begins to manifest itself and we become imitators of Him.
As John unpacks for us the nature of discernment he shows us the things that it allows us to perceive. One of the valuable teachings he offers us is our responsiveness to the grace of God in times of illness. In our infirmity the demons will seek to afflict us on spiritual level.  Yet John also shows us that our minds and hearts can be purified at such times and that Christ can cleanse “clay by clay”. In the severity of our illness we can be delivered from certain passions.
These last steps of the Ladder of Divine Ascent must be read closely and slowly. It is solid food upon which we are being fed and a deep wisdom that is being set before us. Glory to God!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:07:41 FrDavid Abernethy: page 192 para 17
 
00:09:03 Rachel: :(
 
00:26:12 Anthony Rago: Sounds familiar
 
00:32:19 Sam: Need for fasting particularly during the many periods of discernment has helped many saints and Christians not only tame their passions but clear their minds from any attachments and thus take the path God wants of them. Could it be due to the humble stripping of self from earthly things and abandonment to God's grace, wisdom and mercy? Yes
 
00:38:12 Michael Hinckley: didn't Augustine say "you pray the most when you say the least and pray the least when you say the most."
 
00:43:13 Rory: Let, God's grace shine upon my silent faith within my temple of the Holy Spirit revealing your  Divine Providence
 
00:43:31 Vanessa: Reacted to "Let, God's grace shi..." with ❤️
 
00:57:35 Maureen Cunningham: Sound like addiction the first part
 
00:57:59 Anthony Rago: I think it's important for a weakened person to discern what is his weakness versus what is actually a sin or wrong.  The devil wears disguises and blames you for it.
 
01:09:08 Sean: I assume clay is man, but what is the clay that cleanses him?
 
01:11:49 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: A personal "testimony": a half dozen years ago, I was too sick to get out of bed for several weeks. The consolations and spiritual awareness at this time was so profound for me that I thought I was arriving at a  level of illumination that I would never leave. A couple of weeks after recovery, however, I found myself struggling with the same sin. I had not advanced as I thought. But I'm grateful for the consolation.
 
01:14:28 Rebecca Thérèse: Is it because illness brings us closer to death that we may experience a greater closeness to the eternal?
 
01:15:45 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:16:09 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Reacted to "Is it because illnes..." with ❤️
 
01:16:30 sue and mark: thank you.
 
01:16:39 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:40 mflory: Thank you, Father!
 
01:16:41 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:16:44 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 
01:16:44 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:16:47 kevin: Thanks
 
01:16:48 Louise: Thanks, Father!
 
01:16:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:16:56 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Blessed Feast
 
01:17:02 Kevin Burke: Thanks you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis II, Part III

If reading the gospel or reading the Fathers speak to us about walking the path of humility does not turn our life upside down, does not agitate the mind and the heart; and indeed, at times bring us to the place of atheism or the edge of sanity, then it is hard to imagine that it is Christianity that we are considering. We’ve grown so used to a evaluating what it is to be a human being and to live one’s life, the nature of self-esteem and self image, outside the context of the gospel that there is no longer anything recognizable as Christian.  Can we even answer the question, “What does it mean to be a Christian?“ Does the anthropology, psychology and spirituality of the desert Fathers find any place within our hearts or our vision of our life in this world? 
We see the Fathers willing to go to the depths of earthly hell in their pursuit of humility in order to be raised up to the heights of heaven. They came to understand that when one reaches for heaven by pride, one falls into the depths of Hell. This was not notional for them but real. Is our faith more than an idea? One of the reasons the fathers seem to so freely take this path of foolishness and absurdity is that they began to taste the freedom and the joy of the kingdom that comes through it. Where else do we find identity and dignity that cannot be taken away from us except with and in Christ?
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:12:10 Michael Hinckley: FR. I picked up A Guide to Living in the Truth. Thanks for the suggestion
 
00:12:34 FrDavid Abernethy: The Michael Casey book?
 
00:12:39 FrDavid Abernethy: on Humility?
 
00:13:22 Michael Hinckley: Yes
 
00:14:27 Adam Paige: Reacted to "FR. I picked up A Gu..." with 👍
 
00:19:55 Lori Hatala: www.ctosonline.org/patristic/EvCT.html
 
00:20:27 Lori Hatala: for Evergetinos books.
 
00:26:53 Adam Paige: Reacted to "for Evergetinos book..." with 👍
 
00:40:08 Michael Hinckley: there is also an intense marketing that bombards of self help (non Christ focused) to recognize as soft attacks...
 
00:40:31 Vanessa: Reacted to "there is also an int..." with 👍
 
00:40:49 Carol Roper: His response to the camel driver comment, his happiness, helps me understand the wisdom of the holy fool, who sometimes almost seems to provoke those comments from others. There’s a wisdom in seeing the disapproval of others as protective of one’s soul. I’m thinking of the movie ostrov
 
00:41:00 Adam Paige: Reacted to "there is also an int..." with 😖
 
00:42:04 Carol Roper: The island
 
00:43:15 Eric Ewanco: I think there is truth in the idea that the phenomenon of "low self-esteem" is really a hidden expression of pride
 
00:45:43 Michael Hinckley: Many times too self deprecating humor or a clamoring of being such a 'sinner" can also be forms of vanity, no?
 
00:45:51 Adam Paige: Reacted to "The island" with 🥾
 
00:46:15 Michael Hinckley: I think Dom Lorenzo Scupoli warned against it.
 
00:51:26 Carol Roper: Reacted to "The island" with 🥾
 
01:01:53 Carol Roper: But given your previous comment about the tongues, it’s not foolishness it’s truthfulness…humility
 
01:02:14 Carol Roper: We’re just blind to the truth
 
01:05:12 Michael Hinckley: Father do you know the greek or latin used when translated to foolish?
 
01:05:40 Rebecca Thérèse: Being considered a fool by all would bring someone closer to Christ because that person would not be distracted by the esteem of others. It's not so helpful being considered a fool by all if others think they need to fix you because this is also a distraction!
 
01:05:46 Eric Ewanco: How do we live this rejection of praise out in, say, a corporate or professional environment where praise plays an important feedback role?
 
01:06:33 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "Being considered a f..." with 👍
 
01:07:24 Adam Paige: Replying to "How do we live this ..."
 
How do we live this rejection of praise out in, say, a corporate or professional environment where praise plays an important feedback role?
I have the same question, since we're also encouraged to praise others in the professional environment
 
01:09:52 Sam: Shunning praise in a professional environment especially is hard but comments such as i could've done better help us....+  embracing humiliation or negative feedback... and only relying on + seeking God's mercy is the narrow path we need to walk...praying always ...a good start for us is the  Jesus Prayer.
 
01:10:06 Rebecca Thérèse: Replying to "How do we live this ..."
 
I think there may be a difference between praise and flattery. It's helpful sometimes to have positive feedback to know how well you're performing. I think it's also possible not to react to praise with pride.
 
01:11:01 Anthony Rago: Again....apprenticeship.  The Modern Era's emphasis on souls who are autonomous and blank slates to explore the world on their own has hurt all kinds of religious and secular vocations.
 
01:11:36 Vanessa: Reacted to "Again....apprentices..." with 👍
 
01:12:05 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Shunning praise in a..." with 👍
 
01:12:16 Adam Paige: Reacted to "I think there may be..." with 👍
 
01:13:13 Michael Hinckley: I need to drop Happy and Holy New Year to you all!
 
01:15:17 Adam Paige: Father do you know the greek or latin used when translated to foolish?
Greek text of Evergetinos Volume II https://drive.google.com/file/d/14g2zvr-CSwHV5qmke5PHGGBAYYzWRNa9/view
 
01:16:23 Louise: Thanks, Fr.!
 
01:17:04 Sharon Fisher: And to your spirit!
 
01:17:05 mflory: Thank you, Father!
 
01:17:13 Andrew Adams: Thank you Father!
 
01:17:16 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you, Happy New Year everyone🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXVI: On Discernment, Part I

The fruit of humility is the emergence of discernment. For beginners, it is a true knowledge of themselves. For intermediate souls, it is a spiritual sense that distinguishes what is truly good from what is of nature or opposed to it. For the perfect it is knowledge that one comes by through divine illumination. God illuminates the darkness within by his grace. 
St. John begins to define for us the nature of this gift. However, what follows is quite different from how we in modern times think of discernment. So often it does not rise above private judgment or the natural virtue of distinguishing between the nature of things in accord with our intellect. Yet, as mentioned, discernment is a divine gift for which one prepares to receive through the grace of God and the ascetic life. 
We must seek to remove every impediment to our having a well formed conscience. Furthermore, we must avoid the traps that the evil one sets for us to draw us back in darkness. We must continue toiling in this fashion until the very fire of God enters the sanctuary of the human heart and renders our proclivity for sin powerless and consumes every fever of lust and movement of passion within us. Knowing that the demons seek to extinguish this light, we must constantly press on in the struggle. We must not believe ourselves incapable of engaging in the spiritual battle but always trust in the action of God‘s grace. 
Once St. John defined discernment for us, he begins to lay out the path of education in the spiritual life that is needed. He warns us not to stop with the beginner’s lessons but rather to press on and strive to advance in our understanding. What we must come to value above all things is the science of sciences and the art of arts – that is the wisdom of the fathers. In comparison to our worldly formation, how deeply do we penetrate the treasure of their teachings?
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Text of chat during the group:
00:08:59 FrDavid Abernethy: Step 26 page 190
 
00:09:18 FrDavid Abernethy: On discernment of thoughts, passions and virtues
 
00:14:54 Sean: Isaac's awesome.
 
00:15:02 Art: Isaac the Syrian or Life of Repentance and Purity
 
00:15:32 Vanessa: Replying to "Isaac's awesome."
 
Agreed!
 
00:16:19 Sean: Replying to "Isaac's awesome."
 
I'm reading it a second time right now, slowly and listening to the old podcast.
 
00:25:21 Sean: #4. Why would one fall into disbelief upon seeing the supernatural? I would think it would lead one to believe in something more than oneself.
 
00:25:46 Vanessa: Reacted to "I'm reading it a sec..." with 👍
 
00:44:59 Sean: It's interesting that he links soul and mind in #11, which he also does in #8. These two are usually seen as separate or at least distinct, with the soul being pure. It's like the mind reflects the soul and the soul can go toward either good or bad.
 
01:00:22 Sean: pleasures = mud in the story, I would think.
 
01:18:43 Greg Chura: Thank you, Father!
 
01:19:52 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:53 mflory: Thank you, Father!
 
01:19:54 Jeff O.: thank you!
 
01:20:26 Jeff O.: Palamas!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part V

Tonight we concluded our reading of step 25 on humility. I have no other way to describe my experience of reading this step other than the fact that it makes something within the heart leap for joy. For over the past months, what we have been shown is that humility is not simply a virtue that one strives to attain but rather a kind of truthful living that acknowledges God as the source of all. 
Beyond that, however, we are shown that humility is part of the very essence of God that has been revealed to us through the incarnation.  God shows himself as Holy Humility.  In loving us, God comes down to us and takes our life, our identity, our burden upon himself. The sense of lack and incompleteness at the very heart of our lives is filled by the God who comes to us and gives himself to us. 
Humility is so often presented to us as a kind of self hatred; whereas, in reality, it allows us to see not simply our weakness and our sin but the love of God with perfect clarity. Above all, St. John tells, us we should strive for humility. It is the narrow way. One must acknowledge one’s smallness in order to receive and participate in the greatness of the love of the one who created us. What better means do we have to do so than the Feast of the Nativity - unto us and child is born!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:56:01 Sharon Fisher: Backing up a bit — the fasts can be harmful, physically. I’ve experienced and know of others who had negative physical effects trying to do the prescribed thing. Yet, I haven’t had a priest directly suggest that it can be modified as necessary — but they say it’s not to be taken legalistically.
 
01:04:12 Ambrose Little, OP: Transfers liquid from one container to another
 
01:04:38 Ambrose Little, OP: Sucks you up into heaven. 🙂
 
01:04:40 Art: carries a liquid from a higher level up and over a barrier and then down to a lower level
 
01:04:49 Mitch: “Waterspout” in the translation in front of me
 
01:04:52 Sean: I thought of it as like a tornado sucking one up to heavan
 
01:10:14 Victor: Reacted to "I thought of it as l…" with 👍
 
01:11:06 Victor: Thanks, Father. Merry Christmas to all! 🎄💐
 
01:11:11 Daniel Allen: What’s interesting to me is that it seems all other virtues do not by nature exclude pride, a type of natural perfection, only humility excludes pride and why it’s the only virtue that cannot be imitated by the demons as John said. But the difference is that all other virtues can be beautifully acquired, while humility is only received by acknowledgment of our own lack. Our own lack of other virtues even. Does that make sense? If so, while humility may be the God like virtue it is also terrifying.
 
01:11:25 Brian L: Reacted to I thought of it as l... with "👍"
 
01:11:46 Jeff O.: Reacted to "What’s interesting t..." with 👍
 
01:11:48 Vanessa: Reacted to "What’s interesting t..." with 👍
 
01:15:42 Art: Merry Christmas everyone!!
 
01:15:43 Lorraine Green: Merry Christmas!  Thank you Father
 
01:15:45 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you. Happy Christmas everyone🙂
 
01:15:48 Ambrose Little, OP: 🎄
 
01:15:48 mflory: Thank you, Father! Merry Christmas!
 
01:15:48 Jeff O.: Merry Christmas! Thank you
 
01:15:49 TFredman: Thank you, Merry Christmas everyone!
 
01:15:51 Deiren: Merry Christmas father and everyone!
 
01:15:58 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: Blessed Christmas!
 
01:16:01 Mitch: Merry Christmas!! Thankyou very much
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis II, Part II

The stories of the humility of the Saints and monks described in The Evergetinos can be hard to stomach. But if we consume them with the spirit of faith and the desire for God, they will nourish us to everlasting life. 
All of them point us to Christ himself - the prototype and standard of all virtue. We are ever so fortunate. It is amazing when you slow down and hear the story, read out loud how impactful it can be. When we can let go of our own critical spirit, when we can suspend judgment and simply allow ourselves to listen with faith then often we come to understand something astounding. 
As is so often the case in The Evergetinos, we see that embodying the virtue of Christ, living the gospel concretely, has the capacity to work miracles, to raise the dead, and to give enliven faith within the hearts of others. May the gift of these stories take root in our hearts and produce fruit that is pleasing to God!
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Text of chat during the group:
00:09:30 FrDavid Abernethy: page 23 letter B
 
00:27:30 sharonfisher: Was he relieved of the obligation to tithe or was his tired refused? I don’t think I understand.
 
00:27:51 sharonfisher: *Or was his tithe refused
 
00:36:25 Louise: Could we say that, to be made humble, Peter was made to renounce Jesus Christ 3 times as predicted by Our Lord? The proud Peter humiliated himself tremendously by doing so.
 
00:37:53 Steve Yu: Reacted to "Could we say that, t…" with 👍
 
00:52:35 Sean: Interesting how the one knew about the scheme by 'spiritual insight'. Isaac the Syrian calls that teoria or basically the soul's knowing, in other words he got this info not by hearing or the body's senses.
 
01:04:31 Steve Yu: It seems so ironic to me that humiliation can bring us closer to God, and yet (speaking for myself), something that I try to avoid by instinct. It’s as if some of my instincts are programmed against growing closer to Him.
 
01:05:15 Sheila Applegate: I love this story. The humility to say, "yes, I am a corrupt, sinful person" but, "no, I do not reject God." Even in that horrid weakness of soul.
 
01:11:30 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father, good night
 
01:11:43 mflory: Wonderful! Thank you, Father!
 
01:11:44 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part IV

It is impossible to capture in words the joy that sweeps over the heart when one comes to understand what St. John Climacus is revealing to us about the nature of humility. In this step, he strips away all of our limited, false, or distorted perceptions of humility and reveals it for what it is: a gift of God‘s own self. 
After reading Step 25 our understanding of humility is forever changed. We are shown that God reveals the nature of humility by revealing himself to us in his Son. “Humility is Christ’s spiritual doctrine,” St. John tells us.  “It is introduced into the inner chamber of the soul by those who are counted worthy of it. It cannot be defined by perceptible words.”  Rather, by the grace of God, the heart is purified of the passions and all impediments are removed to our receiving God’s gifts. One of the greatest of those gifts is humility. 
This virtue is a participation in the life of God. Whatever we might lose of honor or dignity in the world is nothing in comparison to the joy that Christ offers us through this virtue.  “He who humbles himself will be exalted”.  We may feel that we are falling into an abyss and losing our identity as we let go of our attachment to the things of this world. However, what we are falling into is actually the abyss of God‘s love. We are letting go of the false self in order that we might be immersed in He who is meaning, He who is truth, He who is reality! 
What joy should be ours, St. John tells us: “By this shall all men know that we are God’s disciples, not because the devils are subject to us, but because our names are written in the Heaven of Humility.”
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Text of chat during the group:
00:08:00 FrDavid Abernethy: page 185 number 32
 
00:12:50 Anthony Rago: Fr Christopher Zugger 2 Vol History of Byzantine Catholic Church published by Byzantine Seminary Press
 
00:34:18 Anthony Rago: This is where nietzche's emphasis of will is important for us
 
00:35:31 Louise: I resonate with this definition of humility - we owe everything to God. I resonate see less to humility as defined in the Evergetinos as a self-deprecation. The former focuses about God, while the latter focuses on self.
 
00:40:39 Daniel Allen: How does this conversation about self a basement and not hatred factor in with John talking about the prison
earlier?
 
00:50:50 Anthony Rago: Oh, so to grasp at humility - to be avaricious for it - is masochism?  For all good things are actually gifts,  not seized upon like a miser?
 
00:53:37 Jacqulyn: Amen!
 
00:57:22 Suzanne: According to this understanding, humility, like contemplation, requires that we wait for God. “Expect the Lord, do manfully, let thy heart take courage, and wait thou for the Lord.”
 
01:00:09 Sean: Are views, the like button and thumbs up the modern methods of mass vainglory?
 
01:03:27 mflory: I think the story about Symeon is from the Alphabetical Sayings of the Desert Fathers. In the translation that I have, he is called Simon.
 
01:03:44 Suzanne: Replying to "Are views, the like ..."
 
Yes!
 
01:03:58 Cindy Moran: I studied 3 yrs with Fr Van Kaam &  Dr susan Muto
 
01:05:40 Nypaver Clan: Is it open to the public now?
 
01:06:51 Cindy Moran: This is so exciting!!
 
01:07:04 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I think the story ab..." with 👍
 
01:13:18 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:30 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Father
 
01:13:31 Lorraine Green: God bless you, thank you Father
 
01:13:31 Louise: Thanks, Fr.!
 
01:13:38 Suzanne: Thank you
 
01:13:54 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father!
 
01:14:03 Victor Haburchak: Thanks
 
01:14:07 Cindy Moran: Great session!! Thank you Father!
 
01:14:11 Leilani Nemeroff: Thanks!
 
01:14:13 mflory: Thank you, Father
 
01:14:15 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis I, Part III and Hypothesis II, Part I

Once again, reading the fathers on humility is humbling. Gradually our eyes are opened to the nature and reality of virtue; not as human reason or understanding grasp, but as it has been revealed to us in Christ and through the gift of His Spirit. 
This stands forth most of all in thinking about humility among the virtues. It is not self hatred. It is not self contempt. It is living in He who is Truth. For this reason, both the Evergetinos and St. John Climacus describe humility as the “door to the kingdom” and to participation in the very glory of God. It is also for this reason that we discover that just as the proud feel satisfaction with honors so those who are humble of mind are especially thankful for the attacks and scorn which befall them in this world. 
Such things free us from illusion; not only the illusions we have about ourselves but also the illusions that others often form about us. To be thought of as virtuous and holy, when in reality one understands that all is Grace, can be the bitterest of things to swallow. To know oneself as loved with an everlasting love and having been shown the mercy of God makes the thought of evaluating oneself in any measure seem absurd.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:32 FrDavid Abernethy: page 13 Letter G - Volume 2
 
00:18:21 Nypaver Clan: What page?
 
00:42:31 Louise: The Catholic protagonist of the movie entitled ''A Hidden Life'' (2019), a true story, is a beautiful example of humility. In 1943, he did NOT justify why he preferred to be tortured and killed by the SS, his compatriots, than signing an oath to Hitler. His heart belonged to Jesus Christ. His wife, also devoted to Christ, supported his decision despite the difficult hardship this brought to her and her three children. Two contemporary unknown saints!
 
00:43:07 Adam Paige: Reacted to "The Catholic protago…" with ❤️
 
00:43:41 Michael Hinckley: Blessed Franz Jagerstatter
 
00:44:08 Michael Hinckley: yes that'shim
 
00:44:26 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Blessed Franz Jagers…" with 👌
 
00:58:19 Michael Hinckley: how much these storis show you must be prepared to be dressed down
 
00:58:20 Louise: Isn't the greatest test to stay facing praises?
 
01:01:26 Michael Hinckley: I can only imagine in the monastic life with having nothing of the world (clothes, possessions, etc.. ) that things like praise risks becoming currency.
 
01:08:06 Anthony Rago: Having lived in s Calvinist environment, alarm bells are going off in my head about this kind of humility.
 
01:08:42 Anthony Rago: We have to keep humility In  Tension with dignity.
 
01:08:54 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Having lived in s Ca…" with 😄
 
01:10:09 Sean: how often is one despised for humility vs. for being beyond  the pale of socially accepted behavior, crime, depravity etc. Equating the two seems difficult.
 
01:10:21 Michael Hinckley: Replying to "Having lived in s Ca..."
 
Great point!
 
01:10:22 Rebecca Thérèse: It's not easy to know the difference between heartfelt praise and flattery that's intended to manipulate so it's often better not to trust it
 
01:11:53 Michael Hinckley: One of the greatest deceptions is meekness equates weakness as apposed the fortitude.
 
01:12:51 Suzanne: I just read something today that said that the purer the heart, the more the soul sees God, and, the more it sees God, the more it understands its own wretchedness. This wretchedness is not a comparison with other men, but with the absolute purity of God.
 
01:15:25 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "It's not easy to kno..." with 👍
 
01:16:21 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "I just read somethin..." with
👍
 
01:17:17 Leilani Nemeroff: Dolores Hart 
https://vocal.media/viva/the-hollywood-actress-who-became-a-nun
 
01:17:37 Michael Hinckley: what was the book you mentioned again please
 
01:18:13 Suzanne: Great Stories tonight! Thank you!
 
01:18:35 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.
 
01:18:41 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:18:46 Louise: hanks!!!
 
01:18:56 Leilani Nemeroff: Thanks!
 
01:19:00 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:04 Michael Hinckley: good night all
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part III

The language that St. John Climacus uses to describe humility and its qualities is striking. In fact, in some ways it becomes unsettling. Unsettling - - because we often approach humility in an abstract fashion; as thinking little of ourselves, acknowledging our poverty and our sin. 
What we discover in John’s writing is that humility is of the very essence of God and how God has revealed himself to us. To grow in this virtue is to find ourselves entering into the abyss of God‘s love. As we fall in our own estimation, we are in reality falling into the love and mercy of God. St. John describes humility as the “door to the kingdom”. It is the same way that Christ describes himself. “I am the door.“ Christ is humility and to be conformed to him, to enter into a union of love with him, is to pass into the very pasture of paradise. 
Thus, to enter into the monastic life or the Christian life through any other door is to make ourselves thieves and robbers of our own life. In other words, it is to seek to seize for ourselves what only comes to us as a gift from God. While we were still enemies of God, he took our flesh and its burden upon himself, he humbled himself and became obedient in order that we might share in the fullness of his life. As those so redeemed, what other path could we dare travel?
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:42 FrDavid Abernethy: page 182
 
00:11:55 Suzanne: Amore, Amore!!!
 
00:28:12 Anthony Rago: Didn't St Paul say he didn't even judge himself?
 
00:35:38 Suzanne: But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true adorers shall adore the Father in spirit and in truth. For the Father also seeketh such to adore him.
 
00:36:17 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: The idea of humility of heart will be on the lips, reminds me that it seems to me when I say she or he or you "made me" angry, etc., it's not so much about the other but God shining the light on where He wants to work with me on humility or other aspects of theosis. No one made me but merely revealed where I need God's touch of humility or healing.
 
00:37:38 Jeff O.: Reacted to "The idea of humility..." with 👍
 
00:38:05 Suzanne: Reacted to "The idea of humility..." with ❤️
 
00:44:53 Suzanne: My take home from what I’ve studied with you so far, is that humility is a great grace, and a participation of God, and not something we can attain solely by our own effort. We do best to work to dispose ourselves to receive it.
 
00:47:03 Cindy Moran: How would St John Climacus advise us to ask for a raise?...Or just don't do it.
 
00:47:23 Rebecca Thérèse: The chasm between the holiness of God and fallen humanity is so great, it's impossible not to be humble once someone has perceived it
 
00:49:20 Suzanne: Reacted to "How would St John Cl..." with 😂
 
00:49:53 Cindy Moran: Yes I'm serious
 
00:49:55 Suzanne: Reacted to "The chasm between th..." with 👍
 
00:58:16 Anthony Rago: I believe a post Communion prayer by St Basil the Great, in the Teal Ruthenian Book, asks God that the Holy Body and Blood be for the healing of our feelings or emotions.
 
01:03:31 Sean: from St.Basil's post communion Prayer: O Lord who love us all, you died and rose for our sake; and you have given us these awesome and life-creating mysteries for the benefit and sanctification of our souls and bodies. Grant that they may bring about the healing of my soul and body; the defeat of every enemy; the enlightenment of the eyes of my heart; the calming of my thoughts and emotions; a faith that cannot be confounded; a love that does not pretend; a wisdom that overflows; the full observance of your commandments; the increase of your divine grace; and citizenship in your kingdom. Being preserved in your holiness by them, I will remember your love at all times.
 
01:05:09 Anthony Rago: Reacted to from St.Basil's post... with "❤️"
 
01:05:20 Sean: yes
 
01:05:33 Daniel Allen: I get seeing the good in others and not seeking to lift oneself up in comparison to others, but if we examine ourselves constantly or even too often, how do we avoid become neurotic? How do we examine ourselves constantly and remain gentle tand patient to ourselves?
 
01:06:03 Suzanne: I wonder if a sign of growing humility is the subsiding of hair trigger emotional reactions to things people say.
 
01:13:12 Ambrose Little, OP: From Unseen Warfare: ‘If a man does not rely on himself but puts his trust in God, when he falls he is not greatly surprised and is not overcome with excessive grief, for he knows that it is the result of his own impotence, and, above all, of the weakness of his trust in God. So his downfall increases his distrust of himself and makes him try all the harder to increase and deepen his humble trust in God.’
 
Seems like part of not getting down on ourselves and anxious/neurotic is accepting that we are weak and allowing God to fill our weakness with His power.
 
01:14:34 Suzanne: Reacted to "From Unseen Warfare:..." with ❤️
 
01:15:37 Cindy Moran: My apologies if my question seemed flippant about asking for a raise. I suppose that everyone knows now that I've never been able to do it in 60 years of my profession.
 
01:15:58 Jeff O.: Nicodemus of the Holy Mountain too
 
01:16:38 Cindy Moran: Thank you, Father
 
01:18:09 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:18:16 Suzanne: Thank you, Father, for your help!
 
01:18:56 Cindy Moran: Good night to all.
 
01:18:59 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:19:00 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:19:06 mflory: Beautiful! Thank you!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis I, Part II

In hypothesis 1 of book 2 of The Evergetinos, we continue to hear one story after another of the humility of the fathers. Again and again, what we find emphasized is the willingness to set aside the self and the ego. We cling so fiercely to a sense of self-esteem and religious identity that gives us a sense of value or elevates us in the view of others. However, as with so many of the virtues, we find the monks, loving humility; pursuing it precisely because of what it produces within the soul and the freedom that it brings. 
What it produces is not the perfection of virtue as we understand it. By letting go of the self, Christ lifts us up to share in his life and glory. Thus, we find repeated stories of monks trying to hide themselves and any recognition of their holiness by fleeing the company of men. Yet, so often they find themselves discovered because the very glory of God shines forth from their countenance. 
The opposite of vice is not virtue, but rather Christ living within us. We put on Christ. We are conformed to him by Grace. If the world is attracted to anything, it is to that reality. The monks understood this. The only thing they feared was being drawn away from the path of humble obedience.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:09:58 Suzanne: I found the exact volume we're starting on kindle for $9.99
 
00:10:10 Steve Yu: Reacted to "I found the exact vo…" with 👍
 
00:10:22 Steve Yu: Excellent. Thank you!
 
00:10:53 Suzanne: I tried my mic. It doesn't work. Yes, Amazon kindle.
 
00:12:14 Suzanne: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07ZJGFSPL/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_d_asin_title_o00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
00:12:45 Steve Yu: Reacted to "https://www.amazon.c…" with ❤️
 
00:31:44 Adam Paige: The Kindle version of the Evergetinos is a different translation. I believe this is the one Father is reading from: https://a.co/d/fcClhxD
 
00:32:38 Suzanne: Replying to "The Kindle version o..."
 
Yes, I enjoy it.
 
00:33:02 Suzanne: Reacted to "The Kindle version o..." with 👍
 
00:34:11 Rod Castillo: Litany of Humility
 
00:35:03 Suzanne: Card. Merry del Val
 
00:38:03 Rebecca Thérèse: When St John of the Cross was in the final weeks of his life he had to go from is hermitage to a monastery for them to take care of him. He chose to go to Ubeda rather than Baeza because he was known in Baeza and he didn't want the attention his holiness would attract there.
 
00:45:52 Suzanne: Roman Discipline, Order, and Common Sense. The Church understands both the power of the official worship of the Church and the feebleness of human nature.
 
01:08:44 Suzanne: Thank you, Father!
 
01:08:44 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:08:46 Lorraine Green: Thank you FAther
 
01:09:33 Louise: Thanks, Fr.
 
01:09:34 Adam Paige: Thanks you so much, Father !
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXV: On Humility, Part II

It is a curious thing to be humbled by hearing a saint speak about humility. Yet, this is what happens. In and of itself, it reveals to us how far the human heart can be from grasping not only the nature of the virtue but what God has revealed to us in his only begotten Son. 
The Incarnation manifests to us this virtue in its full glory. The word of God, through whom all things have been created, becomes an infant, (infans), that is, “wordless one”. God draws back the veil in order that we might see and comprehend for ourselves the depth of His love and also the life and virtue that we are to embrace as those made in his image and likeness. To embrace Holy Humility, the very life of God, means to let go of our attachment to the things of this world or good deeds accomplished by our own hands. We begin to comprehend with greater clarity and firmness that all is Grace. 
To acknowledge this is to die to self and sin; it is, as John describes it, “reposing securely in the casket of modesty”. The humble heart becomes impervious and unmovable to the demons. As a quality of the Divine, it is not something that we can gauge in its perfection. John, however, works to help us understand its distinguishing characteristics.  One is struck by the fact that the humility of beginners is as different and distinct from the humility of the perfect as yeast and flour are from bread.  Purified by the fire of God‘s love it is freed from all of pride. This is something only God can reveal to us. 
God reveals himself to us in and through the gift of faith. We cannot approach him or the truth that he reveals with a consumerists mentality or seek to dissect these realities as we do with so many things in this world.  It is His light that reveals the depths of the human heart and it is His Spirit of Truth that draws us in the very depths of God.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:33 FrDavid Abernethy: page 181 number 4
 
00:09:25 David Swiderski: Have you heard about the Holy Resurrection Monestary in Wisconsin. They offer retreats but I just was wondering if they are worthwhile?
 
00:10:17 Jake: I was there for 3 days, it was a great retreat
 
00:14:07 Cindy Moran: Antiochian village?
 
00:36:57 Sharon Fisher: How does one try to take this step if a spouse or close friend doesn’t welcome the transformation we intend to make? You can’t just cut them off; you can be sincere in faith and not burden them with it until they see the (positive) change?
 
00:37:40 Carol: this discussion reminds me of Isadora from Evergetinos
 
00:38:32 Carol: and the indignities she embraced
 
00:38:58 Daniel Allen: It’s startling that the beginning is acceptance of indignity, I tend to see that as the end - or the perfected state. Yet, John says it is the first property. And that’s something.
 
00:39:52 Suzanne: Why is it that as long as we are alone with God at home, we maintain peace of soul and continuous prayer, but as soon as we get into conversations with others, our restraint goes out the window? For example, I got sucked into a discussion about politics earlier today, and I was unable to detect and prevent anger from arising inside me - ultimately my words took on an angry tone, and I said words I now regret. It’s like all I accomplished this morning with God was stolen from me. Basically, when tested, I fail.
 
00:40:38 Jeff O.: Reacted to "It’s startling that ..." with 👍
 
00:43:14 Suzanne: Replying to "It’s startling that ..."
 
Interesting.
 
00:43:29 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: It seems that within humility there is recognizing that God loves me, in a breathless way. When I'm around someone who genuinely loves me, I tend to love myself more when I'm with them. Feeling loved and loving myself without condemnation. it seems, helps me accept my weakness and need for God. Humility, then, becomes a natural honesty that helps me put down my defenses of my ego and let God do whatever is necessary to make me like Him and united to Him. Then, denying myself and carrying the cross I recognize to be therapeutic and seems to be the most reasonable and honest thing to do.
 
00:44:54 Sharon Fisher: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..."
 
Same here. Just recently, too. And frequently, too . . .
 
00:45:23 Anthony Rago: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..." 
 
 Suzanne, my studies ...
 
00:45:28 Daniel Allen: I haven’t read her diary but the diary of Elizabeth Liseur may be a good concrete example of what it looks like for one to be trying to live the faith while another one isn’t at all, and how to do that faithfully.
 
00:46:14 Suzanne: Reacted to "Same here. Just rece..." with ❤️
 
00:46:36 Suzanne: Reacted to "Suzanne, my studies ..." with ❤️
 
00:46:51 Anthony Rago: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..." 
 
 Suzanne I wouldn't t...
 
00:48:02 Suzanne: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..."
 
Fall, and get back up. Never stop.
 
00:52:04 Sharon Fisher: Replying to "Why is it that as lo..."
 
Proverbs 24:16!
 
00:55:28 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "Suzanne, my studies ..." with ❤️
 
00:55:37 Kevin Burke: Reacted to "Suzanne, my studies …" with ❤️
 
00:57:57 Suzanne: Reacted to "Proverbs 24:16!" with ❤️
 
00:59:18 Sharon Fisher: Replying to "How does one try to ..."
 
Followup to the discussion: “Do not think that I have come to bring peace to the earth; I have not come to bring peace, but a sword. For I have come to set a man against his father, and a daughter against her mother, and a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law; and one’s foes will be members of one’s own household” (Matthew 10:34-36).
 
01:06:45 Sean: Stephen Hawking: "If we find the answer to that, it would be the ultimate triumph of human reason—for then we would know the mind of God." That always struck me as hubris.
 
01:07:15 Anthony Rago: Also in regard to not prying into mysteries, does this apply to the errors of heretics? And does it apply to the orthodox whose censures might have caused more harm than good (ex. The way we used anathema which had the effect of alienating whole peoples)?
 
01:09:51 Patrick Caruso: In step 25:7, he says the highest degree includes 'a constant desire to learn'. However in Step 24:29 he says 'If knowledge puffs up most people, simplicity and a lack of learning can perhaps in the same measure humble them.' Is he saying that the path of knowledge is to first learn to be simple through perhaps a lack of learning to bring about true knowledge via humility and only then will we be capable of a purified desire to learn?
 
01:12:53 Suzanne: I’ve been putting into practice lately, taking all my thoughts to God. It’s really powerful, and it’s leading me to actually speak with Him quietly and intimately about past sins. I sense that there is a deep pride that causes us to withdraw from His gaze, and refuse to reflect upon our sins in His holy sight. Yet He has shown me that He is ardently ready and willing to discuss my sin with me, and make me understand His Providence. This, I think, is going to lead to humility in my soul.
 
01:15:33 Anthony Rago: Reacted to I’ve been putting in... with "❤️"
 
01:15:50 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Reacted to "I’ve been putting in..." with ❤️
 
01:17:06 Suzanne: I so appreciate your help!
 
01:17:59 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father excellent session
 
01:18:03 Sean: prayers and gratitude Father
 
01:18:04 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father, good night
 
01:18:05 mflory: Thank you!
 
01:18:06 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:18:14 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:18:28 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:18:29 Kevin Burke: Thank you Father!
 
01:18:31 David Swiderski: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos: Book Two - Hypothesis I, Part I

We began this evening with page one of the second volume of The Evergetinos. In many ways, we pick up where we left off in the first volume with humility. However, we are given very explicit examples of those who are a model of the virtue. Perhaps it would be better said that they present us with an other-worldly manifestation of the virtue - the Holy Fool. 
Such individuals, so driven by the love for Christ, have set aside so completely self-esteem and reputation that their presence reveals the poverty,  inadequacy or complete lack of this holy virtue in others; especially those who deem themselves to be religious. 
To hear the stories of their lives almost knocks the wind out of the reader. The very presence of their sanctity brings down upon them the scorn and the abuse of others. They embody Christ’s teaching, “You will be hated by all because of my name.” They are hated because they embodied the humility of Christ, who counted reputation as nothing, emptied himself and became a servant, obedient unto death. 
It is hard to be in the presence of such individuals. Their hidden sanctity will still speak to the souls of those in their midst and provoke a reaction. The demons who guide and direct our thoughts will seek to make us mock and ridicule them and blind us to their true goodness. Thus, they provide us with a cautionary tale – that in our lesser moments we are capable of mocking the Lord in others, when we hold them in contempt. We are not so far from committing such unholy violence in our hearts, when we lose sight of the dignity of those around us.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:04:02 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you! 
I am driving right now.
 
00:11:45 Suzanne: Can hear a pin drop!
 
00:12:55 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Can hear a pin drop!" with 📌
 
00:13:16 Suzanne: Reacted to "Can hear a pin drop!" with ☺️
 
00:35:06 Rebecca Thérèse: The thing that people don't understand is that even if she had been a simpleton and their judgement of her was correct, they still shouldn't have treated her like that. "For inasmuch as you did it to the least of these..."
 
00:36:47 sharonfisher: It’s odd to me that the most holy among us behave this way.
 
00:36:57 Louise: Was she a victim soul?
 
00:39:02 maureencunningham: They did not see her
 
00:40:53 Suzanne: She reflected Christ's attribute of taking upon Himself the sins of mankind.
 
00:42:49 Lee Graham: No doubt, she forgave all those who abused her, lest they would have to live separated from God throughout eternity
 
00:43:16 sharonfisher: How is it that she feigned foolishness, 1st para. Was she testing them?
 
00:43:29 maureencunningham: Did the early church  run to be Marty
 
00:45:33 Anthony Rago: If she were foolish perhaps she was like Brother Juniper, companion of St Francis, very plain kind and simple. Perhaps even a little "touched" but that weakness became a strength by grace.
 
00:46:44 Suzanne: The Age of the Desert corresponds to the Age of Heresy, post persecution. It's a communal reparation.
 
00:49:10 sharonfisher: Reacted to "If she were foolish …" with ❤️
 
00:58:57 Sean: it would be hard to find someone who "longs to be loathed"...quite the opposite...
 
01:00:33 Rebecca Thérèse: The problem with being loathed is that people don't just loathe you and leave you alone, they're constantly bothering you with their loathing!
 
01:01:04 Suzanne: Reacted to "The problem with bei..." with ❤️
 
01:05:31 sharonfisher: I so agree, the West sometimes pays less attention to the saints than I would like. But in an effort to provide services that people (families) can actually attend, they have to cut somewhere.
 
01:07:37 Adam Paige: I think the West has emphasized the temporal cycle over the sanctoral cycle in recent years, but if the Office of Readings and the Martyrology could become more prevalent in the life of the church, that would go some way to helping
 
01:09:29 Anthony Rago: I was thinking this sounded like the charcoal saint!  Didn't Alexander also see Our Lady of Blachernae promising to protect the city from besieging barbarians?
 
01:11:54 Michael Hinckley: The West tends to get very Thomistic I believe.
 
01:13:16 Suzanne: Father, is it too late to ask a question about one of your FB posts?
 
01:13:37 Suzanne: You put up a quote from St. Symeon: “For unless a person has been trained in strict vigilance, so that when attacked by a flood of useless thoughts he tests and sifts them all … he is readily seduced in many unseen ways by the devil.” Presuming there is no human being available to train and guide you in learning to discipline your thoughts, how do you acquire this skill? Is there a book you can recommend that gives practical instruction on how to purify the thoughts?
 
01:14:17 sharonfisher: Reacted to "You put up a quote f…" with ❤️
 
01:14:18 Suzanne: LOL!
 
01:14:38 Jacqulyn: Reacted to "LOL!" with 👍
 
01:16:46 sharonfisher: Thank you for not rushing us through this and allowing
questions and discussion. So valuable!
 
01:17:01 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru..." with ☦️
 
01:17:16 Suzanne: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru..." with ❤️
 
01:17:30 Sean: the coal carrier reminds me the movie the island
 
01:17:48 maureencunningham: Thank You Blessing
 
01:17:48 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:53 Adam Paige: Reacted to "the coal carrier rem..." with 👍
 
01:17:54 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:17:58 Suzanne: Great meeting, and God bless you all!
 
01:18:00 Anthony Rago: Reacted to the coal carrier rem... with "👍"
 
01:18:03 Lorraine Green: Thank you, Father
 
01:18:17 sharonfisher: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru…" with ❤️
 
01:18:22 sharonfisher: Reacted to "Thank you for not ru…" with ☦️
 
01:18:40 Leilani Nemeroff: Thank you.
 
01:19:06 sharonfisher: And to your spirit!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part IV and XXV: On Humility, Part I

Elder Porphyrios wrote “whoever wants to be a Christian must first become a poet”.  I mention this because the truth of it plays out in St. John’s writing tonight on humility. One indeed must become a poet - one who has the capacity to capture the deepest of mysteries with a few words. 
However, what we see in St. John’s writings is that even this capacity fails us when we begin to speak about “Holy Humility” - our call to participate in the very life and virtue of God;  “Learn from me, for I am meek and humble of heart.”We must become docile; that is, teachable in the most radical fashion. There must be a willingness on our part to let go of all conceit, prudence, and cunning. What is being spoken of is not simply a natural virtue, but a participation in the divine. It is that which can only be understood through experience. 
Such a path will always be challenging because it means letting go of our perception of reality, even religious reality. As God draws us into greater intimacy with himself, we are called to walk along the dark and obscure path of faith. This faith is a kind of knowing, but it is dark and obscure because it is beyond the limitations of intellect, reason, and imagination. To experience God “as he is in himself” means to let go of the boundaries, the foot holds, and the crutches that we have used to move forward in our understanding. It can be a fearful thing to fall into the hands of the living God: Fearful, precisely, because it means letting go of reality as we have known it. 
We can feel as though we are being brought to the edge of insanity and so St. John warns us that we must let go of prudence and its delusion. Prudence often masks a lack of courage. It is a human wisdom that tells us, warns us, not to go to extremes. In this sense, it is good. Yet, it can also be deadly to true faith. It can cripple us with fear and make us choose the path of safety, rather than entrusting ourselves wholly to God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:14:25 FrDavid Abernethy: Step 24 number 27 page 179
 
00:15:25 Suzanne: Moment of silence for that pie! Yum!!
 
00:15:32 Sean: home made cranberry is killer
 
00:15:44 Suzanne: Replying to "home made cranberry ..."
 
Just made mine!
 
00:31:20 Anthony Rago: The submission of Christians and Muslims who lost children recently in the Holy Land is a concrete example of carrying a cross.
 
00:32:13 Anthony Rago: They take it so graciously
 
00:40:34 Sharon Fisher: Could it be like being wishy-washy,  choosing no path?
 
00:41:02 Cindy Moran: My version reads "cleverness" instead of prudence
 
00:43:35 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: The reading on our calendar for today was to leave 99 to find one. That doesn't seem prudent
 
00:44:33 Carol: the widow with the 2 mites is imprudent too
 
00:57:50 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Over the years, I have at times imitated humility, but never acquired it. I depend on God to grant me humility as His gift and I hope asceticism and prayer helps me recognize and receive it.
 
01:00:48 Suzanne: Reacted to "Over the years, I ha..." with ❤️
 
01:01:10 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Sounds like you're saying becoming humble is becoming like Christ. Part of theosis.
 
01:01:13 Santiago Bua: Before humillity is a decision is a prayer for. Greetings from Argentina
 
01:01:16 Louise: Humility baffles me. Maybe humility is something like ''I do not know.
Only God knows.'' In contrast, pride would be ''I know better than God.''
 
01:02:48 Sam: This also reminds me of the need for humility acceptance of spiritual direction as many have fallen along the path to asceticism where pride cones and destroys the child like humility needed through spiritual direction and discernment  of guidance or advice
 
01:04:57 Sean: I practise humility e.g. stepping aside on a narrow walkng path, allowing the other to pass easily or waiting patiently in line saying the Jesus praayer and avoiding the thoughts of 'I'm in a hurry, come on'. I don't know if that makes me humble or making just faking it til i make it.
 
01:05:03 Alexandra K: You recognize your own pride when you are not looking for humility and it comes to you right in your face.
 
01:06:59 Christian Corulli: Are there some points in the spiritual life where we need a spiritual director to grow in humility further?
 
01:08:09 Louise: I am concerned about the diabolic trap of euthanasia offered to people in Canada. Individuals choosing ''medical assistance in dying'' or MAIDS, as part of the ''human dignity to chose,'' are basically saying to God, ''I decide when I die, not You! I chose not to suffer.'' I am afraid that they can only end up in hell. What would the Desert Fathers say?
 
01:13:49 Anthony Rago: I enjoy a particular craft. To really know it, I have to stop reading, stop being distracted by other crafts, and just work, interacting with the metal and tools. In experiencing this vocation it's an analogy to discovering God. You just have to quit the inaction, focus, and do it....and you grow without fixation on laws, on control, on growing.  You just do, and the beauty (& truth & goodness) comes.
 
01:16:53 Suzanne: Thank you, Father, and Happy Thanksgiving to all!
 
01:17:00 Sr Mary of our Divine Savior solt: Reacted to "Thank you, Father, a..." with 🙏🏼
 
01:17:08 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:17:21 sue and mark: Thank you.  Happy Thanksgiving.
 
01:17:41 mflory: Thank you!
 
01:17:42 Art: Happy Thanksgiving to all!
 
01:17:46 Sharon Fisher: And to your spirit! Thank you!!
 
01:17:55 Cindy Moran: Happy Thanksgiving Father! Thank you for great session
 

The Evergetinos - Conclusion of Volume One

Tonight we read the final hypotheses of the First Volume of the Evergetinos. From beginning to end the volume and its teachings are as challenging as they are beautiful. 
The focus this evening was on our attachment to the things of this world; whether those things be the praise of men or material objects and clothing. As always the fathers present us with the gospel in an unvarnished fashion. Their ability to touch upon the most subtle aspects of the passions and temptations is extraordinary. Even when we let go of material attachments we can cling to a kind of spiritual raiment. It takes a great deal of time and grace to break loose of the fetters that hold us; our desire for the pleasures of this world, both great and small. 
Even the monk can hold on to certain implements or clothing when there is no need for them other than the satisfaction that they offer in the possessing of them. Frugality and modesty in dress should be virtues that we love and cultivate. In a culture where there is an abundance of everything on demand. Our sharing in this has become habitual and it can be overwhelmingly difficult to overcome. What we see in the fathers is the constant reminder to adorn the soul. We are to store up treasure for ourselves in heaven.  It is  the poor that we have received that become our greatest advocates before the throne of God.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:19:50 FrDavid Abernethy: page 414
 
00:36:13 Anthony Rago: The Island had a scene regarding the abbot having a coat of which he was too fond. He was eventually glad to be freed of that attachment by the "crazy" monk.
 
00:37:07 Suzanne: Over the course of my life, I have pretty much ruined every single thing I’ve ever put my hand to, because I simply cannot act except in order to draw praise from my performance. I’m aware of it, ashamed of it, but cannot put this passion to death. I don’t think I’ve ever employed a talent or ability with a pure intention.
 
00:37:52 Michael Hinckley: reminds me of the story of Alexander Magnus, once offered a cup of water in a time of dryness poured it out saying too much for one, not enough for many.
 
00:47:16 Anthony Rago: Replying to "Over the course of m..." 
 
 Perhaps "ruined" is ...
 
00:49:32 Suzanne: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
True, thank you.
 
00:50:09 Maureen Cunningham: Maybe they were not attached to anything in this world. And had no need for natural things . Only for the heavenly
 
00:50:51 Anthony Rago: Reacted to True, thank you. with "❤️"
 
00:51:37 Michael Hinckley: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
@Suzanne when we give thanks to others it is also an act of charity. Fr is right magnanimity is a gift we are given to excel, in an orderly fashion
 
00:51:40 Suzanne: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
Father has a good nous. He actually hit the nail on the head. 😇
 
00:52:22 Suzanne: Replying to "Over the course of m..."
 
Thank you, Michael.
 
01:00:36 Maureen Cunningham: I have a. Question when I went to Rome I
 
01:01:15 Michael Hinckley: are not robes (clothes) tools as well. serve purposes, again ordered fashion. That which we labor in is not the wedding garment
 
01:01:28 Anthony Rago: About not making things you see that you like ....I can see not doing this out of envy. But making something out of love for doing something good and beautiful, or because it is an inherent vocation is a good thing.  I started my hobby because I saw a beautiful repousse picture and I just
knew I had to make something like that.
 
01:01:29 Maureen Cunningham: Questions when I went to Rome Saint Peter allot beauty not what the desert Fathers had why so different
 
01:03:04 Suzanne: Replying to "are not robes (cloth..."
 
In this culture, dressing well is a good work.
 
01:04:08 Suzanne: Replying to "are not robes (cloth..."
 
Dress like a lady, etc.
 
01:11:39 Anthony Rago: We live in a society without these reminders and we are pagans
 
01:12:43 Anthony Rago: I mean, no icons, no images in public....and without these reminders we are pagans
 
01:13:12 Michael Hinckley: need to drop santa note all
 
01:13:38 Suzanne: Replying to "About not making thi..."
 
It's true freedom to make something beautiful with a pure heart.
 
01:15:05 Anthony Rago: Reacted to It's true freedom to... with "❤️"
 
01:19:59 Louise: My mother used to tell me, ''Louise, if you do something , do it well, as if you are doing it for God.'' I try, I try.
 
01:20:09 Suzanne: This is a multi-faceted issue. Communism deliberately destroys beauty, and Christendom has beautified every human art form. I believe that beauty is absolutely necessary for public order.
 
01:20:21 Suzanne: Reacted to "My mother used to te..." with ❤️
 
01:21:17 Suzanne: And there's nothing more beautiful than a priest or monk in habit/cassock.
 
01:21:28 Anthony Rago: Reacted to This is a multi-face... with "👍"
 
01:23:36 Sharon Fisher: Reacted to "And there's nothing ..." with ❤️
 
01:26:35 Sean: I need it and I'm unworthy, that's an interesting take on things. Humility.
 
01:27:41 Paul: Wow Great Instruction !  Whats next?
 
01:28:33 Suzanne: Reacted to "Wow Great Instructio..." with 👍
 
01:29:45 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father
 
01:30:20 Suzanne: Thank you so much!
 
01:30:20 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:30:30 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit! Thank you!
 
01:30:56 Louise: Yvette and Steve in my prayers.
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part III

Guile.  It is rarely a word that is used in our day; nor one which we use to examine our own minds and hearts. Yet, as St. John describes it, guile has an impact upon our vision of life, God, ourselves, and others. Our vision becomes wholly distorted and perverted. While guile is a kind of intelligence - it is sly and cunning. Understanding, then, is used to manipulate others and circumstances for one’s own benefit. This in turn creates an aversion to humility and repentance. The pretense of religion and religiosity begins to prevail in a person’s life. Reverence and piety becomes a sham.  One becomes diabolical, and they use what is good in order to commit evil. It creates within the human heart a love of sin and so makes an individual the companion of the devil. 
We are to live upright lives; that is, we are stand upright with our eyes fixed forward toward the life that God has made possible for us. How often we choose the path of beasts; our eyes directed downwards towards the things of this world and the satisfaction of our own appetites. The mind and the heart become sick and incapable of seeing the truth - so deeply have they sunk into the abyss of this unholy cunning.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:17:26 Celine Fournier: Hello I am new to the zoom.
 
00:18:12 FrDavid Abernethy: page 178 para 20
 
00:18:44 Walter Viola: First time attending. Been following via YouTube for a year.
 
00:29:39 David Swiderski: Wouldnt this be what we call today sociopaths? Often highly intelligent but are only able to see this benefits me now and this does not. There is no empathy or concept of a right and wrong. Working with excecutives in several pulbic companies I am convinced this is abnormally high in that group.
 
00:30:46 Louise: Guile seems to be the modus vivendi of psychopaths, or people I call satanic souls.
 
00:30:59 Kevin Burke: What is meant by “hindrance to resurrection?”
 
00:31:19 sue and mark: how would gaslighters come into play with this?
 
00:31:20 Anthony Rago: Yesterdays Gospel mentioned guile. Christ addresses Nathaniel as an Israelite in whom is no guile, is that to show he was outstanding in a crowd of people with guile? Or is it that he is an excellent specimen of a crowd of honest people? And what does that have to do with sitting under the fig tree?
 
00:32:38 Louise: If you meet one, go away, leave the scene ASAP.
 
00:36:02 Louise: Could we say that the ones are the bad seeds, the weeds?
 
00:36:49 Louise: ''he guile ones''
 
00:38:17 Carol: do you think guile can exist more subtly in the hearts of all of us
 
00:39:38 Maureen Cunningham: Guile is when you plan to hurt another soul.
 
00:44:01 Daniel Allen: Not to change texts but this makes me think of the wisdom of St Isaac, “above all things love silence”. I tend to regret my words more than biting my tongue
 
00:44:37 Anthony Rago: This is why Jansenism was so serious. Pure as angels; Proud as devils
 
00:46:47 Maureen Cunningham: I did see that movie
 
00:47:06 Cindy Moran: Love that movie
 
00:48:32 Louise: What is the name again?
 
00:48:38 Cindy Moran: Jennifer Jones
 
00:48:40 Rod Castillo: Jennifer Jones
 
00:48:52 Rod Castillo: Song of Bernadette
 
01:00:30 Louise: Father, we lost you.
 
01:00:36 Cindy Moran: Frozen
 
01:03:09 David Swiderski: A priest in Spain explained this well to me. All churches are filled with stainglass windows of the saints who let the light of God enter into our lives. By struggling we slowly clean our own windows and dark stains to let the light of God to enter into this world and our communities.
 
01:17:26 Maureen Cunningham: If we are always looking at what is bad in us ? In the same way can gaze at how far we have come closer to Him
 
01:20:59 Cindy Moran: Fun fact: Jennifer Jones was married to movie mogul studio film executive David O. Selznick [Gone With the Wind] who was born here in Pittsburgh
 
01:21:08 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:21:28 Lorraine Green: Thank you very much, Father
 
01:21:37 sue and mark: Thank you
 
01:21:40 Celine Fournier: Thank you
 
01:21:49 Louise: Thanks, Fr.
 
01:22:23 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:22:24 mflory: Thanks you very much, Father!
 
01:22:31 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:22:41 David Swiderski: May God bless you father! Thank you.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLVI, Part I

We are drawing close to the end of the first volume of the Evergetinos. We’ve come to the end of a long journey; but in reality it’s just the beginning for us. The fathers began by having us meditate long upon repentance. This is the starting point. The turning from the self toward God for healing. 
Now at the conclusion of the volume our eyes gaze  upon the vision of humility. Again, it is not the humility of this world, but the humility of God. It is the humility of a love that empties itself in order to lift others out of their poverty and darkness. It is the love that thinks nothing of the self but seeks only the fulfillment the will of the beloved. 
We were shown this evening and number of aspect of this humility. The first is self-reproach. He who seeks the honor of God and finds his identity rooted in God is going to seek nothing of the honor and privileges of this world. We are reminded that “all flesh is as grass and all the glory of man as the flower of grass”. Everything within this world passes away. Why do we cling to it so tenaciously, and yet hold so little desire for the love that searches us out constantly. “Heart speaks to heart.” We let go of everything, including our own ego, in order that nothing might impede our capacity to hear God’s Word of Love.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:45:16 Sharon Fisher: Does that mean that if we were wholly aware of our faults and someone else called them out to us; we’d have already recognized and come to peace with them, and the accusation has no effect or sting?
 
00:48:43 Sharon Fisher: Turn the other cheek? Just allow them their feelings?
 
00:49:57 Steve Yu: Questions. Would praying for the spirit of repentance trigger humility? I ask because a constant state of humility seems like a difficult goal for me.
 
01:03:09 Suzanne: Just having to work in the world is a great opportunity to practice humility. How many times do we draw down upon ourselves the dislike and resentment of co-workers for no discernible reason?
 
01:14:35 Rory: Yes, 
heart speaking to heart
 
01:16:48 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You
 
01:17:10 Sandy Nelson: Thank you
 
01:17:17 Suzanne: Thank you!
 
01:17:28 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:17:29 Sharon Fisher: And with your spirit!!
 
01:17:30 Lorraine Green: Thank you!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part II

To be simple, guileless, and meek are described by St. John as a habit of soul. Habits form deeply over the course of time and those that we form through negligence in our relationship with God are often very difficult to change. In fact, it would be better to say that they are changed only by the grace of God. 
What would our life look like if our speech was unpremeditated? What would our relationships look like if we were free from ulterior motives? To look upon others only with love and to live in the truth through humility is to reshape our experience and vision of reality. Suddenly we begin to see things (and more importantly others) as God sees them. We can look upon the other and be blind to their natural faults or defects as well as their sins. We return to a kind of holy innocence and purity of heart were we never lose sight of the beauty of God’s creation and most especially the beauty of the human person. To give oneself to God is to find within the capacity to give oneself to others, to love without measure, to serve without calculation. May God make it so!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:11:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 177 para 10
 
00:19:16 Victor Haburchak: Jesus was often angry with the Pharisees & scribes.
 
00:36:58 Kate : I find that my attempts at simplicity of life can become rather complex in trying to let go of things in my life.  I am flooded with distractions that “seem” necessary at the time but later I realize it was a temptation away from simplicity.  I find it hard to navigate towards simplicity.  The complexity of simplicity!
 
00:41:10 Lee Graham: Reacted to "I find that my attem…" with ❤️
 
00:43:48 Daniel Allen: That’s me I always want another book and read say 7 at a time. Then I read from St Isaac today that not every good book is beneficial for stillness (or simplicity). Even the good things, in this case a quest for knowledge and understanding, can actually be a distraction.
 
00:45:55 Kate : Thank you, Father!  You cut through the complexity for me.  Union with God.
 
00:46:07 Anthony Rago: Some of it you learn by experience
 
00:46:17 Jeff O.: Reacted to "That’s me I always w..." with 👍
 
00:46:34 Rory: Reacted to That’s me I always w... with "👍"
 
00:46:46 Rory: Reacted to Some of it you learn... with "👍"
 
00:47:34 Victor Haburchak: Reacted to "That’s me I always w…" with 👍
 
00:59:04 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: I've often been struck by this saying: It was said of Abba Macarius the Great that he became, according
to the writings, a god on earth, because in the way God protects the world, so Abba Macarius would hide the faults he saw as though he had not seen them, and the faults he heard about as though he had not heard of them.
Sayings of the Desert Fathers, Macari us the Egyptian 3 2 (PG 6 5 ,
273)
 
01:01:55 Daniel Allen: That’s strikingly beautiful
 
01:03:50 Victor Haburchak: Replying to "I've often been stru…"
Like the Seal of Confession
 
01:05:05 Victor Haburchak: My pastor often speaks about respecting boundaries
 
01:06:22 Jeff O.: Reacted to "I've often been stru..." with 💙
 
01:08:55 Victor Haburchak: Reacted to "I've often been stru…" with 💙
 
01:11:31 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:11:38 Victor Haburchak: Thanks!
 
01:11:44 Art: Thank you.
 
01:11:50 sue and mark: Thank you.
 
01:12:07 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father!
 
01:12:19 Maureen Cunningham: Blessings Praying  for all
 
01:12:24 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernathy!
 
01:12:28 Jeff O.: thank you!!
 
01:12:28 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:12:39 David Swiderski: Thank you father!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part VIII

What a privilege it is to read the fathers! As we are being drawn by them into a deeper understanding of the virtue of humility, their vision of its beauty opens up before us. It is not something that only reveals the poverty of our sin and need for healing. Humility also reveals that we are made in the image and likeness of God. 
We should not see humility then from a negative perspective. It reveals also the highest truth about who we are as human beings. We are destined to share in the fullness of the life of God. Humility does begin by acknowledging the truth about ourselves and our need for healing. Over the course of time it is perfected by the struggles that we undergo and the great losses that we experience. Eventually, however, by the action of God’s grace it is brought to perfection and there exist within us no desire for sin and no lingering element of pride. We begin to see in that moment that humility is one of the qualities of our God. Suddenly our vision of the spiritual life changes. Everything is meant to draw us into the fullness of his life, virtue and love. Thanks be to God!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:33 Suzanne: Ave Maria!!
 
00:02:52 FrDavid Abernethy: Full of Grace
 
00:03:07 Suzanne: 😇
 
00:03:37 Suzanne: Father, did you get my email about St. Theophan series?
 
00:04:07 FrDavid Abernethy: Gee.  I don’t know.  I’ll have to go back and look.  So sorry
 
00:04:20 Suzanne: Ok!
 
00:04:34 FrDavid Abernethy: page 403 letter B
 
00:06:34 Suzanne: Father, have you seen the Russian movie, The Island?
 
00:06:57 Suzanne: I can't stop watching it!
 
00:08:03 Suzanne: I love the scene where he cures the attachments of the Abbot.
 
00:10:16 Suzanne: Mr. Yu, how is your wife?
 
00:32:33 Eric Ewanco: What does he mean by "discernment"? How might we wound the conscience of our neighbor?
 
00:34:05 Eric Ewanco: ok
 
00:36:52 Sean: what do you mean by to know the mind of God?
 
00:41:29 Louise: Does humility imply that I am ongoingly aware that I am necessarily defective and fallible, even if I try to be virtuous?
 
00:56:57 Suzanne: Lately I’ve been thinking more and more that we are infected with pride as children, by parents who show too much pride in our accomplishments or abilities. That’s where it begins, and the culture is more than happy to cement it into narcissism. It’s like an evil bond develops between affection and praise – so that affection is sought, not in accordance with nature and grace, but to satisfy pride. One’s heart contracts, no longer able to give itself in charity, because of the demands it places on others to give “excellence” it’s due.
 
00:58:33 Anthony Rago: This is soft. It's gentle.  It's like Dante's Paradise in which love is a force of motion.  I like this better than the way Roman Catholics of our time and country - not like the medievals like St Bernard - pass on the Faith.
 
01:00:11 sharonfisher: Re: earlier tonight - Opening the day with prayer and giving God first fruits is something I can relate to. To this point, I haven’t felt a purpose for early morning prayer (as opposed to prayer any other hour) — this resonates with me. I’m such a novice. Thank you!
 
01:00:35 Eric Ewanco: I agree with Suzanne. My mother was very proud of me, which fed my ego so much that my arrogance was off the charts. This alienated me from my peers and I never overcame it until high school. I literally didn't learn what the word "humble" meant until I was a teen. I loved her dearly but it was clearly deleterious. God saw fit that she passed away when I was 13, no doubt to spare me from the worst of it (that's terrible to say but as her son I can say it).
 
01:04:34 Lee Graham: When God reveals our defects of character, there  is no shame.
 
01:05:50 Suzanne: Father said, "Pride isolates." ABSOLUTELY!!
 
01:13:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂. Sorry I was so late, Zoom decided to update!
 
01:13:52 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:13:55 Lorraine Green: Thank you, Father
 
01:13:59 David Fraley: Thank you, Father!
 
01:13:59 Suzanne: Thank you so much for these groups!
 

Searching the Depths of the Unconscious: The Desert Fathers and Psychoanalysis

A lecture presented at Duquesne University, in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, on Tuesday, October 24, 2023. Sponsored by the Department of Catholic Studies. 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part V and Chapter XXIV: On Meekness, Part I

“We are reading to fast!”  This is typically something that we would never say about our study groups. However, as we sit at the feet of St. John Climacus, we come to the realization that we could sit with a single saying for months on end and not fail to be nourished. 
We concluded our discussion of Step 23 and the difficulty with blasphemous thoughts. The evil one in his envy will seek to distract us with blasphemous thoughts that come like a flash of lightning before the mind. Our one response should be to lay this great burden upon the Lord, to entrust it to him, knowing that it comes not from our hearts but from the malice of the evil one. 
In Step 24 Saint John begins to discuss meekness, simplicity, and guilelessness. As Saint John begins to define it for us, we suddenly experience ourselves as moving too briskly. Meekness is an “unchangeable state of mind, a rock overlooking the sea of anger”. These thoughts alone are enough to alter our view of this great virtue. In the face of the chaos of living in a fallen world or the experience of the hatred and anger of others, meekness becomes a buttress that is unshakable and keeps us from being swept away by touchiness of mind or irritability of heart. Meekness creates the desire for simplicity; to create a place where the Lord will find rest within us. It allows us to maintain dominion over our heart by the simple act of mortifying the intellect and private judgment. In the weeks to come, may we linger along with these thoughts and come to desire this great virtue.
 
---
 
Text of chat during the group:
 
00:01:31 Suzanne: Hello! Happy Feast of All Saints!!
 
00:01:39 FrDavid Abernethy: to you as well!
 
00:01:54 FrDavid Abernethy: page 175 para 47
 
00:03:02 Suzanne: Look! The West gets it! From Vespers for All Saints:
 
00:03:09 Suzanne: Choréa casta vírginum,
Et quos erémus íncolas
Transmísit astris, cǽlitum
Locáte nos in sédibus.
 
00:03:52 Suzanne: And the Antiphon from the Magnifcat:
 
00:03:58 Suzanne: Ángeli, * Archángeli, Throni et Dominatiónes, Principátus et Potestátes, Virtútes cælórum, Chérubim atque Séraphim, Patriárchæ et Prophétæ, sancti legis Doctóres, Apóstoli, omnes Christi Mártyres, sancti Confessóres, Vírgines Dómini, Anachorítæ, Sanctíque omnes, intercédite pro nobis.
 
00:04:23 Sean: I tried to find it, it's out of 'print', no luck
 
00:06:44 Rachel: ty
 
00:09:26 FrDavid Abernethy: page 175 para 47
 
00:14:59 Art: Hello TY and same to you!
 
00:25:05 Louise: In my culture of origin, in Quebec, Canada, the French-Canadians swear with the names of God and the Eucharist, even psychologists in supervision with me. I ask them to not do so, but they relapse after a while. I thus decided to offer, inwardly, my apologies to Christ when they swear. Can I do something else?
 
00:25:55 Louise: I would have to exclude them all.
 
00:28:38 David Swiderski: When I lived in Spain the same issue most swears blasphemous. I was a teacher so just joked wow you need a thesaurs and have a limited and very poor vocabulary. It seemed to work and get a laugh.
 
00:31:47 Suzanne: equanimity
 
00:33:05 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Learn of Me, for I am meek and
humble in heart. It seems, then, that depending on Christ and becoming like Christ transforms us into being humble. So, it seems like it's part of the process of theosis. Is this so?
 
00:33:37 sharonfisher: How can insecurity be transformed to meekness? I guess I’m asking how to display the strength I feel in Jesus Christ, but the body belies.
 
00:34:30 Anthony Rago: Something that helps me deal with anger -and bad thoughts - is that any bad thought against a man really reflects on the Lord,  the ne Adanm. And any bad thought against a woman really reflects on our Lady, the ideal of a woman. I don't like that so it helps keep the interior life in check, to dash the infants of evil thoughts against the rocks.
 
00:38:02 sharonfisher: Replying to "How can insecurity b..."
 
Thank you - I think my question was more self-centered (ie, not appropriate!)
 
00:38:38 David Swiderski: On my door to my room I have a quote which I see when I leave and when I go to bed- (In loving one another, God in us made flesh). I often find I fall short at night but seem more careful the next day.
 
00:40:08 sharonfisher: Reacted to "On my door to my roo..." with ❤️
 
00:40:58 Daniel Allen: This conversation about meekness makes me think of “the kingdom of heaven suffers violence and the violent carry it away” which is very much not being a doormat. So it’s a matter of that violence being directed towards biting our own tongue (or what have you) and not against another.
 
00:45:09 Suzanne: Fr. Ripperger talks about demons putting negative perspectives on things that are pure illusions, and that get us angry.
 
00:46:38 Ashley Kaschl: To Suzanne’s point, it’s the cogitative power of the brain that Fr. R talks about, which makes associations, and is why asking
the Lord to protect our faculties is so important 😁
 
00:47:06 Suzanne: Amen Ashley!
 
00:49:31 sharonfisher: There, that is what I was trying to convey — I feel peace, but the passions and fears overtake. So how to slow or reduce the effect of the physical body that reacts. Apologies if I’m not clear.
 
00:51:28 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Meekness as an unmoveable rock, is strength, and much different than the connotation of meekness as self-effacement and highly flexible that I'm used to in our society. that's helpful
 
00:53:07 Louise: To help myself not engage in frustrations, angry reactions, etc. I am at times gently reminded by God (I believe) to say, ''May Thy will be done.'' If it comes from God, it is then OK by me.
 
00:53:52 sharonfisher: Reacted to "To help myself not e..." with ❤️
 
00:54:10 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: This strength makes more sense that Moses, the leader and prophet of Israel, could be called the meekest of men.
 
00:55:48 Suzanne: The actor who played Nectarios wonderfully portrayed the strain and violence - yet tempered with real interior peace and steadfastness - experienced in the practice of the virtue of meekness. Also the deep sadness that oppresses the soul in the face of sad injustice.
 
01:02:46 Anthony Rago: Italian temper here. I've literally seen red.
 
01:02:59 Suzanne: Reacted to "Italian temper here...." with 😂
 
01:03:29 Suzanne: Eh Rago!! Romano here!!
 
01:03:47 Anthony Rago: Reacted to Eh Rago!! Romano her... with "❤️"
 
01:10:11 Ashley Kaschl: I think I could contemplate these last handful of paragraphs for months if not years! But could we say that God’s meekness is also a facet of His mercy, too? To me, there seems to be not so much a reaching out from God in meekness but a “staying of His hand”, a resoluteness to endure our infidelity. If ever there was Someone worthy of being angry at being wronged, offended, or betrayed it is God and yet He waits and endures our wretchedness while not destroying us but offering us a way back to Him.
 
01:11:08 Suzanne: Reacted to "I think I could cont..." with ❤️
 
01:11:54 Lee Graham: Reacted to "I think I could cont…" with ❤️
 
01:14:49 Louise: Have a good ''All Saints Day''! Thanks Father!
 
01:15:13 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:20 Victor Haburchak: Thanks
 
01:15:20 Suzanne: Thank you so much for all the work you do!
 
01:15:24 David Swiderski: Thank you father! Have a blessed week!
 
01:15:35 sue and mark: thank you.
 
01:15:57 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!
 
01:16:02 S Fisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:16:04 Jeff O.: Thank you Father!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part VII

Coming towards the end of the first volume of the Evergetinos, it is clear that we are being nourished upon solid food. During these many weeks, the fathers have been leading us into a deeper understanding of the virtue of humility. It is one thing to understand the definition of humility; even something as clear as “truthful living”. However, it is only in the illustrative stories that the fathers give us that we move from the realm of imagination, personal judgment and reason to see this virtue with the eyes of faith. What we are called to is the perfect humility of Christ; he who sought only to do the will of his heavenly father. Christ sacrifices himself for the sake of love. What we see in the stories is the subtlety with which we focus upon the ego even as we pursue things that are religious. We are presented in particular with a powerful story about Saint Anthony the Great. He is told that a cobbler in the city has reached a level of greater sanctity than he has despite his ascetic rigors. This cobbler saw himself as the least of all the people in the entire city and the most worthy of condemnation and judgment by God. He would tell himself this in the morning and at night. What is significant about this is that he does not compare himself with any other person in acknowledging this truth. Looking at God he can only see his need for mercy and for complete gratitude. Yet Anthony as great as he was and having sacrificed so much still had a question within his heart. Is there anyone out there who has attained a level of greater sanctity? At that moment, Anthony turns his gaze away from God in order to compare himself with others. He loses sight, if only for a moment, of God. To gaze only upon God and his love drives out every element of ego. There is only Christ!
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:08:36 FrDavid Abernethy: page 400 para 76
 
00:09:41 Suzanne: LOL!!!
 
00:41:23 sharonfisher: I hope everyone knows about the Orthodox Christian Prison Ministry. Poor or wayward folks that end up imprisoned could benefit so much from the work these folks do. I feel like the prison cell could be substitute for a monk’s cell or the isolation of the desert fathers. (Not sure where this fits in the discussion, but seems relevant.)
 
00:42:11 sharonfisher: AGREE!
 
00:43:54 Michael Hinckley: St Thomas Moore choose to see his cell in the tower as such I believe.
 
00:46:24 Suzanne: I think that I've actually made myself sick from self-reproach because of my past. Thirty years of extreme desolation has warped my perception of God's love for my soul. Self-reproach can be a form of self-torture. The desert fathers is the first time anything I've come across has given me courage.
 
00:48:00 Lee Graham: Hear, read, mark, learn, and inwardly digest.
 
01:12:13 Sean: Anthony's ego? gosh...he's called Great.
 
01:16:29 Sean: compare and despair
 
01:16:55 Steve Yu: Reacted to "compare and despair" with 👍
 
01:17:29 Maureen Cunningham: How do you not get into a self hate toward you life. did not the church father warn against self pity
 
01:18:46 Suzanne: Did you see the Russian movie, The Island, about the monk who was tortured by guilt, yet worked miracles?
 
01:19:17 Maureen Cunningham: Yes I saw movie wonderful
 
01:19:40 Suzanne: Incredible movie!
 
01:20:04 Nypaver Clan: Father, at the start of this discussion, you mentioned that the slightest turning toward God fills the heart with great Grace.  Likewise, the slightest turning away from God fills the heart with pride.
 
01:22:01 Maureen Cunningham: Thank you  Blessing prayers for you Father
 
01:22:09 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:22:12 Suzanne: Thank you so much!
 
01:22:13 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part IV

Pride destroys the one thing that the spiritual person should desire - the  unfailing light in the eye of the heart. The ascetic life seeks to remove every impediment to our loving God and being faithful to his will. The moment that we are filled with conceit or self-esteem, our souls, despite having the illusion of wealth, come to know the greatest poverty and darkness. What appears beautiful on the outside is often foul and rotting within. Saint John tells us that a “proud monk has no need of a devil, he has become a devil and enemy to himself.” And so for all of us: Pride undermines every virtue and makes us vulnerable to the most cruel of foes. One is exposed to blasphemous thoughts, even at the time of worship. If we are not constantly reproaching ourselves for our sin and acknowledging our poverty before God, then the enemy draws close and begins to play with the mind and the heart by placing suggestions before us. The presence of these thoughts can lead a person into great despair and make them want to give off of prayer and the participation in the holy mysteries. Therefore, John exhorts us to continue praying to the end and not give up the fight even when we feel overcome. Our prayer must become ever more constant until such thoughts cease.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:06 Suzanne: Ave Maria!!!
 
00:11:02 FrDavid Abernethy: 172 para 26
 
00:11:37 Suzanne: Is there a link for the readings?
 
00:24:33 Anthony Rago: This is funny. I grow pomegranates and am not great at knowing when they are ripe. The color can be deceitful to a "newbie."
 
00:26:59 Maureen Cunningham: Sounds like a sport who could be the strongest  but only spiritual
 
00:32:40 Michael Hinckley: happens to me all the time.
 
00:36:02 Maureen Cunningham: I love that movie so true
 
00:41:32 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: 77777777777777777777
 
00:41:37 sharonfisher: I think of Jimmy Carter (not an a political sense) and his acceptance of God to take him when it’s his time. He seems to feel very comfortable with his end.
 
00:42:57 Sr Barbara Jean Mihalchick: This translation says:  The man ensnared by pride will need God's help, since man is of no use to him.
 
00:45:39 Maureen Cunningham: It the opposite of the Holy Family
 
01:04:07 Suzanne: Would kneeling be the Western counterpart to prostrations?
 
01:09:22 David Swiderski: The prostrations are common in Jewish prayer as well. Early Spanish traditions sometimes one lays face first in the form of a cross similar to priest when ordained
 
01:10:13 Suzanne: In the Eastern Catholic Church, do the faithful stand during the Liturgy?
 
01:10:30 Michael Hinckley: you see it at or in TLM parishes at confession
 
01:11:33 Maureen Cunningham: In the Orthodox Church in Hawaii you stand and they touch the floor many times
 
01:11:45 sue and mark: Depending on the Adoration Chapel, you can frequently  see people prostrating themselves
 
01:11:54 Suzanne: Very interesting, thank you!
 
01:12:20 Anonymous Sinner: The touching of the floor is a symbolic reminder that we are dust, and to dust we shall return, and that it is only by the grace of God that do so while praying Alleluia
 
01:12:53 Michael Hinckley: Reacted to "The touching of the ..." with 👍
 
01:13:02 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:13:06 Louise: Thanks, Fr.!
 
01:13:07 David Swiderski: Thank you Father!
 
01:13:10 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!  Thank you!
 
01:13:21 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part VI

Is it possible for us to let go of our private judgment - to let ourselves be led by the Spirit of God into the Truth? As we read the teachings and the stories of the fathers on humility and how this virtue is embodied, the difficulty of letting go of our own perspective on virtue, and what it is must be abandoned. The virtue that we are called to is the virtue of Christ. Once again, we are not called simply to the perfection of natural virtue or what we can attain by human effort. It is by the grace of God alone that we can let go of self-esteem and ego. We will cling to these with fierceness despite having the truth set before our eyes; what we see on the Cross and receive in the Eucharist. We are unwilling to yield the things of this world for that which is eternal - for the pearl of great price.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:17:26 Anonymous Sinner: What page are we on?
 
00:18:20 Nypaver Clan: 397
 
00:18:54 Anonymous Sinner: Thank you!
 
00:19:24 Louise: It reminds me of the Orthodox priest whose life is depicted in the film entitled A Man of God in 2021.
 
00:19:35 Eric Ewanco: Today I was tempted to respond angrily to someone. I needed to hear this today.
 
00:21:21 Susanna Joy: Reacted to "397" with 👍
 
00:23:32 Susanna Joy: Replying to "Today I was tempted ..." 
 
 Lol...me too
 
00:25:36 Louise: Psychologically, forgiveness is seen as letting go of anger. Would you say that it is more than this?
 
00:29:18 Susanna Joy: I came home and a person who has been harrassing and unapologetic was sitting in my kitchen having a happy chat with my dearest friend here in the community. 
I could even get my tea water to boil...trying to let it go...
 
00:29:45 Susanna Joy: *could not even
 
00:30:18 Susanna Joy: Came straight to class
 
00:33:03 Susanna Joy: Thank you, Father.
 
00:35:58 Anonymous Sinner: Likewise the Spirit helps us in our weakness; for we do not know how to pray as we ought, but the Spirit himself intercedes for us with sighs too deep for words. And he who searches the hearts of men knows what is the mind of the Spirit, because the Spirit intercedes for the saints according to the will of God.
 
00:36:05 Anonymous Sinner: Romans 8:26-27
 
00:42:20 sharonfisher: Do you have a good book reference for understanding spiritual warfare? Whether by the Holy Fathers or more current? I have a hard
time really getting the concept.
 
00:43:17 Louise: ''Dominion'' by Fr. Chad Ripperger explains spiritual warfare.
 
00:43:34 Nypaver Clan: Reacted to "''Dominion'' by Fr. ..." with 👍🏼
 
00:44:19 sharonfisher: Replying to "''Dominion'' by Fr. ..."
 
🙂
 
00:44:38 Ashley Kaschl: “Discernment of Spirits” by Fr. Gallagher is good (it’s a purple book) 
 
And 
 
“Spiritual Warfare and The Discernment of Spirits” by Dan Burke
 
Those are good books to start with 🙏
 
00:45:33 Nypaver Clan: Was I the only one who thought the demon would enter the Elder since he said HE was the “goats”?
 
00:46:19 sharonfisher: Reacted to "“Discernment of Spir..." with 😃
 
00:47:18 Anonymous Sinner: I haven't read it, but my friend Paul Thigpen wrote the book "Manual For Spiritual Warfare", which I have heard is good
 
00:48:18 sharonfisher: Reacted to "I haven't read it, b..." with 🙂
 
00:48:52 Suzanne Romano: 😅
 
00:49:10 sharonfisher: Reacted to "😅" with 😂
 
00:57:08 Eric Ewanco: Are we sure he *didn't* commit the sin of fornication, in perhaps the sense of in his heart?
 
01:04:02 Louise: Was this man, by prostrating toward the offender, signifying his surrender to God's will?
 
01:04:38 sharonfisher: One of the reasons I haven’t been doing prostrations in prayer is that the area rug is knobby and hard on my knees. I need to rethink that reasoning . . .
 
01:05:13 linda murton: prostration becomes like the groaning when no words sufficed?
 
01:07:52 linda murton: groaning refered to Abba Siscoes earlier,
 
01:14:57 Susanna Joy: Thank yoiu, Father.🙏🏻
 
01:15:01 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:15:07 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:08 Suzanne Romano: Thank you!
 
01:15:35 Susanna Joy: Spirit will guide you
 
01:15:40 sharonfisher: Tell us about it next time!
 
01:15:41 Susanna Joy: Will be praying
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part III

As we pour through the sayings of Saint John Climacus about pride and overcoming pride, what we see in the Evergetinos and its teaching on humility we see now in the Ladder’s teaching on pride. We are circling around something greater than just an idea. We circle around pride and look at its many facets in order to see how subtle the temptations often are to embrace the illusion that this vice puts before us. The devil will use every means to pull us away from the truth and truthful living. Therefore, Saint John wants us to see every manifestation of the pride in order that we also might apply the remedies that the fathers put before us. What becomes clear is the need for constant vigilance. We must not allow ourselves to lose sight of God and his mercy and grace or our poverty and sin. Everything good comes to us from the hand of God, and there is nothing that we can attribute to ourselves that is enduring. Christ is truth and so we must strive throughout the course of our entire life to avoid all falsehood. We must not succumb to the father of lies and so find ourselves in his grip or being his plaything. May God be our strength and source of invincible peace.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:26:07 sharonfisher: Maybe a dumb question, but I think of deification as something we acquire (gifted) at the end times. Are we to strive for deification in this worldly life?
 
00:28:06 Victor: Some theologians speak of realized & future eschatology (now & future).
 
00:31:20 sharonfisher: Thank you!
 
00:42:18 Ashley Kaschl: Comment for paragraph #19: I think this can be really true if we aren’t discerning. For example, I’ll throw myself under the bus 😂 
 
A priest and I were talking recently about how, before bed, I’ll sometimes get “carried away” by higher, theological thoughts and inspirations. And I’ll be drawn out of rest and end up awake for hours longer than I planned, which obviously makes me tired for the responsibilities the next day. This priest said, “it sounds like a distraction or a temptation.” And I hadn’t thought about that because I didn’t think about these beautiful things or contemplation of deeper truths I didn’t have time for during the day as devils in disguise to keep me from sleep. 
 
So when I tested this, sure enough, they went away when I prayed for deliverance if these seemingly good things were actually temptations/distractions from the great good of getting enough sleep.
 
00:44:40 Art: The sacrifice of the mass is greater than the sacrifice of a martyr.
 
01:06:15 Daniel Allen: It’s kind of like Lot. He had to be dragged out of Sodom by God, and even then when told to flee to the hills he asked to flee instead to a smaller city.
 
01:07:20 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you. Have a good retreat again!🙂
 
01:07:56 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!! 🙏
 
01:07:56 Maureen Cunningham: Thank You Blessing Father keep you in prayer I love the quotes on face book and instagram Thanks
 
01:08:07 sharonfisher: And with your spirit! I so appreciate your ability to bring clarity to the readings!
 
01:08:48 David Swiderski: Thank you father God bless you on the retreat!
 
01:09:03 David Swiderski: Thank you father God bless you on the retreat!
 
01:09:10 David Swiderski: Thank you father God bless you on the retreat!
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part V

We were turn once again to the most important of virtues - humility. Despite the repeated sayings about humility and the many illustrative stories, one does not have a sense of the “same thing” being said over and over again. Rather, humility is like a precious gem. Through the writings and the sayings of the Fathers we revolve around it, allowing the light of Christ to illuminate every facet of this virtue. The Fathers want us to understand that even our virtue must be perfected by the grace of God. It is precisely this reality that we see manifest in the struggles of the Fathers to obtain it. It is so precious that one should be willing, as it were, to sell all to possess it. In this sense, humility is a willingness to let go of the self, the ego, in order that we might keep our minds and our hearts fixed upon Christ. It is by His grace alone that we are saved and it is by imitating His humility that the demons are overcome.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:39:05 Louise: Could you talk about the fear of God versus being in love with God?
 
00:49:39 Louise: Could we say that someone under a spell can be blinded by the spell of the demon so to have pride regarding how one is great in serving the demon without realizing it?
 
01:03:13 Louise: St. John says, "Do not love the world or anything in the world"? St. James seems to take it a step further when he writes, "Anyone who chooses to be a friend of the world becomes an enemy of God." St. John also says, "We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one."
 
01:13:59 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:14:35 Adam Paige: Reacted to "Thank you🙂" with 👍
 
01:14:51 sharonfisher: And with your spirit! Thank you!
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXIII: On Pride, Part II

“An arrogant man yearns for authority; he cannot, or rather, does not wish to perish utterly.“ In many ways, this one saying sums up our reflection this evening. When pride takes hold of an individual soul, one begins to move further and further away from God. Rather than “perish utterly” - that is, die to self and sin - one drives God from the mind and heart. The capacity to love diminishes, the desire to humiliate others increases, and, finally, our perception of reality is distorted beyond measure. It is for this reason that Saint John entitles this step “On Mad Pride“.  The more that we turn away from He who is the Way, the Truth and the Life, the more that we turn away from He who is Meaning, the more we lose touch with reality. We become like the one who fell from heaven, the father of lies. We are drawn into the same darkness and inability to see not only the truth about our souls but also to see the depths of God’s love and compassion.
---
Text of chat during the group:
00:02:44 FrDavid Abernethy: page 170 para number 2
 
00:15:21 TFredman: Have you heard from Ren? How is she doing?
 
00:16:21 Lee Graham: You will be greatly missed next week, you will be in my prayers.
 
00:43:33 David Swiderski: John mentions Gluttony is the prince of passions but also places Pride as a key passion are they both keys of all the passions? Is one more principal.
 
01:05:04 Louise: Therefore, how to understand one's desire to become competent, as competent as can be, to do things right?
 
01:14:05 Louise: So to become competent for Christ, to serve Christ in this world.
 
01:16:27 Victor: Thanks!
 
01:18:02 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father...will be praying...
 
01:18:13 Louise: Thanks, Fr. Abernethy!
 
01:18:13 Jeff O.: Thank you!!
 
01:18:18 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂Have a good retreat
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part IV

How beautiful is the path that the Lord sets before us to draw us to Himself. Its beauty is rooted in the fact that it is the path that He took toward us. God reveals himself, He draws back to the veil, and shows us the depth of his humility, love and compassion. What we find in the desert fathers and in their sayings is a portrait of the gospels; more specifically a portrait of Christ himself - the humble crucified One.
We should never fear humility but rather gravitate towards it. It is something that we should love and cultivate precisely, because we know that it is part of the nature of God and His love, and that it unites us to Him. Whatever truth we acknowledge about ourselves, no matter how dark, it unites us to He who is Truth. This is the pearl of great price! It is the virtue that we should desire above all things and guard and protect as most precious.
 
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Text of chat during the group:
 
00:11:11 sue and mark: car caravan
 
00:12:21 FrDavid Abernethy: page 391 para 31
 
00:28:48 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: 34 reminded me of a statement that often strikes me:
 
00:28:59 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: It was said of Abba Macarius the Great that he became, according
to the writings, a god on earth, because in the way God protects
the world, so Abba Macarius would hide the faults he saw as
though he had not seen them, and the faults he heard about as
though he had not heard of them.
Sayings of the Desert Fathers
 
00:36:59 Maureen Cunningham: Tree in Garden , once they ate they knew and then hid from God.
 
01:06:08 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Listening to this talk of humility, I wonder. I can at times act humbly on the outside, but I don't know what humility feels like. I'm not sure how one acquires humility on the inside, or lives consistently this way. Is becoming humble becoming like God? The only thought that comes to me is to be still and stare at God until He Himself ignites or consumes me. I don't think I know how to be humble
 
01:12:19 sue and mark: thank you Fr. abernethy.
 
01:12:20 Rachel: Thank you!
 
01:12:30 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXII: On Vainglory, Part IV, and On Pride, Part I

Rarely do we acknowledge the extraordinary gift that God gave to his Church in the Desert fathers. It is precisely through their “living martyrdom” - their dying to self, to sin, and to the world, that they are able to guide us through the trials and tribulations of spiritual warfare. Their perception of our vulnerabilities as human beings was very acute. Humbled over and over again and acknowledging their sin and poverty before God, they came to see the many ways that the vices manifest themselves as well as the remedies to bring healing. The spirituality that arises out of desert monasticism is not one among many. It is “the spirituality” of the church. It is a manifestation of the deepest exercise of faith. In this the desert fathers became living icons of the gospel. For this reason, it is often acknowledged that “wherever we see renewal within the life of the church, there are the desert fathers.”  Saint John Climacus draws us into where the fiercest warfare takes place – the human ego. We often seek to place the self at the center of existence and so open ourselves up to the spirit of vainglory and pride. When these take hold of us they close the door to repentance and healing. Furthermore, St. John tells us, they lead to a kind of “madness”. They distort our perception of reality. We can no longer see God or the truth about ourselves. And we see others not as the object of our love and compassion. Rather we become pitiless inquisitors and inhuman judges. Thus, it has often been said that a prideful monk has no need to be attacked by the demons because he has become a demon himself. This is true for all of us.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:05:03 FrDavid Abernethy: page 169 paragraph 40
 
00:25:10 Louise: Could we say that pride usually prevents people to acknowledge that they are under a spell or diabolically influenced, while it is obvious to others given the incongruence of their behaviors?
 
00:37:06 Anthony: It sounds then that the bad things attributed to Vatican 2 is an example of poor formation.
 
00:44:53 Louise: Affirmation ''therapy'' is not psychotherapy, but an obligation from the
psychological boards. Otherwise, a psychologist looses his or her license.
 
00:45:37 Louise: This affirmation therapy applies to transgenderism.
 
00:46:36 sue and mark: louise, interesting.  I had not heard that.  thank you
 
00:48:31 David Swiderski: The book Orthodox Psychotherapy the science of the Fathers is very interesting on thsi subject.
 
01:04:12 David Swiderski: I loved that about Mother Teresa . A penicl in the hand of God. Not the hand not the author of what flowed through her.
 
01:10:07 Michael Hinckley: I always saw San Filippo as a precursor to Padre Pio
 
01:11:09 Anthony: When we crave entertainment like novels or movies - orvevrn news and talk radio - we open the door to the thoughts of others, to tell a story, and often the storytelling and acting makes vices into virtues. Even if it's not overt, the presentation undermines right thinking and behavior and causes future problems.
 
01:11:52 sue and mark: Reacted to "When we crave entert..." with 👍
 
01:12:22 Lee Graham: Reacted to "When we crave entert…" with 👍
 
01:13:07 Lee Graham: Reacted to "I loved that about M…" with ❤️
 
01:22:17 Rachel: That is so true!!
 
01:22:36 Rachel: Haha
 
01:23:39 Rachel: Thank you!
 
01:23:41 David Swiderski: Thank you Father
 
01:23:48 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:23:50 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:23:52 sue and mark: good night.  thank you
 
01:23:53 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father
 
01:23:55 Michael Hinckley: Santa Notte
 
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part III

Synopsis of Tonight’s Group on The Evergetinos:
We often hear the question: “How would you describe the taste of honey to another who has never had it or the taste of a pear or its texture?” We might ask the very same questions about the virtues and in particular that of humility. How do we describe something that another has never tasted or that we have barely tasted ourselves? More importantly, how do we describe something that expresses not natural virtue, but the virtue of Christ himself - that describes the Divine life. 
What is so striking about the desert fathers’ writing is that it brings the gospel alive. It becomes impossible for us to make the words that we hear as flat as the page upon which they are written. Suddenly they become embodied in a rich and powerful way through the lives of the Saints. They beckon us, like Christ, to take hold of what endures, to thirst for the love and virtue that leads us to intimacy with God, and to experience the true joy of the kingdom.
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00:06:43 Paul: Hello
 
00:26:06 Louise: I do not know how to address with humility the fact that a friend has a picture of Moloch on the wall behind her when we talk on Zoom. She has always been fascinated by horror movies. I am worried that she worships the demonic, unconsciously. She says that she does not believe in God and does not know what happens after death, but she believes in the paranormal. She knows my devotion to Jesus Christ. Do you have an idea, Fr. David?
 
01:09:57 Lorraine Green: Thank you!
 
01:10:03 Sheila Applegate: Thanks Father!
 
01:10:05 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:10:29 Alexandra K: Thank you Father!
 
01:10:54 Noha’s iPad: Thanks 🙏
 

The Ladder of Divine Ascent - Chapter XXII: On Vainglory, Part III

One of the prophets writes: “the human heart is a treacherous thing, who can endure it!“ We begin to see the truth of this statement or more accurately the truth that is behind it. The spiritual battle that we engage in with our passions and our thoughts is often dogged by a kind of diabolical intrigue. The devil is relentless and unresting. He can manipulate us in such a way that he makes us desire to put ourselves forward, to put ourselves into the light; convincing us that to do so will draw people to greater faith. 
 
The evil one acts with a kind of patience; he will begin to work on us slowly. He begins by making us enamored with our own natural gifts and abilities. In this way he makes us unfaithful in small things; we attribute natural gifts to ourselves rather than simply being grateful for the things of God has given to us. Such infidelity grows over the course of time as well as the complexity of the evil one’s manipulation. He can begin to work on us from multiple angles, if you will. He can place scripture in our mind to do battle with the temptation of one demon, but then make us feel proud of our ability to do so. 
 
Therefore, St. John tells us that we must begin the road to freedom from vainglory by remaining silent about ourselves and our accomplishments. We must learn to love to be dishonored. To be a Christian in this world is to be mocked and held in contempt. We must set aside our tendency to wear a mask that makes us more acceptable in the eyes of the world. We may put on the appearance of virtue yet always within the limits of what our world finds acceptable.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:24:24 susan: seeing yourself as a debtor is truth
 
00:24:35 Rachel: John 4"34
 
00:30:18 Art: I recently heard in a homily: The Gospel teaches us not to be like the Pharisee who says, ‘thank you God that I’m not like the Publican’. 
But we must be careful that in our heart of hearts we’re not also saying, “Thank you God, I’m not like that Pharisee.”
Vainglory can strike from any side.
 
00:31:02 Rachel: Reacted to "I recently heard i..." with ❤️
 
00:31:42 Eric Ewanco: One method of evangelization is to share from our own experience instead of preaching what one should and should not do, since no one can argue with our experience and it's a more non-threatening way to share
 
00:31:59 Eric Ewanco: How would we evangelize with what you said in mind?
 
00:44:58 Ambrose Little, OP: The text here (#34) specifically speaks of displaying virtues. It’s akin to Christ’s exhortation to not be showy when fasting, or not be showy when giving—do not let the right hand know what the left is doing. I don’t see it speaking against witnessing what God has done for us.
 
00:47:39 Lawrence Martone: Regarding self-revelation, there’s the point that the focus should be on God and not ourselves, when it is expressed.
 
00:50:00 sharonfisher: Purity in motivations.
 
00:51:46 Anthony: There might be another vainglory....to magnify to yourself evil mental motions and temptations and fixate on What have I done? This is also pharisaical.
 
00:53:51 Lawrence Martone: “Our real business is to allow God to shed His light through us, and since the light belongs to Him, He will know where to focus it and to what extent.  Our endeavor should be to make ourselves transparent so as not to eclipse His brilliance.”
                                                                           Erasmo Leiva-Merikais on Matthew 5:14 ff.
 
 
It seems to me that humility, as was mentioned earlier in Step 22, is essential to this endeavor of making ourselves transparent.
 
01:05:17 Cindy Moran: How does what John tells us apply to being a fool for Christ...
 
01:07:09 Cindy Moran: You just answered me.
 
01:07:11 David Swiderski: The Island is a movie from 2006 that demonstrates a fool for christ
 
01:07:25 Rachel: I wonder if this movement towards simplifying is somewhere where we have to be led by our Lord. Since it is an abyss we cant know how to navigate our way through. We can ' think" we know what kinds of dishonor we can profit by but it seems we have to wait to be led by only seeking God's will and what He reveals to us
 
01:10:33 Maureen Cunningham: ThankYou
 
01:10:35 Lorraine Green: Thank you Father!
 
01:10:48 Eric Ewanco: One year anniversary of your appointment!
 
01:11:21 sharonfisher: And with your spirit!
 
01:11:22 Rachel: Thank you
 
01:11:24 Louise: Thank you!
 
01:11:25 Jeff O.: Thank you!
 
01:11:29 Cindy Moran: Thank you Father!!
 
01:11:32 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:11:33 Bonnie Lewis: Thanks be to God!  Thank you Father.
 
01:11:39 sue and mark: Thank you Fr. Abernethy!  God bless
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLV, Part II

Humility is above all the other virtues.” Living in the truth allows for the most important thing to emerge in a person’s life – repentance. When we see and acknowledge the nature of our actions and our thoughts and we bring them before God, it is then that He can heal us and make us whole. 
The struggle to do this, however, can be great. There’s always part of us that wants to hold on to the illusion of creating our own dignity and identity. Humility compels us to acknowledge that all things begin and end with God. We certainly have our role to play in the Divine drama; however, one can have all the virtues and appear to be saintly, yet if they are lacking the virtue of humility, none of these virtues will bear fruit. If an individual is like the publican coming to the temple beating his breast and realizing that there is no virtue in him at all immediately he is justified in the eyes of God. He’s let go of the lie of the Evil One. 
We cannot take for ourselves what belongs to God alone. He is life and love and truth, and it is his mercy that allows us to participate in this reality. To be humble, to see ourselves as nothing of note, cost very little but promises everything in return.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:08:27 FrDavid Abernethy: page 387
 
00:08:31 FrDavid Abernethy: no. 7
 
00:12:07 Jason: Good evening Fr and everyone
 
00:34:42 sharonfisher: But doesn’t opening with “How’s your prayer life?” seem like a pre-judgment that they aren’t attentive enough? “How are you doing?” can be sincere, but also allow individuals to share at their own comfort level. (Not trying to be contrary, but I maintain my own faith and am wary of coming across as holier-than-thou. Sorry, late comment to last segment.)
 
00:36:14 sharonfisher: I see - thank you!
 
01:03:43 alexandramucerino: We cannot forgive we do not first accept the injustice
 
01:05:26 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: Sometimes I'm quick to jump into problem-solving or project management in my life or ministry or others' lives. I'm wondering if the practice of humility would recommend that I stop and ask first, is this where God is working? It seems that I've been noticing God at work in subtle ways in my or others' lives, but not necessarily in what I think is more important or expedient. I'm wondering about humility here.
 
01:15:41 Lorraine Green: Thank you
 
01:15:46 sharonfisher: And to your spirit! Thank you !
 
01:15:50 Fr Marty, ND, 480-292-3381: thank you
 
01:15:52 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂
 
01:15:56 sue and mark: thank you God bless.
 

The Evergetinos - Hypothesis XLIV, Part III and Hypothesis XLV, Part I

Humility often eludes us not only in practice but in our ability to understand it. As always, we have to look to Christ as the standard. What we see revealed in him through the incarnation and in the Paschal mystery opens the door for us to begin to walk this same path. 
Understanding comes through experience. We must be shown what humility is and be made humble through experience. So often the self seeks to place itself at the center of existence; and in our spiritual life we begin to lose sight of God. Even in the pursuit of sanctity, we can fail to see the ways that we are lacking purity of heart. We often do not desire God above all things, or make him the beginning and end of all that we do. We may toil but to no end. 
Having said this, the stories from the fathers begin to reveal to us the distinctive marks of humility in a man. These stories show us why it is not only the most important virtue but also the most powerful. It overcomes all that is demonic. The more we trust solely in the grace of God, the more we abandon ourselves to his mercy and acknowledge the poverty due to our sin, the more his grace transforms us and acts through us and touches the lives of others. Humility and its perfection goes beyond truthful living or acknowledging the truth about ourselves. It is having eyes only for God. It is living in him and for him in every measure.
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Text of chat during the group:
00:06:23 FrDavid Abernethy: page 385 paragraph 6
 
00:06:31 FrDavid Abernethy: page 384 para 6
 
00:25:02 Anthony: Emphasis on kindness....sounds like something St Gabriel of Georgia said.
 
00:38:56 Anthony: Yes
 
00:38:56 Jacqulyn: Yes
 
00:46:31 Louise: Would the Desert Fathers agree or disagree with the following. Hating sins makes us ''relate'' to sins and instills hatred inside of us. I prefer to practice detachment from sins, as much as possible, and feel sorrow at having turned my back to God.
 
00:54:48 Lee Graham: As I forgive someone who hurts me, I see my sin disappear.
 
01:13:17 Rebecca Thérèse: Thank you🙂